Canadians Split on Monarchy, Dump It I Say

[dumpthemonarchy]

Re: The Queen’s Canadian Style and Titles

Was there ever any doubt? People like me are thorn in the flesh of any revolution, any dictatorship. No revolution tolerates free thinkers, people who ask awkward questions. French Revolution for instance.

Or any dictatorship. In a Fundamentalist Christian or Fundamentalist Muslim dictatorship (or a Communist, Nazi dictatorship), people like me would be the first to be herded into concentration camps.

People like me are the product of a tolerant democracy. Free thinkers don’t exist in a revolution or a dictatorship.

However, beware. People like you may not necessarily be safe. In a revolution nobody is really safe; you don’t know when the wrath of revolution will be directed against you (after people like me are disposed off) for something you inadvertently said or did. Again look at French Revolution.

Actually, no. Some revolutions are necessary. You're the kind of thinker that says everything is fine, despite a corrupt king, people dying for nothing in useless wars, and economic mayhem for the poor say. Some countries have revolutions because they need them, it is the only way to remove the rotten old regime that resists change. They say, "Let them eat cake, screw them."

Of course in Canada, revolutions are for people other countries, not us. I think things have picked up, they say we are in internet time, faster than your time, no? A real revolution is much faster but we are not there yet of course. But we seem to be moving a little faster than before.

Keep the monarchy because it's cheap. Yet give politicians the chance to spend billions to hold the Commonwealth Games. Are you aware of security costs for public events? I see your paradigm falling down.

 

[wulfie68]

Final comment: If we're going to keep a monarchy, then let's at least do it right, and have one who is born and lives in Canada. This hybrid arrangement, with a foreigner as a monarch is a sign of not being fully grown up as a country. Are we going to the let the Ozzies beat us to dumping the monarch? Or even the Brits?

I can respect most of your views until this short paragraph: it strikes a chord with me as showing what is wrong with the thoughts of so many who complain about the monarchy. If we're to bother changing monarchs, how on earth would we select the new one? Next, who cares what the Aussies or Brits do? Canada is a different and distinct country. We're members of the Commonwealth, as they are, and share a monarch, but our system and traditions of governance are our own.

And when you read Dumpthemonarchy's last couple posts, does anyone else have the Who's "We Won't Get Fooled Again" echoing in their head?

We'll be fighting in the streets
With our children at our feet
And the morals that they worship will be gone
And the men who spurred us on
Sit in judgment of all wrong
They decide and the shotgun sings the song

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
And I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again

Change it had to come
We knew it all along
We were liberated from the fall that's all
But the world looks just the same
And history ain't changed
'Cause the banners, they all flown in the last war

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
And I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
No, no!

I'll move myself and my family aside
If we happen to be left half alive
I'll get all my papers and smile at the sky
For I know that the hypnotized never lie

Do ya?


There's nothing in the street
Looks any different to me
And the slogans are replaced, by-the-bye
And the parting on the left
Is now the parting on the right
And the beards have all grown longer overnight

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
No, no!

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

Meet the new boss
Same as the old boss...

 

[taxslave]

I'm not so worried about the present queen but here offspring are an embarrassment. Mostly I find it kind of humiliating to have a foreign ruler. Not into spending a lot of money to change the system. Those that favor the monarchy seem to find all kinds of rather trivial reasons why we can't change the system. As far as I can see if we had an elected PM, independent of the party with the most seats, an elected parliament and elected senate that should be all we need. Perhaps elected senior judges as well. And a recall system that works.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

I don't think so. Not when you hardly visit nor do members of your family. The royal family much prefers to party in New York city according to the monarchist magazine I keep getting. They have no Canadian network to speak of here and know little about the country. They only talk about Canada when they are here.


'Very good to be home,' Queen tells Canadians - CTV News

'Very good to be home,' Queen tells Canadians

In a brief, bilingual speech, the Queen said she concurred with her mother, who once called Canada "a home away from home," and several times thanked Nova Scotians for their warm greeting.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

BTW, all four of my grandparents were born in the UK, one Scottish, one Welsh and two English. And in spite of what I've expressed, I don't think it's in the top 5 or 6 problems I'd like to see fixed. Just that if I had the chance to vote on it, I'd vote the way I've indicated.

