It's time to ban axes

[eh1eh]

23 Hurt In Shootings Across Chicago This Weekend « CBS Chicago

3 Dead, 5 Wounded In Overnight Shootings In Chicago « CBS Chicago

Chicago Shootings: 6 Wounded By Gunfire Within 15 Minutes, Religious Leaders Call For Peace

Chicago Shootings: 15 Wounded, Including 10-Year-Old, Over 6 Hours Ahead Of Fourth Of July Holiday


There have been 1200 shooting incidents in Chicago so far this year.

How many of you right wing gun mongers want to say that it's not because of availability of guns?

I'd post all the Toronto shootings but everybody knows about all two of those this year.

Hooray for self defense gun mongers who want Canada to be like the USA.

 

[L Gilbert]

23 Hurt In Shootings Across Chicago This Weekend « CBS Chicago

3 Dead, 5 Wounded In Overnight Shootings In Chicago « CBS Chicago

Chicago Shootings: 6 Wounded By Gunfire Within 15 Minutes, Religious Leaders Call For Peace

Chicago Shootings: 15 Wounded, Including 10-Year-Old, Over 6 Hours Ahead Of Fourth Of July Holiday


There have been 1200 shooting incidents in Chicago so far this year.

How many of you right wing gun mongers want to say that it's not because of availability of guns?

I'd post all the Toronto shootings but everybody knows about all two of those this year.

Hooray for self defense gun mongers who want Canada to be like the USA.

Canadians aren`t Americans.

Like I said, in Canada, we just don`t have the same attitude and by far, Canadians prefer the proper usage for firearms.

I wonder why so many anti-gun goofs want to compare the USA to Canada rather than say, Switzerland, where firearms are also quite plentiful.

 

[eh1eh]

Canadians aren`t Americans.

Like I said, in Canada, we just don`t have the same attitude and by far, Canadians prefer the proper usage for firearms.

If I believed in a deity I would thank it for that.
Also it's not the people like you and Colpy who are the problem.
Bottom line is, if there are more guns available then there are more guns avalible.
Obviously bad people will get a gun if they so desire but not so bad people who have a bad day have easy access to a gun as opposed to not having access... what is the difference? The difference is Canada .v. USA.
I like that I can go out even in Toronto and feel I don't 'need' a gun to defend myself.

 

[L Gilbert]

If I believed in a deity I would thank it for that.
Also it's not the people like you and Colpy who are the problem.

Exactly. I think the problem with firearms related incidents in comparison to the amount of firearms in Canada are blown out of proportion by people like Bar Sinister.

Bottom line is, if there are more guns available then there are more guns avalible.

We have 11 here between the two of us.

Obviously bad people will get a gun if they so desire but not so bad people who have a bad day have easy access to a gun as opposed to not having access... what is the difference? The difference is Canada .v. USA.
I like that I can go out even in Toronto and feel I don't 'need' a gun to defend myself.

So why compare the USA with Canada and not compare Switzerland with Canada?

http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/switzerland

Population of Switzerland is about 8 million, BTW. Estimated number of firearms in Switzerland is about 3.5 million.
Canada has about 34 and a half million. Estimated number of firearms is about 7 and a half million.

 

[eh1eh]

So why compare the USA with Canada and not compare Switzerland with Canada?

http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/switzerland

Apples and oranges. The USA has completely different gun laws and attitudes towards guns.
Maybe we should do something like the Swiss. It teaches how to use guns, not allow guns as a right for self defense against your neighbor.
What I think is we shouldn't do anything like the USA.

 

[L Gilbert]

Apples and oranges.

Exactly. Like I said, Canadians aren't Americans. In fact I think we are more like the Swiss than the Americans, yet fools like Bar Sinister keep plugging on with the comparison of the States to Canada in some sort of weird case against guns..

 

[JLM]

23 Hurt In Shootings Across Chicago This Weekend « CBS Chicago

3 Dead, 5 Wounded In Overnight Shootings In Chicago « CBS Chicago

Chicago Shootings: 6 Wounded By Gunfire Within 15 Minutes, Religious Leaders Call For Peace

Chicago Shootings: 15 Wounded, Including 10-Year-Old, Over 6 Hours Ahead Of Fourth Of July Holiday


There have been 1200 shooting incidents in Chicago so far this year.

