french socialist francois hollande wins presidency

[Spade]

Wait and see what Germany has to say when Hollande tries to pick their pockets, that's when the sh*t will really hit the fan..... The impact on the markets is far from over.

Let's wait and see. And, if I'm right you can expect an "I told you so!"

 

[CDNBear]

Its a myth that right leaning governments are fiscally responsible, while left leaning aren't. Tommy Douglas was left leaning, but fiscally responsible:

Tommy Douglas, revered today by many in Canada as the founder of the Canadian medicare system, was a longtime leader of the Co-operative Commonwealth Federation (CCF). Like much of the so-called Old Left, Tommy Douglas was surprisingly socially conservative. For example, medicare was initially adopted in the province of Saskatchewan largely as part of a pro-natalist, pro-family policy. Tommy Douglas also argued for what later became called "workfare" – being appalled by the idea that able-bodied men should receive government money without rendering some kind of constructive labor. He also hated deficits, arguing that fiscal prudence was necessary "to keep the bankers off the government's back"

Tommy is dead, and so is his breed.

But I know I should pay more taxes...

And I'm sure you do you own taxes and do not deduct a thing.

Instead the tax burden has been shifted to the poor and middle class, while the wealthier get weatheir and the poor get poorer. France and Greece have rejected that model. Good for them. When are a majority of Canadians going to wise up?

Good for Greece? How exactly do you want Canada to wise up? By employing the same model as Greece?

BTW, Clinton handed Bush the biggest surplus in US history. Bush handed Obama the biggest deficit in US history.

BTW; Clinton paved the way for the economy tanking in the US with the repeal of the Glass-Stegal Act. And that's just one of the things he did that got that ball rolling. I won't even get into the incentives to banks to make high risk loans to gain greater latitude in monetary manipulations.

And just out of curiousity, since you ended that sentence so abruptly, just what did Obama do to the deficit?

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

Wait and see what Germany has to say when Hollande tries to pick their pockets, that's when the sh*t will really hit the fan..... The impact on the markets is far from over

I believe it is the German and French banks which have the most to lose if Greece does not live within its means and defaults on its obligations. Even with a strong Germany, they aren't that strong to lose their banks. If the French and German banks go down it really won't matter too much who is elected in France since the country will be virtually bankrupt.

 

[captain morgan]

Let's wait and see. And, if I'm right you can expect an "I told you so!"

I hope that you are right Spade, I really do... I would be very happy to receive an "I told you so" on this issue.

I believe it is the German and French banks which have the most to lose if Greece does not live within its means and defaults on its obligations. Even with a strong Germany, they aren't that strong to lose their banks. If the French and German banks go down it really won't matter too much who is elected in France since the country will be virtually bankrupt.

You are bang-on in terms of the banking scenario. There are many European banks that would suffer, however, I don't think that a full-on Greek would collapse them completely... They'd certainly be hurting (badly), but the bigs would pull through.

 

[taxslave]

If nobody has jobs and is on the social teat that would be a paradise?

Nope. That would be England.

 

[Cliffy]

Wally, if neg reps are so unimportant, why do you hand them out like some deranged panic button pusher?

Ah Wally, you are so predictable. Thanks for proving me right once again.

 

[Bar Sinister]

Fine for you, collecting your pension. What are you going to do when the rest of us loose our jobs due to socialist plundering of the economy and there are no more tax payers left? Or are you, like Greece expecting your grandchildren to pay for your greed?

I'd be far more concerned with the capitalist plundering of the economy if I was you. The reason there are so few middle class taxpayers left is due to the fact that the top one percent of the population has highjacked so much of the wealth. When you're paying corporate executives and entertainers 300 times the rate of the average wage earner there simply is not much left for everyone else.

 

[gopher]

This is how the French view the election:

Thus, again, while Sarkozy loss is bemoaned by the American media and right wingers, the majority of French and Europeans are rejoicing as they blame him, not socialism, as the cause of France's woes.

quote Mentalfloss,

a newly resurgent left in Greece and Germany

A report in today's news showed that the resurgence is all over Europe.

 

[captain morgan]

Thus, again, while Sarkozy loss is bemoaned by the American media and right wingers, the majority of French and Europeans are rejoicing as they blame him, not socialism, as the cause of France's woes.

The underlying cause of France's woes (or that of Greece, Spain, Italy, etc) is that they demand that the gvt spend more than they make... This is nothing more than people wanting more due to the never-ending promises that have been made by politicians over the years.

Blame it on whatever entity or political ideology you want, this all comes down to money and having to pay the piper

A report in today's news showed that the resurgence is all over Europe.

The big question is: Can they afford it?

 

[Cliffy]

The big question is: Can they afford it?

They could afford all kinds of stuff if they stopped dumping a major part of their budget on a military most don't need. NATO and the UN are massive money pits that serve only the military/industrial complex. Money could be better spent of peaceful means.

Oh, I know - what about those pesky Muslim terists? If we would stop bombing the crap out of them and killing their women and children and stealing their resources they might stop being pissed at the West.

 

[captain morgan]

They could afford all kinds of stuff if they stopped dumping a major part of their budget on a military most don't need. NATO and the UN are massive money pits that serve only the military/industrial complex. Money could be better spent of peaceful means.

No question about it and more importantly, that cash would go towards more social-related expenses. I'd wager that Hollande has those military related costs on the chopping block already.

Oh, I know - what about those pesky Muslim terists? If we would stop bombing the crap out of them and killing their women and children and stealing their resources they might stop being pissed at the West.