I think that is about right, the issue is not high up on the list on peoples' agenda. In a referendum I would vote to keep the monarchy, not because I am particularly fond of it, but because it is the tradition and I see no need to change the status quo.

I'm not so worried about the present queen but here offspring are an embarrassment. Mostly I find it kind of humiliating to have a foreign ruler. Not into spending a lot of money to change the system. Those that favor the monarchy seem to find all kinds of rather trivial reasons why we can't change the system. As far as I can see if we had an elected PM, independent of the party with the most seats, an elected parliament and elected senate that should be all we need. Perhaps elected senior judges as well. And a recall system that works.

You are describing pretty much the American system, with the exception of elected senior judges. I don’t think much of American system. Especially elected judges, a terrible idea.

 

[Knowzilla]

I don't think so. Not when you hardly visit nor do members of your family. The royal family much prefers to party in New York city according to the monarchist magazine I keep getting. They have no Canadian network to speak of here and know little about the country. They only talk about Canada when they are here.


'Very good to be home,' Queen tells Canadians - CTV News

'Very good to be home,' Queen tells Canadians

In a brief, bilingual speech, the Queen said she concurred with her mother, who once called Canada "a home away from home," and several times thanked Nova Scotians for their warm greeting.

That's Prince Harry who keeps running off to New York. And do tell me, what has he got to do with Canada's constitution, political system, or it's monarchy? He has no constitutional duties.

Furthermore, the Queen probably knows more about Canada than most Canadians. She is well versed on everything about Canada, and you may be surprised to see how much she knows. This has been continuously the comments of Canada's Prime Ministers who have met with the Queen.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

That's Prince Harry who keeps running off to New York. And do tell me, what has he got to do with Canada's constitution, political system, or it's monarchy? He has no constitutional duties.

Furthermore, the Queen probably knows more about Canada than most Canadians. She is well versed on everything about Canada, and you may be surprised to see how much she knows. This has been continuously the comments of Canada's Prime Ministers who have met with the Queen.

Okay, show me some links of the queen talking about Canada and her great knowledge of us in the media. I don't take your word for it.

I say this because I get the Monarchist newspaper and they complained about how Prince Harry is always going to NYC and not Canada. He goes where the action is. The pro-monarchists want the royal family to build up networks in Canada, which they have never done. You get the feeling the end is near here. And you know what happens if you don't go gracefully when you have the chance . . .

 

[AnnaG]

:roll: You don't think that QE2's staff bring her up to speed on things' Canadian when she visits here? lmao You were expecting someone to have written a paper or a book on what the queen knows about Canada? roflmao
She's actually quite intelligent and I wouldn't be surprised if she'd forgotten more about Canada than a lot of Canadians know.

Anyway, there are loads of biographies and other info on her if you want to know something about her.
I might suggest perusing this book: Amazon.com: Canada's Queen: Elizabeth II: A Celebration of Her Majestys Friendship with the People of Canada (9780470154441): Patti Tasko: Books

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Okay, show me some links of the queen talking about Canada and her great knowledge of us in the media. I don't take your word for it.

I say this because I get the Monarchist newspaper and they complained about how Prince Harry is always going to NYC and not Canada. He goes where the action is. The pro-monarchists want the royal family to build up networks in Canada, which they have never done. You get the feeling the end is near here. And you know what happens if you don't go gracefully when you have the chance . . .

I don't see why Prince Harry (or any member of the Royal family) should come to Canada, rather than USA. If he likes USA better, he will go to USA, what is the big deal? I don't think that has anything to do with the question as to whether we should keep the monarchy.

And why would pro-monarchists want Royal family to build up networks in Canada? That is nuts, Royal family will do what they want to do. I don't consider myself pro-monarchist, I consider myself neutral on the issue.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

I don't see why Prince Harry (or any member of the Royal family) should come to Canada, rather than USA. If he likes USA better, he will go to USA, what is the big deal? I don't think that has anything to do with the question as to whether we should keep the monarchy.

And why would pro-monarchists want Royal family to build up networks in Canada? That is nuts, Royal family will do what they want to do. I don't consider myself pro-monarchist, I consider myself neutral on the issue.

