The same missile defense system that is irritating the Russians in Europe could also defend the Artic.
Tories To Waste Billons On New Fighter Jets
- Thread starter dumpthemonarchy
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Lets wait untill it happens and then address it,wont be in our lifetime or your grandkids lifetimes so why worry?
Hmm... well... yeah... as long as the threat is coming from the air.
I mean, what kind of air-threat is there to the north anyway? Yes I know that Russians do sorties up there to keep their pilots trained and to keep the diplomats on guard, but otherwise, what threat is there?
Missiles wouldn't be any defense against a protracted ground-invasions, like if wave after wave of Tamils flooded in to settle the far north.
But then, as elucidated by Kakato, they probably wouldn't know to bring cigarettes to barter for furs, and they'd be frozen like a wax-museum in thirty minutes.
Hmm... maybe we should tell the Tamils that they can enter if they settle in the high north, whereupon they get off the boat, freeze solid while still standing, and business organizes to provide trips for tourists who want to do psycho-anthropological studies of the expressions on the Tamils faces. Japanese are into tours of the high north, and they've been known to do things like take bus tours of boat-people compounds.
Hmm... that gives me another idea. The world is over-populated, to the tune of 4.5 billion more than there should be, so we tell all the over-populated regions that they're free to settle in the north. They land and freeze to death. Wave after wave arrives, until finally the world is down to 1.5 billion, which is where it should be.
Then global warming melts the tundra into marshland, and all those body's sink in. The marshlands are drained, and the billions of body's decompose, adding nitrogen and phosphorous and potassium, which are always in short supply in marshlands, and now it's fertile soil, which will be settled by millions of Americans pushing north because their own land has dried up and blown away.
With that there would be actual targets to hit on the ground, and *that's* when you'd want to install the SAMs.
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I'll have to post some pics of how we have settled the north with our 2 commercial hercs and hundreds of other planes,theres no roads up there bud,how do you think we keep our Canadian Inuuit supplied?
Because I think it *might* happen towards the end of my life, and well within the lifetime of the grand-kids.
The melting of the ice-cap is happening way faster than even the extreme advocates of climate-change were saying 20 years ago, and now they've got the results from some recent studies of Greenland ice-cores and some sediments from the bottom of lakes in Europe, and it's starting to look like it might be that it's actually normal for radical climate changes to happen very fast.
How fast? Really fast. Their studies are showing times in the past when the climate has flipped from cold to warm in as little as *one* *year*! It might explain why on so many occasions the fossil record shows mysterious disappearances of species that can't be explained by things like giant meteor impact.
I just think it makes sense to plan and be ready for it should it happen, and something *is* happening...
Whether triggered by human industry or natural changes of ocean currents as a result of continental drift... it doesn't matter anymore to self-flagellate over the cause... the fact is it's happening, and we should start getting ready, which means... tooling up the northern patrols with dirigibles for rescue and patrol instead of waste money on fighter-bombers when the other side(s) are refusing to play.
That would be really cool!
sorry but I dont believe any studies anymore as most of them stayed at the hotel when I got on the chopper!
Yeah, but those studies were done by Europeans, and they didn't have to endure an arctic climate to take the sediment samples from their lakes.
I also dont need studies of Greenland ice cores to tell me whats going on as I spent over 30 years mining sedimentary rock and could see the picture clear as day as to what happened in the layers like tree rings.
Most real geologists would laugh at these cores you talk about and the way they are manipulated to push global warming agenda's.
Just ask any real geologist out in the field that isnt working under grant money.
Nice pics. I love hercs.
But you can't argue with the satellite data, showing shrinkage of both the arctic ice-cap and the Greenland ice-sheet.
Ha Ha,show me who's paying their wages ok?
Want to bet it's not a mining company that needs real data before starting any kind of program?
The European studies have been shown to be so biased they shouldnt even be used.
Sorry but I work with real geologists that have found Canada's best coal deposits(Elk valley coal corporation),Canada's biggest and purest gold deposits(Agnico eagle...meadowbank mine) and Canada's biggest diamond finds(Diavak) so I take their word over some European geologist that's only intersted in making his money through government grants.
Dude,it's a cycle,you cant stop it and no geoligist worth his salt will tell you that you can,thats why I mentioned the sedimentary layers that show the exact same thing.
Okay, so you accept it's happening.
What's wrong with preparing for it, like... having at least the plans in place for how to deal with population resettlement, and how to deal with patrolling a region that's become an insanely vast marshland?
You're not opposed to the fact that the climate's changing... you're just disputing how *fast* it's happening, right?
I never denied it but it's going to take so many thousands of years to happen that it's not pertinent to anything at all.
People with an agenda push climate warming in all their arguments yet have no idea about what it's about except for what they have been told by Al Gore.
Nuff said
Yeah, well, the satellite data indicates otherwise.
And I still think they should be spending money on things like dirigibles for northern rescue and patrol, or at least on some real tactical fighter-patrol jets, instead of fancy and rococo fighter-bombers when the cold war is over.
Considering most European researchers rely on government grants to fund the data they provide it isnt surprising when most global fear mongering folks eat it up.
Pretty sad but take it for what it is,skewed data so they get another grant.
