TWU law school snub

[BornRuff]

It is exactly on point. If the law society was penalizing this school regarding their teachings in law I could understand, but they are targeting them specifically because they are a religious school who has asked their students to observe the religious doctrine. I know that's hard to understand, but if you think about it, it really isn't.

Again, that is simply wrong. It is not because they are religious, it is because the policy is discriminatory.

There is a huge amount of disparity between what different people think the bible says they should do. Saying something is a religious belief is not a blanket get out of jail free card.

This has nothing to do with their (TWU) curriculum and everything to do with discrimination. You can't have it both ways. You can't tell one group its okay to do this and another its not. This is a free country and whether some like it or not we aren't all going to march to the same tune.

That is exactly what you guys are saying right now. You say it is ok for TWU to discriminate in admissions based on their beliefs, but it is not ok for the law society to discriminate in admissions based on their beliefs of how a law school should operate.

Just because TWU thinks what they are doing is ok doesn't mean everyone else has to agree and endorse them.

Some people have religious beliefs and want to be educated in a school like this. Sh!t, some people home school and that is bloody recognized as long as you pass your damned exams.

I'm not even religious and I get that.

You must also get that there is no home school option for law school.

There are options to be educated in a religious environment, but there are standards that these paths need to meet. Obviously as you get more advanced and specialized, the standards need to be tighter.

 

[petros]

Read up BumFluff...https://twu.ca/studenthandbook/university-policies/student-accountability-process.html

 

[BornRuff]

In case the amazingly thick for being one ply BumFluff can't find it.....

Once a commitment has been indicated through signature, failure to respect the Community Covenant is a breach of personal integrity, a matter which may, in some cases, be of greater concern than the violation itself.

You have not provided any sort of clear answer. Are you allowed to attend the school if you don't sign it?

You can at very least be fined for breaking the covenant https://twu.ca/studenthandbook/living-in-community/fines.html

There is also this:
" If a student, in the opinion of the University, is unable, refuses or fails to live up to their commitment, the University reserves the right to discipline, dismiss, or refuse a student’s re-admission to the University."

https://twu.ca/studenthandbook/university-policies/student-accountability-process.html

Read up BumFluff...https://twu.ca/studenthandbook/university-policies/student-accountability-process.html

So we are on the same page. You are categorically wrong in stating that nothing happens if they violate the covenant. They can be disciplined in many ways, up to and including being banned from the university.

 

[petros]

Yup. Which would be for drugs,alcohol,violence,destruction of school property etc etc etc. If they punted somebody for getting laid they'd be in front of a judge before you can say "holy sh-t" and wouldn't be a university any longer.


Use your head.

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

Again, that is simply wrong. It is not because they are religious, it is because the policy is discriminatory.

There is a huge amount of disparity between what different people think the bible says they should do. Saying something is a religious belief is not a blanket get out of jail free card.

Get out of Jail Free Card. It's a school not a Jail.

That is exactly what you guys are saying right now. You say it is ok for TWU to discriminate in admissions based on their beliefs, but it is not ok for the law society to discriminate in admissions based on their beliefs of how a law school should operate.

Who have they discriminated against.
This is a stupid argument. What your saying that if you want to practice law you can't go to a religious school. That is extremely discriminatory.

Just because TWU thinks what they are doing is ok doesn't mean everyone else has to agree and endorse them.

Nope, they go to another school. Maybe an AFRO-CENTRIC SCHOOL.

You must also get that there is no home school option for law school.

Of course, an I'm not a fan, but some folks think its great.

There are options to be educated in a religious environment, but there are standards that these paths need to meet. Obviously as you get more advanced and specialized, the standards need to be tighter.

This is simply a first shot across the bow by special interest. It's highly discriminatory.

BTW I've been on the other side of this argument in another thread about the Transexual who want to attend a Christian School. No one has been told they can't attend this school, but then if I were planning oin attending a college I would, like most students seeking higher education, attend a school that was the right fit for me. Not waste my education by trying to eradicate one that wasn't.

 

[BornRuff]

Yup. Which would be for drugs,alcohol,violence,destruction of school property etc etc etc. If they punted somebody for getting laid they'd be in front of a judge before you can say "holy sh-t" and wouldn't be a university any longer.


Use your head.

You can't just edit the policies yourself. If that is how they want the policies to be enforced, they should put it in writing and then everyone will be happy.

The situation they are in right now is explicitly because they have these rules on the books.

 

[petros]

Why did you skip this part? The things they can do without having the Charter crammed up their asses.