Harry has no special connection to Canada of any sort. People need personal news of someone, and the royal family supplies none to the pro-monarchists here. It is the royal "family" after all and even Canadians who really support it feel too small a part of it and are unhappy. This is not just an academic subject to them, they need the human touch attached to the cold legalities. They want to feel on the inside of this family and they can't.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Harry has no special connection to Canada of any sort. People need personal news of someone, and the royal family supplies none to the pro-monarchists here. It is the royal "family" after all and even Canadians who really support it feel too small a part of it and are unhappy. This is not just an academic subject to them, they need the human touch attached to the cold legalities. They want to feel on the inside of this family and they can't.

Well, I have no desire to feel on the inside of the Royal family. As a family, they are not exceptional; they are all too fallible, as recent events have amply demonstrated.

My support for the monarchy (or rather, my opposition to getting rid of monarchy) is based purely upon practical reasons, and is not dependent upon what the Royal Family does or doesn’t do. Provided they don’t interfere with internal affairs of Canada (and they don’t), I couldn’t care less what they do or don’t do.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Well, I have no desire to feel on the inside of the Royal family. As a family, they are not exceptional; they are all too fallible, as recent events have amply demonstrated.

My support for the monarchy (or rather, my opposition to getting rid of monarchy) is based purely upon practical reasons, and is not dependent upon what the Royal Family does or doesn’t do. Provided they don’t interfere with internal affairs of Canada (and they don’t), I couldn’t care less what they do or don’t do.

That's good. And they are quite unexceptional too. We won't miss them.

 

[Knowzilla]

Okay, show me some links of the queen talking about Canada and her great knowledge of us in the media. I don't take your word for it.

I say this because I get the Monarchist newspaper and they complained about how Prince Harry is always going to NYC and not Canada. He goes where the action is. The pro-monarchists want the royal family to build up networks in Canada, which they have never done. You get the feeling the end is near here. And you know what happens if you don't go gracefully when you have the chance . . .

I suppose you don't take the word of countless Prime Ministers of Canada who have praised the Queen's knowledge of Canada?

 

[SirJosephPorter]

I suppose you don't take the word of countless Prime Ministers of Canada who have praised the Queen's knowledge of Canada?

Queen has been to Canada several times since she became the monarch, so it stands to reason that she would have at least some knowledge of Canada.

 

[L Gilbert]

It would unnecessarily cost too much to lose the monarchy from our system. It works more-or-less, so leave it alone.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

I suppose you don't take the word of countless Prime Ministers of Canada who have praised the Queen's knowledge of Canada?

Why take someone's word for something? You must have taken Bush and Co.'s word in the Iraq war about weapons of mass destruction. In a world of PR and bullsh**, it would be nice to hear from the horse's mouth something genuine from the queen about Canada, but we won't because she has enough to worry about in the UK.

PMs praise the GG for reading word for word the throne speech they are given. Politically, it is like praising a dog that follows commands from its master. The queen, crown, GG, are all "above politics" so all they can say is mindless blather. It seems noble, but it's just hopelessly remote.

Did she read something called a newspaper and learn anything about Canada in the Olympics? Not that I've heard. That's too common most likely.

 

[FiveParadox]

Did she read something called a newspaper and learn anything about Canada in the Olympics? Not that I've heard.

And why would you have heard? Do you expect Her Majesty to send you off a quick e-mail to let you know that she read a newspaper?

That's too common most likely.

Your visceral hatred for not only the monarchy, but the monarch and the Royal Family, is saddening.

 

[talloola]

I will remain faithful always to the monarchy, for if it wasn't for them, we would
all be americans, and have nothing to call our own, no canadian independence, no canada at all.

 

[L Gilbert]

Did she read something called a newspaper and learn anything about Canada in the Olympics? Not that I've heard. That's too common most likely.

Let's hang onto that though for a sec.

Why take someone's word for something?

Exactly.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

I will remain faithful always to the monarchy, for if it wasn't for them, we would
all be americans, and have nothing to call our own, no canadian independence, no canada at all.

Canada has a distinct identity from USA, and I think, two factors are largely responsible for that. Monarchy and Quebec. In a pinch, we could afford to lose one or the other, but no way we are going to lose both.

We really cannot tell about Quebec, when it will separate. All the more reason to keep monarchy alive.