Nuff said omicron,if you cant see that then your as ignorant as most folks who eat up skewed data to push an agenda which your clearly doing.
Pretty sad but take it for what it is,skewed data so they get another grant.
Nuff said omicron,if you cant see that then your as ignorant as most folks who eat up skewed data to push an agenda which your clearly doing.
I know my statistics (Chi square, linear regressions, yadda yadda; my favorite is doing orthogonal factor analysis on unequal group-sizes looking for hidden effects) and I've looked at what they've done, and it's not bad if you don't loose sight of what they're actually reporting the measurements of.
In any case, that still doesn't get around the issue of the satellite data, and I still think it's silly to spend so much money on fighter-bombers when the cold war is over.
Sometimes I can't believe the attitudes of people. The cold war is not over anymore than we are about to end fighting the Islamic world. We are going to face more and
more potential problems as the world economy slides over the edge. Oh you think the recession or worse is over too? Think again, Greece is worse than first thought and a number of countries are in serious trouble. Not only that China and America
are in some real financial problems, and the leveraged fund crisis is right below the
surface. We are at the crossroads of crisis in this world and we will need everything
we can afford. Remember the cutting the chopper deal? That ended up a huge
mistake too. I am someone on the political left but I do realize the importance of
having a strong military, and we must do updating ongoing not playing catch up
all the time.
more potential problems as the world economy slides over the edge. Oh you think the recession or worse is over too? Think again, Greece is worse than first thought and a number of countries are in serious trouble. Not only that China and America
are in some real financial problems, and the leveraged fund crisis is right below the
surface. We are at the crossroads of crisis in this world and we will need everything
we can afford. Remember the cutting the chopper deal? That ended up a huge
mistake too. I am someone on the political left but I do realize the importance of
having a strong military, and we must do updating ongoing not playing catch up
all the time.
sorry but I rely on real life data which I can see and have experienced,not b.**** statistics you get off of google from the same people I mentioned before that get their studies funded by government grants.
Theres a reason I kept mentioning these studies but you fail to pick up on it,maybe your getting funded by one also?
I think I know the ones you're talking about, and I still say they're not bad, per se, insolong as one keeps an eye on what the studies are actually reporting.
However, the lake-sediment study I refereed to did not involve any statistics at all... it was simply a survey of pollen-types as a function of the sedimentation layer, and it was startling how they would be counting pollen from species that thrive in cold temperatures, and then *bang*, in something between one-and-four years, the subsequent layers changed to species that thrive in warm climates... and they were *not* specifically looking for climate-change data.... they were just doing a time-based flora survey.
Nope, among other things, I get paid to review other people's statistical analysis to see if they've used the right test and to confirm that they did the calculations correctly, which means there's a (dwindling) sideline in being paid by various commercial interests to see if holes can be shot in the arguments of the global warming researchers.
In any case, there's still the satellite data, which isn't data so much as it is images. You can't argue with that unless you want to believe that the CCDs of the satellites are all bunk. Just from the satellite data alone, if I was a responsible government, I'd start making plans now for how to handle the population movements and the agricultural relocations that are going to be necessary to weather it.
And I still think the money being spent on the F-35 fighter-bombers, which only make sense if we're to be part of coalitions doing aggressive strategic bombing runs against targets in other parts of the world, would be more sensibly spent on proper subs and either dirigibles or tactical defense fighters.
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Interesting you should be commenting on permafrost. I helped dig though it using a jackhammer when I worked in the high arctic. Just one question though. What does permafrost have to do with this topic?
Any by the way if you did patrol on quads you would destroy a considerable amount of arctic environment. Tundra is incredibly easy to destroy and takes decades to return to its original state.
You seem to be a real traditionalist so far as language is concerned. I hope you don't still refer to a tire (tyre) as an iron band used to hold a wagon wheel together.
I expect you are exaggerating the dangers of the current financial crisis; and yes, the Cold War is over. At least the Cold War the way it was conducted from 1946 to 1990 is over. International rivalries continue along with the threat of various terrorist groups but that is a far cry from what existed during the days of superpower confrontation.
So far as your comment about the need for an armed forces I have no disagreement there. Where we might disagree on is what shape the armed forces and their equipment takes.
As Omicron pointed out the last time Canada used its fighters in combat was in Kosovo. However, they were not really needed given the huge number of aircraft the US and other NATO allies already had in the region. Since that time they have been of very little use at all.
What Canada should be doing is assessing the most likely threats to the country and how the Canadian armed forces are most likely to be used. So far as I can see that means making sure Canada has a well-trained and well-equipped army as over the last few decades that is the part of Canada's armed forces that has been the most useful.
That does not mean the Air Force and the Navy get shut down; it just means that these branches of the armed forces should be equipped to complement the army. So far as the Air Force is concerned this means global-reach transports and attack and transport helicopters. Supersonic fighters are likely to be the least useful aircraft in any future wars. It is one of the reasons why the US government recently canceled production of the F-22.
The navy needs transport and patrol vessels - especially ships capable of patrolling all regions of Canada. Since no single vessel can do this it needs to have a variety of craft to deal with all situations.
It looks as if the current government is simply equipping Canada's military with weapons that were used during the Cold War. Such weapons may be of little use in future military missions. What is needed is a reassessment of Canada's military requirements.