If a student fails to maintain his or her commitment to the Community Covenant and/or policies and guidelines of the University as outlined in the Student Handbook, Academic Calendar and TWU website, an accountability process exists that is structured around the goal of bringing the student back into relationship with the community while contributing to the student’s personal and spiritual growth. Initial and/or minor violations may be dealt with through a discussion process facilitated by Student Life staff. Subsequent and/or more serious breaches of the Community Covenant may be dealt with in a formal process overseen by the Director of Community Life or Associate Provost. Such cases may be referred to a Community Council or the University’s Accountability Committee, consisting of faculty, staff and students, for resolution.

 

[gerryh]

I KNOW, not one of you has read the Community covenant. No where does it mention homosexuality.

 

[petros]

I KNOW, not one of you has read the Community covenant. No where does it mention homosexuality.

I've read it.

 

[gerryh]

I've read it.

and you would be the only one here that has besides myself. Amazing how sheep are quick to condemn on the word of someone they have never met.

 

[petros]

It's implied but not directly stated.

It's why I posted the link.

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

I KNOW, not one of you has read the Community covenant. No where does it mention homosexuality.

I know that, I believe FIVEPARADOX brought it up.

 

[petros]

I think it was the NationalPost who came up with that.

 

[FiveParadox]

I did indeed.

The covenant that you sign is very broad. The General University Policies -- under the Responsibilities of Membership statement -- articulates how to interpret the covenant and sets out, in particular, that homosexual behaviour is unacceptable at Trinity Western University, and requires students to agree not to exhibit homosexual behaviour. The selective reading in this thread is just sensational.

 

[petros]

I did indeed.

The covenant that you sign is very broad. The General University Policies -- under the Responsibilities of Membership statement -- articulates how to interpret the covenant and sets out, in particular, that homosexual behaviour is unacceptable at Trinity Western University, and requires students to agree not to exhibit homosexual behaviour. The selective reading in this thread is just sensational.

No you didn't.

 

[BornRuff]

Get out of Jail Free Card. It's a school not a Jail.

Lol, so you are avoiding the point then? Just because someone claims something is based in religious belief doesn't mean you can't think critically about it.

Parts of the bible support slavery, rape, and human sacrifice. If someone is doing any of these things and claims it is their religious belief, is nobody allowed to question it?

Who have they discriminated against.
This is a stupid argument. What your saying that if you want to practice law you can't go to a religious school. That is extremely discriminatory.

Lol, no. Again, no part of the denial was about them being religious. It was about specific policies that are discriminatory.

The NS law society has explicitly said they will accredit them if they remove the policies about homosexuality, so clearly being religious in general is not the problem.

Nope, they go to another school. Maybe an AFRO-CENTRIC SCHOOL.

Where is this afro-centric law school you speak of?

Of course, an I'm not a fan, but some folks think its great.

So you are on the record as not being a fan of this fictitious home law school program?

This is simply a first shot across the bow by special interest. It's highly discriminatory.

No, it is a specific issue with a specific problem. Look at the NS Law Society. TWU will be accredited by them as soon as they remove their homophobic policies.

BTW I've been on the other side of this argument in another thread about the Transexual who want to attend a Christian School. No one has been told they can't attend this school, but then if I were planning oin attending a college I would, like most students seeking higher education, attend a school that was the right fit for me. Not waste my education by trying to eradicate one that wasn't.

When the law societies accredit a school, they are implicitly endorsing the schools and telling people to go to those schools if they want to be a lawyer. Why do you feel ok forcing the law societies to endorse something they deeply disagree with?

 

[FiveParadox]

No you didn't.

I absolutely have called out the anti-gay aspect of the covenant... Didn't say I was the only one.

 

[petros]

I absolutely have called out the anti-gay aspect of the covenant... Didn't say I was the only one.

Point it out word for word. Here is the Covenant: https://twu.ca/studenthandbook/twu-community-covenant-agreement.pdf

 

[BornRuff]

Why did you skip this part? The things they can do without having the Charter crammed up their asses.

If a student fails to maintain his or her commitment to the Community Covenant and/or policies and guidelines of the University as outlined in the Student Handbook, Academic Calendar and TWU website, an accountability process exists that is structured around the goal of bringing the student back into relationship with the community while contributing to the student’s personal and spiritual growth. Initial and/or minor violations may be dealt with through a discussion process facilitated by Student Life staff. Subsequent and/or more serious breaches of the Community Covenant may be dealt with in a formal process overseen by the Director of Community Life or Associate Provost. Such cases may be referred to a Community Council or the University’s Accountability Committee, consisting of faculty, staff and students, for resolution.

I read that part, the fact that they have other options doesn't change the fact that the rules clearly state that they can expel and ban you from the university for breaking the covenant.

 

[PoliticalNick]

So we are on the same page. You are categorically wrong in stating that nothing happens if they violate the covenant. They can be disciplined in many ways, up to and including being banned from the university.

This argument fails miserably!

This is not any different than the policies of any other school. When you choose a school you agree to whatever code of conduct they may have and are liable to punitive action if you breech any part of that agreement.