I'm pretty sure that France has maintained only a limited role relative to ME issues, that said, the muzzie terists are not, and have never been a huge target for the French authorities.

Regardless, this still takes us back to the question; can France afford Hollande?

 

[earth_as_one]

France is the fourth biggest military spender after USA, China and Russia.

 

[TenPenny]

I'm pretty sure that France has maintained only a limited role relative to ME issues, that said, the muzzie terists are not, and have never been a huge target for the French authorities.

I'm pretty sure France is quite involved with the ME, just not perhaps in the way the US would like.

 

[captain morgan]

I'm pretty sure France is quite involved with the ME, just not perhaps in the way the US would like.

Totale has big money invested in ME oil refineries and I suspect that the French gvt has a substantial investment in Totale.

Should be interesting to see how this unfolds.

 

[mentalfloss]

Ze zocialists are heeeere!

Thomas Mulcair congratulates fellow Frenchman François Hollande on presidential win

NDP leader Thomas Mulcair, a citizen of both Canada and France, sent along congratulations to French President-elect François Hollande on his victory over incumbent Nicolas Sarkozy earlier this week.

“I simply send along my warmest greetings and my hearty congratulations to Francois Hollande for an extraordinary victory,” Mulcair told The Canadian Press Monday.

“I think that his policies are going to prove most interesting in the years to come.”

Mulcair, official Leader of the Opposition, did not cast a vote in Sunday’s election.

The Socialist Hollande will officially become the French president on May 15. He defeated Sarkozy by a margin of 51.62% to 48.38% in Sunday’s run-off vote.

Hollande benefited from voter anger across Europe over austerity policies and Mulcair said the new French president had a “balanced” economic approach.

“I think that Mr. Hollande is a very experienced politician who has been elected many times and served his country well,” Mulcair said.

"That wealth of experience … is the type of thing that will allow us to put in place policies that will stabilize the situation in Europe.”

Mulcair’s decision to keep his French citizenship, which he has vowed to keep even if he becomes prime minister, has been criticized by his opponents.

Even Jack Layton said that he thought it was inappropriate for a Canadian leader to have dual citizenship. He made the comments when speaking about then-Liberal leader Stephane Dion.

Former governor-general Michaelle Jean gave up her French citizenship to take up her position as Canada’s head of state.

Mulcair has been a French citizen for about 20 years. Born in Ottawa, he was able to apply for French citizenship because his wife is from France.

Thomas Mulcair congratulates fellow Frenchman François Hollande on presidential win | News | National Post

 

[gopher]

The underlying cause of France's woes (or that of Greece, Spain, Italy, etc) is that they demand that the gvt spend more than they make... This is nothing more than people wanting more due to the never-ending promises that have been made by politicians over the years.

Blame it on whatever entity or political ideology you want, this all comes down to money and having to pay the piper

The big question is: Can they afford it?

But they have had Keynesian deficit spending for years and they never had this difficulty before. This is precisely what we had under Nixon, Reagan, Bush I, and Bush II. While the economy slowed under these presidents it never collapsed. Then when Clinton came into office and INCREASED taxes, the deficit ended, the economy vastly expanded, and we had a massive surplus. Logically, it follows that if we and Europeans did this today the economy should expand and deficits end. Europeans are demanding this and that is why the left is re-emerging there (or so I understand from watching European news sources).

 

[mentalfloss]

popcorn.gif

Hollande warns Merkel over new austerity package

Greek leaders fail to form coalition as poll shows radical leftist would win new election

Merkel faces more ballot woe in German state vote

 

[captain morgan]

But they have had Keynesian deficit spending for years and they never had this difficulty before.

There is a very big difference between deficit spending and debt financing.

The difference between the Greek example and the USA is that America had the capacity to pay down the deficit's in the (relatively) short term. Deficit spending and debt financing are not necessarily bad things when used properly, however in Greece's case, they employed both mechanisms to fund a system that had no real chance of paying down those obligations.

This is precisely what we had under Nixon, Reagan, Bush I, and Bush II. While the economy slowed under these presidents it never collapsed. Then when Clinton came into office and INCREASED taxes, the deficit ended, the economy vastly expanded, and we had a massive surplus. Logically, it follows that if we and Europeans did this today the economy should expand and deficits end. Europeans are demanding this and that is why the left is re-emerging there (or so I understand from watching European news sources).

I see where you are going with this and I don't disagree entirely... That said, there were/are significant differences in terms of the comparisons between nations, let alone the economic circumstances experienced with each President. The global economic climate is very different today even when compared with the Clinton administration, for example, China was only just coming out of their shell and did not have the same economic impact that they do today (not anywhere close).

If Europe's problem was fixed as easily as a calculated tax increase, you can bet that is exactly what they would do. My opinion is that it has gone too far for a simple tax hike to repair this.

The point I'm driving at is that our present situation is nothing less than the sum of all of the parts from over the years (and various administrations). The arguments can be made relative to the positive and negative elements contributed by each individual president, prime minister, etc, but in the end, everything builds off of the historical decisions that were made.

 

[gopher]

Except that austerity (as imposed by the right wing) has not been proven to be a valid solution for problems created by deficit spending. The solution has always been higher income brackets and denying tax sheltering for elites. This is what the European left is demanding and why they are reemerging politically.

 

[Spade]

A lot of deficit spending was triggered by the sub-prime fiasco, not from ensuring elderly widows weren't starving. But, starving them now, by tightening belts, seems somewhat mingy!