Vatican/Holy See, State, or not?
- Thread starter CDNBear
- Start date
They are two separate bodies wulfie, as laid out in the Lateran Treaty. The Vatican City State, and the Internationally recognized State, of the Holy See.
The Vatican is not a recognized State at the UN. That is the Holy See, that is the recognized State.
This is where the confusion lies.
I get your confusion now.
All I can say is do you think everything at the UN makes sense? lol
There's no confusion Anna. All members of the UN are recognized by title of the State. Not the hierarchy that leads it. If the Vatican, a state on to itself, was the recognized body, it would be duly noted as. Seeing as the Vatican is a State, it is not, The Holy See is. Furthermore, they have two different and distinct passports. Denoting their independent individuality and separation.
No, I think the majority of the UN and its policies are garbage. But that is not in question here. The Lateran Treaty is what stipulates the separation.
Well I'm going to piss everyone in this thread right the effing hell off.
The Vatican is not a state. It is a religious administrative organization and really is more likely due the label of 'corporation' than state or even church.
The Vatican is not a state. It is a religious administrative organization and really is more likely due the label of 'corporation' than state or even church.
It could be that the UN views the RCC as an entity whose state is wherever it is rather than a particular part of real estate. But then as the Pope is the Bishop of the See, wherever he went would be the State of the RCC.
I just think the whole thing is goofy (like most of the rest of the UN) and if I were the UN, there'd be no recognition of the See as a state, just the Vatican.
I'd like to poke their version of what the Dalai Lama is the head of and if they recognize that as a sovereign state, too. lol
I just think the whole thing is goofy (like most of the rest of the UN) and if I were the UN, there'd be no recognition of the See as a state, just the Vatican.
I'd like to poke their version of what the Dalai Lama is the head of and if they recognize that as a sovereign state, too. lol
Canada is a corporation that operates on "political philosophy" as opposed to "spiritual philosophy"
Let's not get all bent out of shape peeps. This thread has the potential to go in a couple directions. One is positive the other not so.
Just so we keep it off the radar and avoid creating more work for Ron and Hazmart, lest try and focus on the topic. Please, with all due respects.
Just so we keep it off the radar and avoid creating more work for Ron and Hazmart, lest try and focus on the topic. Please, with all due respects.
So if I put up a website saying my house is a 'city state' would you believe that too. That is a website published by the Vatican. Notice the .va instead of .com or what ever. Sorry Anna, can't buy that one.
I suppose "Monaco" would not be a City State either.......
Not trying to derail...just making a comparison......
Not trying to derail...just making a comparison......
It's still not a state. At least not because it said so. I say I'm smart all the time but that doesn't make it true. The last place I would look is here. Vatican City State - Homepage. They will also tell you how to live and how to die like you can't think for yourself. I think this thread can go a long way if we avoid using the RCC as reference material for the affairs of actual countries and their interactions.
Isn't that a Principality?
I'm not going to argue with that eh1. I agree.
What nonsense. It's like condemning the UK because Jack the Ripper happened to have lived and murdered there.
The Holy See considers itself a State only as a diplomatic construct, useful to its sovereignty and mission. It refuses enrollment in international bodies, like the UN or the EU, and acts as, at most, an observer and counsel.
It's role is that the earthly representative, in fact, the Mystical Body of Christ, and a beacon to all nations of the (only) Way, the Truth and the Light.
It's role is not limited to borders, it serves a ecclial body of many nationalities.
In the case of Child Abuse scandal it has in fact centralized the Canonical prosecution of these cases in the Vatican to prevent the type of cover-ups and trivial consequences with which they were once dealt.
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Look guys, whatever the Vatican/Holy See is (state or not), what we should really focus on is the injustice. Nothing's going to happen if we determine the peramiters of a State. We need to find the best way to remove the issues with the Church about the children and the unchaste priests in Africa. We need to find away that doesn't damage the RCC as a whole, but at the same time fix the problem at the root.
?? A lot of Canada's suffixes (or whatever) are .ca and not .com, so?
Vatican City - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The CIA seems to think the Vatican is a state:
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/vt.html
Vatican City (Holy See): History, Geography, Government, and Culture — Infoplease.com
European Countries - Vatican City State
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