Scientists monitor huge iceberg that broke off from Antarctica

[mentalfloss]

Waiting for ages for you to notice that.

It's well known that sea ice extent in the Antarctic has been increasing in the same timeframe and you should have picked up on that.

Unfortunately, that's only sea ice whereas most of the ice there (which is land ice) has been decreasing.

Is Antarctica losing or gaining ice?

 

[petros]

Good try. However, the real shame is MF has misunderstood the 3 letters at the beginning of Antarctica, he/she thinks we are posting about the Arctic.

SH and NH have seperate climate driving systems.

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

 

[mentalfloss]

I tried to tell him but he insists that this is some socialist plot.

 

[petros]

Waiting for ages for you to notice that.

It's well known that sea ice extent in the Antarctic has been increasing in the same timeframe and you should have picked up on that.

Unfortunately, that's only sea ice whereas most of the ice there (which is land ice) has been decreasing.

Is Antarctica losing or gaining ice?

Mass is mass. If the oceans were warmer then maybe the poles would get more snowto turn into glacial ice.

Keep in mind it's early autumn there which makes It's their turn to have their magnetosphere pummeled into driving Antarctic lows (aka polar vortices) northward sucking the rain giving ocean surface moisture from making it's way to northern latitude continental mass like the Aussies and Chile and Argentina and South Africa.

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

I tried to tell him but he insists that this is some socialist plot.

I don't know who posted that thread about the northwest passage being Ice Free by 2013. Do you?

Arctic summers ice-free 'by 2013'


By Jonathan Amos
Science reporter, BBC News, San Francisco

Arctic summer melting in 2007 set new records

More details

Scientists in the US have presented one of the most dramatic forecasts yet for the disappearance of Arctic sea ice.
Their latest modelling studies indicate northern polar waters could be ice-free in summers within just 5-6 years.
Professor Wieslaw Maslowski told an American Geophysical Union meeting that previous projections had underestimated the processes now driving ice loss.
Summer melting this year reduced the ice cover to 4.13 million sq km, the smallest ever extent in modern times.
Remarkably, this stunning low point was not even incorporated into the model runs of Professor Maslowski and his team, which used data sets from 1979 to 2004 to constrain their future projections.

In the end, it will just melt away quite suddenly

Professor Peter Wadhams

"Our projection of 2013 for the removal of ice in summer is not accounting for the last two minima, in 2005 and 2007," the researcher from the Naval Postgraduate School, Monterey, California, explained to the BBC. "So given that fact, you can argue that may be our projection of 2013 is already too conservative

 

[petros]

Me???

Good thing ice is at the interglacial mean or I'd be worried

 

[mentalfloss]

Yea, a couple of American scientists made that off hand prediction but it was exaggerated by the media and doesn't represent the official forecast by the IPCC of 60% loss by 2050.

That's the arctic region for those who can't keep up.

For the Antarctic, you need to differentiate between land ice and sea ice.

 

[petros]

Yea, a couple of American scientists made that off hand prediction but it was exaggerated by the media and doesn't represent the official forecast by the IPCC of 60% loss by 2050.

Now we have to wait until we're dead to find out?

When are the oceans going to warm enough to make it snow on our polar deserts?

BTW glaciation is to be looked at by regional climates according to IPCC. It's true look it up.

 

[mentalfloss]

Now we have to wait until we're dead to find out?

When are the oceans going to warm enough to make it snow on our polar deserts?

Learn:


Antarctic sea ice has shown long term growth since satellites began measurements in 1979. This is an observation that has been often cited as proof against global warming. However, rarely is the question raised: why is Antarctic sea ice increasing? The implicit assumption is it must be cooling around Antarctica. This is decidedly not the case. In fact, the Southern Ocean has been warming faster than the rest of the world's oceans. Globally from 1955 to 1995, oceans have been warming at 0.1°C per decade. In contrast, the Southern Ocean has been warming at 0.17°C per decade. Not only is the Southern Ocean warming, it is warming faster than the global trend.

If the Southern Ocean is warming, why is Antarctic sea ice increasing? There are several contributing factors. One is the drop in ozone levels over Antarctica. The hole in the ozone layer above the South Pole has caused cooling in the stratosphere (Gillet 2003). This strengthens the cyclonic winds that circle the Antarctic continent (Thompson 2002). The wind pushes sea ice around, creating areas of open water known as polynyas. More polynyas lead to increased sea ice production (Turner 2009).

Another contributor is changes in ocean circulation. The Southern Ocean consists of a layer of cold water near the surface and a layer of warmer water below. Water from the warmer layer rises up to the surface, melting sea ice. However, as air temperatures warm, the amount of rain and snowfall also increases. This freshens the surface waters, leading to a surface layer less dense than the saltier, warmer water below. The layers become more stratified and mix less. Less heat is transported upwards from the deeper, warmer layer. Hence less sea ice is melted (Zhang 2007).

