No Other Way

[Motar]

Of course no. Only the delusional who think they are special, above everybody else.

"To some who were confident of their own righteousness and looked down on everyone else, Jesus told this parable: 'Two men went up to the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the
other a tax collector. The Pharisee stood by himself and prayed: ‘God, I thank you that I am not like other people—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week and give a tenth of all I get.’ But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, ‘God, have mercy on me, a sinner.’ I tell you that this man, rather than the other, went home justified before God. For all those who exalt themselves will be humbled, and those who humble themselves will be exalted.” (Luke 18:9-14 NIV)

 

[Motar]

In the gospel recorded by the apostle John and in the 3rd chapter, the musts are revealed:
1) "You must be born again" (v7)
2) "the Son of Man must be lifted up" (v14)
3) "He must become greater; I must become less." (v30)

The conclusion of the matter:

"Jesus performed many other signs in the presence of his disciples, which are not recorded in this book. But these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Messiah, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name." (John 20:30-31 NIV)

 

[cj44]

Of course no. Only the delusional who think they are special, above everybody else.

It's been quite some time since I visited the forum. I see everyone is still getting along swimmingly. Methinks we MUST be born again because…
Alert: Scripture Quote Forthcoming. As I recall, some on the forum recoil at the sight of Scripture verse. Nonetheless…
Romans 3:9No One Is Righteous
9 What shall we conclude then? Do we have any advantage? Not at all! For we have already made the charge that Jews and Gentiles alike are all under the power of sin.

Perhaps, we all agree that we all do not always act as Jesus would. Maybe that is why he stressed that we MUST be born again. Yes, and even after one is born again one can still act like a pompous jerk.
Merry Christmas, Season's Greetings and Happy Holidays to all.

 

[Ludlow]

It's been quite some time since I visited the forum. I see everyone is still getting along swimmingly. Methinks we MUST be born again because…
Alert: Scripture Quote Forthcoming. As I recall, some on the forum recoil at the sight of Scripture verse. Nonetheless…
Romans 3:9No One Is Righteous
9 What shall we conclude then? Do we have any advantage? Not at all! For we have already made the charge that Jews and Gentiles alike are all under the power of sin.

Perhaps, we all agree that we all do not always act as Jesus would. Maybe that is why he stressed that we MUST be born again. Yes, and even after one is born again one can still act like a pompous jerk.
Merry Christmas, Season's Greetings and Happy Holidays to all.

Could it be possible that there might be another perspective on this " born again " statement?

 

[cj44]

Could it be possible that there might be another perspective on this " born again " statement?

Indeed! Expand on that Perspective Ludlow.

 

[Motar]

Could it be possible that there might be another perspective on this " born again " statement?

"You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You must be born again." (John 3:7 NIV)

 

[Dexter Sinister]

Neither should you be surprised when someone rejects that claim as meaningless.

 

[Ludlow]

Neither should you be surprised when someone rejects that claim as meaningless.

It's meaningless to you. Not meaningless to her.

 

[Motar]

Neither should you be surprised when someone rejects that claim as meaningless.

Your avatar says otherwise, DS. Have you not re-invented yourself as "Dexter Sinister"? Seems you are seeking a new life.

 

[Dexter Sinister]

Your avatar says otherwise, DS. Have you not re-invented yourself as "Dexter Sinister"? Seems you are seeking a new life.

A remarkably self-serving interpretation based on no real understanding at all. The idea underlying my avatar comes from the subtitle of one of Carl Sagan's books, The Demon-Haunted World, "Science As A Candle In The Dark." Dexter Sinister is just the name I use here and elsewhere to preserve my anonymity. There are enough whackos online to make that necessary--would you want an aggressively ignorant and judgmental person like selfsame to be able to find you?-- but the ideas, beliefs, and values I express here are the same ones I express in real life, this is really me. I'm seeking many things, but a new life isn't among them and even if it were, I wouldn't be looking for it here.

 

[Danbones]

you have to die and be reborn to have eternal life

anybody else not see the "wtf?" in that?

