Live and let live, what you do in the privacy of your bedroom is your business
Trans Rights
- Thread starter Tecumsehsbones
- Start date
Civil Rights and Non-discrimination and freedom to do what one chooses provided no one else is harmed.
Parental say-so is iffy, it depends if you think kids have rights or don't. IMO kids have rights and parents are there to help guide them, protect them, and all the usual parent stuff, but as a kid grows up if the kid is developing their own individuality - as in if they're gay, trans or whatever - and the parent doesn't like it (mild way of putting it), does the parents beliefs trump the kid's right to be who they are? Hell no.
But there are people who say the kid needs to be a copy/mini-me or follow the words of the parent regardless of how they feel.
RCS doesn't think anyone should have rights if they're different from him.
You were so close.
It's not an "extra" right to be addressed by a pronoun, it's called *respect*. Funny how so many people who bitch and complain about their "rights and respect" being stifled, are also the ones who stomp on the "rights and respect" to others, too.
Unless you are okay with perpetually being misgendered/having the wrong pronoun used when speaking to you, then fine, you can tell trans people all you want they're being overdramatic about it.
But I guarantee that most of society would lose their shit if they were misgendered/mistaken in pronoun, OR most people if they DID make a mistake in that, they'd apologize and correct themselves. Unless they're Trans people, and THAT is just being an outright jerk.
You were so close too.
Trans people exist outside a bedroom too but if you're "live and let live" includes their public time, then great.
First off, I agree, it is a matter or respect. And I usually do use their preferred pronoun (as long as it's not they) after correction. In the case of they, I use their name rather than they because I personally refuse to address a single person as a plural pronoun. However, none of that is a right. And I would not support it added as a right.
Those options are actually sensible, though the whole 'they/them' "plural pronoun" isn't a new thing, just a 'recent' thing.
But yes, none of it is a right.
Pushing it to be a right is stupid, even I'd agree to that.
No, I absolutely think that everyone should have the exact same rights regardless of orientation, preference, or identification.
We call those human rights.
Anything that elevates above the humans usually means getting preferential treatment.
Racist . Someone should wack your pp . How dare you not elevate degenerates to their proper place in society .
I agree, historically, same for the Indigenous, the inner city kids, the Irish, the Gays, Pantomimes, the Hispanics, the French, the Metis, the Gingers, etc.
Human rights for everyone! But no special treatment.
You believe what you want, and I will believe what I want, and Hey, Sugar, take a walk on the wild side.
That's what I'd say for trans people. The Civil Rights Acts. No discrimination permitted in employment, education, housing, or places of public accommodation.
I would make one change to the CRAs. I'd make violating them criminal offenses. That way the power and money of the state would come down against discrimination. As it is now, the victim of the discrimination has to sue civilly. That can be kinda hard when you don't have a job because of discrimination.
If someone wants to identify as something else, sure whatever. I couldn't give two shakes of a turd bucket. But don't expect me to play along.
What I mean by that is if someone is going to sit there and tell me they identify as a damn Narwhal and flop around acting like one, I ain't got time for that goofy ass shit. I'm taking a walk.
I'm a tolerant person, certainly more than most, despite the above sounding like I am not. I'm tolerant, but I'm getting old and too damn tired to keep up with the newest cockatoo thing that pops up. If someone tells me to refer to them as a He, She, They, Them, This, That, Who, What, Where, Why, It, whatever.... Nah. Na na nah, No. Piss off. I ain't dancing around on eggshells from person to person and I don't identify as a fk'n dog to be trained for others personal satisfaction of entertaining their social power trips.
What is your name? Give me your damn name. I'll refer to you by that.. If you're going to get offended by me referring to you by your own name, then Hoo Nelly, you got some crap between the ears to sort out.
As for trans people, I got an old college friend who is and did the whole transition thing several years back. I don't give a crap. I refer to them by their current name because that's what they go by. I knew a J.D. and a T.J. and a B.J. Over the years. That's not their official names but that what they went by. Someone could be called Richard but goes by Dick. People who moved to Australia from places like China and India have names they were born with but will go by James, John, and other similar names because it's easier for Aussies to understand and pronounce. A name is a name. Whatever makes it easy, I don't care.
So if someone was born a male but truly feels they are a female? I'm not in their shoes nor will I pretend I understand what that's all about, so I'll do my best to refer to them by their preferred gender. But if I Fk it up from time to time, it's not meant as an offense. It's a response engrained into my 40+ year old brain by things taught to me decades ago. Force of habit and all that. Which is why I tend to lean towards just going by someone's name. It's just easier for everyone.
What about Trans and bathrooms? I don't care. Straight women can come right into the male restrooms while I'm taking a shit and listen to my ass in all its flubbering glory and stink. If I'm at a urinal taking a leak, hey, if you catch a glance, that's your problem, not mine. Trans are no different. Go in, do your business, get out. I don't go to the toilets for a damn social interaction and other people releasing their bowel toxins are none of my concern. I'm not there checking out who's who and what's what.
I treat every human being the exact same way. I don't care about your gender, your race, your orientation, your religion, political beliefs, nothing. Everyone is equal. I don't know any of your genders, your races or what you look like, yet here I am discussing stuff with everyone else in equal fashion because it doesn't matter.
Everyone I first meet in life is at 50%. 100% is me liking someone a lot. 0% is me hating someone's guts and hope they die. The moment someone opens their mouth or does something, that determines whether that 50% goes up or down. It's what you say and do that makes you who you are to others.
Make me jump through hoops just to talk to you without getting offended? We'll soon be heading towards 40% & lower.
So what Trans rights should Trans people have? Nothing more or less than the next person on the planet. Nobody is more special than anyone else.
Except me. I'm Sean Connery levels of awesome.