How many of you right wing gun mongers want to say that it's not because of availability of guns?

.

It's got F/A to do with right wing or the availability of guns! It's got everything to do with the availability of criminals and idiots and people who are wingy in general. It's time people got over this "gun mentality".

 

[Bar Sinister]

.... or anti-gun rubbish.
Um, that means rubbish is rubbish regardless of whose mouth it come from.
Laws do not have any effect on people who break laws. It's as simple as that. Same for bans and limits implemented by lawmakers. All those do is increase blackmarket activity.

lol But you seem to forget that the original intention for people making weapons was to acquire food and for defense against nastier species. Yeah, that means killing. And people that want to kill people will use whatever they want regardless of its proper usage.

Some are. Some aren't.

Axes chop, saws saw. lol

If your argument is just about numbers, then it doesn't take much ANFO to kill and maim many people. And you can be long gone by the time the effects of it occur. Want to ban fertilizer and diesel fuel? I can find cover, get close enough to jam it up his ass, shoot back, etc. I can scoot and hope the SOB won't pitch it into my house before I can plug him fulla lead.
Either way, laws likely won't be sufficient to stop him.
People who break laws don't care what laws there are.

And, sopeaking in terms of numbers again, I think you seem to think that the ratio between people who use firearms for sensible purposes in comparison to those who don't is not much. In Canada, it's less than 5 per 100,000. In fact, in 2006 there were twice as many homicides from items other than firearms as there was for firearms according to StatsCan.

Sorry, but if you really cannot differentiate between useful products like household tools and fuel and firearms then you probably should not own a firearm. This thread is simply another attempt to deflect attention from the real problem, which is the plethora of guns in the hands of those who should not have them.

Two BTWs - I have no idea what ANFO means.
And fertilizer is a poor example for your side as it is controlled in many countries. And if fertilizer can be controlled, then guns most certainly can be as well.

 

[JLM]

ANFO - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I had to look it up. These bloody initials all the time don't impress me.

 

[eh1eh]

It's got F/A to do with right wing or the availability of guns! It's got everything to do with the availability of criminals and idiots and people who are wingy in general. It's time people got over this "gun mentality".

Then why such a drastic difference between two similar sized cities?

 

[Colpy]

Then why such a drastic difference between two similar sized cities?

Inner cities.

Gangs.

Fatherless boy-men.

Drugs.

A culture of violence and criminality in certain areas.

Much more of that in Chicago than in Toronto, thankfully.

If anyone thinks Canadian murder rates in the criminal world are lower because of our gun control, they are simply not dealing with reality.

I am hardly a criminal, but I could find you and deliver a variety of illegal weapons in 24 hours. Imagine how many are available to a Toronto gang-banger.

 

[L Gilbert]

Sorry, but if you really cannot differentiate between useful products like household tools and fuel and firearms then you probably should not own a firearm.

I see now you've added firearms to the tools you think are useful. You virtually stated they weren't in an earlier post.
And if you can't differentiate between the huge amount of good people that own guns and the relatively few that use them improperly, you shouldn't even be posting about guns. DUH
I use my tools properly so you think I shouldn't own them? Fu-ck, you are stupid.

This thread is simply another attempt to deflect attention from the real problem, which is the plethora of guns in the hands of those who should not have them.

So rant about the idiots that get their mitts on guns instead then.

Two BTWs - I have no idea what ANFO means.

Ammonium Nitrate & Fuel Oil.

And fertilizer is a poor example for your side

Wrong. Like one of those CO2 bottles for paintball guns loaded with fertilizer and a couple CCs of diesel fuel can majke a helluva mess of a SUV. As I said, it doesn't take much to kill many people.

as it is controlled in many countries.

Ah, but you keep bringing up the States, not any other countries.

And if fertilizer can be controlled, then guns most certainly can be as well.