Is Antarctica losing or gaining ice?

 

[petros]

LEARN!!!!

Box 6.2: What Caused the Low Atmospheric Carbon Dioxide Concentrations During Glacial Times?
Ice core records show that atmospheric CO2 varied in the range of 180 to 300 ppm over the glacial-interglacial cycles of the last 650 kyr (Figure 6.3; Petit et al., 1999; Siegenthaler et al., 2005a). The quantitative and mechanistic explanation of these CO2 variations remains one of the major unsolved questions in climate research.

That is from the IPCC.

If you don't know the past can you prognosticate the future?

A link for the dink. https://www.ipcc.ch/publications_and_data/ar4/wg1/en/ch6s6-4.html

Did they miss that day in class in grade 5¿

 

[mentalfloss]

I learned that you are assuming just because a specific property couldn't be explained in the past, that it determines how capable we are of explaining that same property in the present and any future prediction is therefore, without merit.

It should be obvious that part of the problem is that we weren't there to observe all of the surrounding conditions.

 

[Walter]

Learn:


Antarctic sea ice has shown long term growth since satellites began measurements in 1979. This is an observation that has been often cited as proof against global warming. However, rarely is the question raised: why is Antarctic sea ice increasing? The implicit assumption is it must be cooling around Antarctica. This is decidedly not the case. In fact, the Southern Ocean has been warming faster than the rest of the world's oceans. Globally from 1955 to 1995, oceans have been warming at 0.1°C per decade. In contrast, the Southern Ocean has been warming at 0.17°C per decade. Not only is the Southern Ocean warming, it is warming faster than the global trend.

If the Southern Ocean is warming, why is Antarctic sea ice increasing? There are several contributing factors. One is the drop in ozone levels over Antarctica. The hole in the ozone layer above the South Pole has caused cooling in the stratosphere (Gillet 2003). This strengthens the cyclonic winds that circle the Antarctic continent (Thompson 2002). The wind pushes sea ice around, creating areas of open water known as polynyas. More polynyas lead to increased sea ice production (Turner 2009).

Another contributor is changes in ocean circulation. The Southern Ocean consists of a layer of cold water near the surface and a layer of warmer water below. Water from the warmer layer rises up to the surface, melting sea ice. However, as air temperatures warm, the amount of rain and snowfall also increases. This freshens the surface waters, leading to a surface layer less dense than the saltier, warmer water below. The layers become more stratified and mix less. Less heat is transported upwards from the deeper, warmer layer. Hence less sea ice is melted (Zhang 2007).

Is Antarctica losing or gaining ice?

I've noticed that here, too; when there is more ice on the water, because it's bloody cold, there is less ice on the land. And when it's colder it's warmer.

 

[Retired_Can_Soldier]

When environmentalism became an extremist religion I sort of lost faith in its disciples.

 

[Tecumsehsbones]

When environmentalism became an extremist religion I sort of lost faith in its disciples.

Of course, assuming that all environmentalists are extremists is kinda like assuming all Muslims are suicide bombers or all Christians want to murder abortion doctors.

But you knew that.

 

[petros]

I learned that you are assuming just because a specific property couldn't be explained in the past, that it determines how capable we are of explaining that same property in the present and any future prediction is therefore, without merit.

It should be obvious that part of the problem is that we weren't there to observe all of the surrounding conditions.

You just killed the AGHG theory. WTG!!!

When environmentalism became an extremist religion I sort of lost faith in its disciples.

This is Jonestown grade brainwashing.

 

[Tonington]

I've noticed that here, too; when there is more ice on the water, because it's bloody cold, there is less ice on the land. And when it's colder it's warmer.

You familiar with Judith Curry? That skeptical scientist darling of climate deniers? She's found that the expanding Antarctic sea ice is explained by warming ocean water. That's old news too, well relatively. Don't take my word for it though, read what she's published:

The observed sea surface temperature in the Southern Ocean shows a substantial warming trend for the second half of the 20th century. Associated with the warming, there has been an enhanced atmospheric hydrological cycle in the Southern Ocean that results in an increase of the Antarctic sea ice for the past three decades through the reduced upward ocean heat transport and increased snowfall.​

Jiping Liu and, Judith A. Curry. Accelerated warming of the Southern Ocean and its impacts on the hydrological cycle and sea ice. PNAS, 2010 DOI: 10.1073/pnas.1003336107

 

[petros]

That means ice will keep on building.

 

[Tonington]

That means ice will keep on building.

Only if you assume things and didn't bother to read the paper.

 

[petros]

Only if you assume things and didn't bother to read the paper.

Cold oceans are why poles are deserts. Warm offer up precipitation. Precipitation builds glaciers.

This isn't a new thing. Ice didn't walk there in the past.