What I mean by that is if someone is going to sit there and tell me they identify as a damn Narwhal and flop around acting like one, I ain't got time for that goofy ass shit. I'm taking a walk.
I'm a tolerant person, certainly more than most, despite the above sounding like I am not. I'm tolerant, but I'm getting old and too damn tired to keep up with the newest cockatoo thing that pops up. If someone tells me to refer to them as a He, She, They, Them, This, That, Who, What, Where, Why, It, whatever.... Nah. Na na nah, No. Piss off. I ain't dancing around on eggshells from person to person and I don't identify as a fk'n dog to be trained for others personal satisfaction of entertaining their social power trips.
What is your name? Give me your damn name. I'll refer to you by that.. If you're going to get offended by me referring to you by your own name, then Hoo Nelly, you got some crap between the ears to sort out.
As for trans people, I got an old college friend who is and did the whole transition thing several years back. I don't give a crap. I refer to them by their current name because that's what they go by. I knew a J.D. and a T.J. and a B.J. Over the years. That's not their official names but that what they went by. Someone could be called Richard but goes by Dick. People who moved to Australia from places like China and India have names they were born with but will go by James, John, and other similar names because it's easier for Aussies to understand and pronounce. A name is a name. Whatever makes it easy, I don't care.
So if someone was born a male but truly feels they are a female? I'm not in their shoes nor will I pretend I understand what that's all about, so I'll do my best to refer to them by their preferred gender. But if I Fk it up from time to time, it's not meant as an offense. It's a response engrained into my 40+ year old brain by things taught to me decades ago. Force of habit and all that. Which is why I tend to lean towards just going by someone's name. It's just easier for everyone.
What about Trans and bathrooms? I don't care. Straight women can come right into the male restrooms while I'm taking a shit and listen to my ass in all its flubbering glory and stink. If I'm at a urinal taking a leak, hey, if you catch a glance, that's your problem, not mine. Trans are no different. Go in, do your business, get out. I don't go to the toilets for a damn social interaction and other people releasing their bowel toxins are none of my concern. I'm not there checking out who's who and what's what.
I treat every human being the exact same way. I don't care about your gender, your race, your orientation, your religion, political beliefs, nothing. Everyone is equal. I don't know any of your genders, your races or what you look like, yet here I am discussing stuff with everyone else in equal fashion because it doesn't matter.
Everyone I first meet in life is at 50%. 100% is me liking someone a lot. 0% is me hating someone's guts and hope they die. The moment someone opens their mouth or does something, that determines whether that 50% goes up or down. It's what you say and do that makes you who you are to others.
Make me jump through hoops just to talk to you without getting offended? We'll soon be heading towards 40% & lower.
So what Trans rights should Trans people have? Nothing more or less than the next person on the planet. Nobody is more special than anyone else.
Except me. I'm Sean Connery levels of awesome.
But…but that’s just…what an adult would do Praxius, so your comment might not fit into this conversation.
You’re a busy person, as are we all, and somebody else’s baggage is secondary to shit that needs to get done, but that doesn’t mean they can’t be respected for human decency, etc…as you’ve laid out.
(By the way, my pronouns are “Captain” & “Doctor” just for the sake of this thread alone and have no basis in reality outside of this thread)
You’re a busy person, as are we all, and somebody else’s baggage is secondary to shit that needs to get done, but that doesn’t mean they can’t be respected for human decency, etc…as you’ve laid out.
(By the way, my pronouns are “Captain” & “Doctor” just for the sake of this thread alone and have no basis in reality outside of this thread)
Wow, you've got your girlie bits in a bind.
If you ask a person their name, they give it, and you refer to them by it, then there's no issue. What the issue is, for trans people, is people who decide "No, your name isn't that, it's this" and "this" is the name they used to go by before their transition.
Kind'a like someone calling you Bob when your name was Robert; you don't go by Bob, but the other person decided to call you Bob anyway. And you would be AMAZED how many people do get pissed by things like that. I get it a lot registering people to see the emerg Doctor.
Same goes with pronoun use; if someone says that they go by whatever pronoun, it's only respectful to go by that, because you don't know what it should be. Some people care, some don't. And if a person is, say, gender fluid, ace, nonbinary or whatever, they may not have a specific gender, hence the 'they/them'.
That said yeah, when it starts going into xe/xer it's annoying as shit, but whatever, why does it matter?
Just be respectful.
And more people really should do that. If it's an honest mistake - and even I've misgendered a trans person before so it's damned easy, especially if they're in early transition - usually trans people are pretty lenient about it. It's the assholes who misgender on purpose and continually even after asked not to, that are the issue. And frustration.
Again, more people should be like that.
Depends what you mean by jumping through hoops: if it's honest mistakes that when corrected you respect, there shouldn't be issues.
That said, give the trans person a bit of a break because you don't know the last time they encountered someone who 'made a mistake', only that person DIDN'T take it well and got all butthurt, caused issues or maybe even beat the shit out of the person. A trans person getting pissed at mistakes likely is reacting out of a trauma response.
Keep that in mind and you'll be fine.
And yet people don't get that's all that trans people are asking for.
They're asking for the right NOT to be abused.
They're asking for the right NOT to get beat up just because they're trans women in a dress.
They're asking NOT to be kicked out of a place because someone thinks they're a man, when they're not, or a woman, when they're not (though the latter happens less frequently).
They're asking NOT to be fired because they're trans.
They're asking NOT to have housing denied to them for being trans (yes, that is happening).
They're asking just for the right to fucking exist, which people want to deny them (calling for their annihilation, conversion therapy, denial, repression; all that pushes trans people to not exist).
Except me. I'm Sean Connery levels of awesome.
Nah dude.
The Peacock himself.
There can be only one.