Sure. Like guns are in Canada at this point in time. I buy about 800 liters of diesel fuel at a time, which is a small amount for a farmer/rancher/logger et al. Large farms buy fertilizer by the tonne and it costs about $1200 per tonne.

And why comopare Canada to the States in the first place? Why not choose Switzerland, for instance, in a comparison?

Your arguments are pitiful.

ANFO - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I had to look it up. These bloody initials all the time don't impress me.

Oh. So?

 

[Bar Sinister]

I see now you've added firearms to the tools you think are useful. You virtually stated they weren't in an earlier post.
And if you can't differentiate between the huge amount of good people that own guns and the relatively few that use them improperly, you shouldn't even be posting about guns. DUH
I use my tools properly so you think I shouldn't own them? Fu-ck, you are stupid.So rant about the idiots that get their mitts on guns instead then.

Ammonium Nitrate & Fuel Oil.
Wrong. Like one of those CO2 bottles for paintball guns loaded with fertilizer and a couple CCs of diesel fuel can majke a helluva mess of a SUV. As I said, it doesn't take much to kill many people. Ah, but you keep bringing up the States, not any other countries. Sure. Like guns are in Canada at this point in time. I buy about 800 liters of diesel fuel at a time, which is a small amount for a farmer/rancher/logger et al. Large farms buy fertilizer by the tonne and it costs about $1200 per tonne.

And why comopare Canada to the States in the first place? Why not choose Switzerland, for instance, in a comparison?

Your arguments are pitiful.

Oh. So?

My arguments are pitiful? Give me a break. You are the one who cannot tell the difference between a potato peeler and a firearm. You are simply reciting the same tired gun-obsessed arguments and continuing to ignore the fact that stares you in the face. Why is it that the US has so many more gun-related deaths than any other democracy? I have yet to find any gun-advocate who can answer that question and you have not either in spite of your contorted "logic." Unless you can actually come up with an intelligent post on this issue this is my last comment in this thread.

BTW resorting to words like "stupid" really show that you have run out of intelligent things to say. Of course, as a member of the gun-obsessed that is hardly surprising.

 

[karrie]

Quibble all you want on definitions, but, I think my friends would have a hard time taking down the bears in their yard without a gun. Weapon, tool, call it whatever you will, it's a necessity for some. For those people, it IS absurd to hear people say they should have their tool/weapon taken away or restricted because someone somewhere broke the law.

I used to be fairly 'for' gun legislation and restrictions until the day our mayor decided that the best way to deal with all the stabbings late at night in our city, was to ban knife sales. Suddenly the ridiculousness of it all came crashing home.

Why is it that the US has so many more gun-related deaths than any other democracy?

(my apologies to our american readers for the cruel generalizations that are about to follow)

The US is a uniquely paranoid society. There is no other country on earth that day in, day out, pits its citizens against one another on so many levels. POlitics, race, religion....the country is uniquely black and white, polarized, on almost EVERY issue, and their media feeds them a steady diet of fear. Not just fear for the outside world, but also fear of their neighbours. The result is a country that has criminalized its own population beyond that of any other. The fact that they have more gunrelated deaths is no surprise. The fact that they haven't gone to war and shredded one another to ribbons, however, is.

 

[JLM]

Quibble all you want on definitions, but, I think my friends would have a hard time taking down the bears in their yard without a gun..

Good one, Karrie, even the densest of the gun opponents should be able to savvy your post.

(my apologies to our american readers for the cruel generalizations that are about to follow)

The US is a uniquely paranoid society. There is no other country on earth that day in, day out, pits its citizens against one another on so many levels.

Much more perception that fact, Karrie...........you are better off to observe the man on the street than the bloody idiot box or even the newspaper! :smile:

 

[Niflmir]

Quibble all you want on definitions, but, I think my friends would have a hard time taking down the bears in their yard without a gun. Weapon, tool, call it whatever you will, it's a necessity for some. For those people, it IS absurd to hear people say they should have their tool/weapon taken away or restricted because someone somewhere broke the law.