 

[Corduroy]

3) "He must become greater; I must become less." (v30)

It's a zero sum game is it? Follow me and I will make us all greater. MAGA

 

[Motar]

you have to die and be reborn to have eternal life

anybody else not see the "wtf?" in that?

As an adult, DB, you are experienced with this concept of repentance.

Repentance = to turn (or return) from something to something; a renouncing to acquire

To lay hold of adulthood, we forego childhood. To experience marriage, we abandon single life. To become parents, we give up childlessness. Life is a series of losses towards gains.

A remarkably self-serving interpretation based on no real understanding at all.

Repentance means that we must abandon the low road of ad hominems to access the high road of love, DS.

 

[Cliffy]

To be born again means to become as a child, full of wonder; to see the world through new, innocent eyes. It has nothing to do with religion, the bible or Jesus. We are born into a world that brainwashes us from birth to conform to social sameness, to see the world as we are told it is, not how it is. To be born again, one must step outside the box of social, political and religious conformity, to discover who and what we really are, not who we were told we had to be.
The spiritual journey is one of self discovery. The religious experience is a complete abandonment of our personal responsibility toward life, the Earth and our creator. Jesus said that once we realize who we really are, we would be able to do far more than he has done or we could imagine. That can only be accomplished by stepping away from belief systems and trusting in the innate benevolence of the Life/Universe. Faith has nothing to do with what you believe and everything to do with an open mind and heart. Faith is trust. If you want to know, go to the Source. Hint: The Source will never be found in books or at the feet of a teacher/guru. They may equip you with tools for the journey, but the journey does not begin until you walk away; take you first step on your journey. Following teachings/books/belief systems is to lock yourself in a box; to die spiritually.

 

[Dexter Sinister]

Repentance means that we must abandon the low road of ad hominems to access the high road of love, DS.

That wasn't an ad hominem, it was my opinion of a judgment you offered of me, not my opinion of you.

 

[Ludlow]

To be born again means to become as a child, full of wonder; to see the world through new, innocent eyes. It has nothing to do with religion, the bible or Jesus. We are born into a world that brainwashes us from birth to conform to social sameness, to see the world as we are told it is, not how it is. To be born again, one must step outside the box of social, political and religious conformity, to discover who and what we really are, not who we were told we had to be.
The spiritual journey is one of self discovery. The religious experience is a complete abandonment of our personal responsibility toward life, the Earth and our creator. Jesus said that once we realize who we really are, we would be able to do far more than he has done or we could imagine. That can only be accomplished by stepping away from belief systems and trusting in the innate benevolence of the Life/Universe. Faith has nothing to do with what you believe and everything to do with an open mind and heart. Faith is trust. If you want to know, go to the Source. Hint: The Source will never be found in books or at the feet of a teacher/guru. They may equip you with tools for the journey, but the journey does not begin until you walk away; take you first step on your journey. Following teachings/books/belief systems is to lock yourself in a box; to die spiritually.

What would Buddah say about being born again Cliffy ?

 

[Cliffy]

What would Buddah say about being born again Cliffy ?

How would I know. I don't know the dude. I am somewhat familiar with Zen, though. I really don't think any of the masters wanted to start a religion. In fact. I believe Jesus was completely against religion. It was Paul who screwed the whole thing up by starting a religion about Jesus. Most Christians don't have any idea what Jesus taught.

 

[Tecumsehsbones]

The other day I was walking in DC when a homeless guy asked if I could spare a dollar. I said "Tell you what, you can have half of whatever I got." Dug out my wallet, turned out I had $232 on me. So homeless guy got 120 (I gave him the extra 20). Didn't have to set up a worldwide pedophile ring to do it, didn't have to burn any women to death, murder babies and throw their bodies in the septic tank, or torture any little Indian kids.

Didn't have to praise Jeebus neither. Just seemed fair at the moment. I think St. Martin of Tours would agree.

 

[Corduroy]

Yeah, but you're still going to hell.

 

[Tecumsehsbones]

Yeah, but you're still going to hell.

I'll save you a place by the fire. Should be a pretty nice place what with all the self-righteous child rapists in Heaven.