I used to be fairly 'for' gun legislation and restrictions until the day our mayor decided that the best way to deal with all the stabbings late at night in our city, was to ban knife sales. Suddenly the ridiculousness of it all came crashing home.

Yes, let us just change one word in your argument...

Quibble all you want on definitions, but, I think my friends would have a hard time taking down the bears in their yard without an AR-15. Weapon, tool, call it whatever you will, it's a necessity for some. For those people, it IS absurd to hear people say they should have their tool/weapon taken away or restricted because someone somewhere broke the law.

I used to be fairly 'for' gun legislation and restrictions until the day our mayor decided that the best way to deal with all the stabbings late at night in our city, was to ban knife sales. Suddenly the ridiculousness of it all came crashing home.

Now it doesn't make any sense at all, does it? That is a very particular nuance that everybody loves to gloss over. Just like everybody is for freedom of speech until they are being slandered, everybody is against gun control until they have a rocket launcher pointed at them.

People love to bash on the straw man though... it is much easier than attacking the real argument.

 

[Colpy]

Yes, let us just change one word in your argument...



Now it doesn't make any sense at all, does it? That is a very particular nuance that everybody loves to gloss over. Just like everybody is for freedom of speech until they are being slandered, everybody is against gun control until they have a rocket launcher pointed at them.

People love to bash on the straw man though... it is much easier than attacking the real argument.

The AR 15 would be a spectacularly poor choice for bear defense, as it is a essentially a varmit rifle.

Yep.

The .223 cartridge (5.56 x 45 NATO) is simply the .222 Magnum with a shorter neck..........it is actually slightly less powerful than that cartridge, and slightly more so than the .222 Remington.......both of the latter cartridges are approaching obsolescence as the .223 dominates the varmit field.

Yep.

A gopher shooter.

Oh! But it is semi-automatic!!! A modern para-military arm!

Remington has been selling semi-auto centre fire sporting arms since 1900.

Yep.

But it is designed after a military "assault" rifle!

Big deal. Most rifles are. Most bolt guns are designed after the Mauser K 98. What shooter didn't cut his teeth on a .303 SMLE, the deadliest "assault" rifle of its time??? And the Winchester 97, Browning's first pump action shotgun, was rapidly drafted into the military.

A gun is a gun is a gun.

It does not matter what it looks like.

It matters how it is used.

 

[karrie]

Good one, Karrie, even the densest of the gun opponents should be able to savvy your post.



Much more perception that fact, Karrie...........you are better off to observe the man on the street than the bloody idiot box or even the newspaper! :smile:

I do. With hubby being in corporate level oil patch I meet plenty of Americans. The issue shows in a plethora of ways. Not every last American... generalizations are simply that. But oh boy, some of them want 'the illegals' shot dead, some want the president shot dead. Some rant about their need for guns because 'they're coming for us'. Even here on CC there are Canadians taking in too much American media who have avatars alluding to the need to shoot someone based on their politics.

Yes, let us just change one word in your argument...



Now it doesn't make any sense at all, does it? That is a very particular nuance that everybody loves to gloss over. Just like everybody is for freedom of speech until they are being slandered, everybody is against gun control until they have a rocket launcher pointed at them.

People love to bash on the straw man though... it is much easier than attacking the real argument.

I get what you mean, but not all people talking about banning guns are referring to anything more than simple rifles.

 

[JLM]

I do. With hubby being in corporate level oil patch I meet plenty of Americans. The issue shows in a plethora of ways. Not every last American... generalizations are simply that. But oh boy, some of them want 'the illegals' shot dead, some want the president shot dead. Some rant about their need for guns because 'they're coming for us'. Even here on CC there are Canadians taking in too much American media who have avatars alluding to the need to shoot someone based on their politics.



.

Yep, such talk can be upsetting and worrisome, but I think in 99.9% of cases it is just that............a cry for attention. I think MOST of the evil is caused by the silent types- the loners who stay by themselves. My extensive experience with the American "man on the street", if one of friendliness, optimism and extreme helpfulness..........but then it only takes one or two to screw everything up.

 

[Blackleaf]

Ban axes?

I'd love to see you chopping one without one.