The embarrassment of the apostle

[Dexter Sinister]

The word نبوة in Arabic means "prophecy" and "prophet-hood";

I'll take your word for that, but we're working in English here, and prophecy and being a prophet are not the same word or idea in English. Your question has been answered, it just wasn't the question you thought you'd asked. The answer to the question you wanted to ask is that Bahá'u'lláh's a false prophet, the same as all other people who ever claimed to be a prophet or had others claim it on their behalf. There are no prophets in the religious sense of somebody who can say what a deity is going to do or what it wants, never have been, and never will be, because deities are human inventions that exist only as ideas.

 

[gerryh]

The answer to the question you wanted to ask is that Bahá'u'lláh's a false prophet, the same as all other people who ever claimed to be a prophet or had others claim it on their behalf. There are no prophets in the religious sense of somebody who can say what a deity is going to do or what it wants, never have been, and never will be, because deities are human inventions that exist only as ideas.

and you know this definitively how?

 

[eanassir]

I'll take your word for that, but we're working in English here, and prophecy and being a prophet are not the same word or idea in English. Your question has been answered, it just wasn't the question you thought you'd asked. The answer to the question you wanted to ask is that Bahá'u'lláh's a false prophet, the same as all other people who ever claimed to be a prophet or had others claim it on their behalf. There are no prophets in the religious sense of somebody who can say what a deity is going to do or what it wants, never have been, and never will be, because deities are human inventions that exist only as ideas.

Dexter, you are correct in the first part of this post of yours; anyhow the words prophecy, prophet and prophethood are related.

In the second part you are wrong; God is existing and is the genuine truth; and it is only the atheist that denies his Creator and so he denies His apostles.

And the wonders of the Quran have no end, some of which I may tell you later on.

 

[Johnnny]

I give the last 100 rounds to science boy who schooled the zealots

 

[AnnaG]

I'll take your word for that, but we're working in English here, and prophecy and being a prophet are not the same word or idea in English. Your question has been answered, it just wasn't the question you thought you'd asked. The answer to the question you wanted to ask is that Bahá'u'lláh's a false prophet, the same as all other people who ever claimed to be a prophet or had others claim it on their behalf. There are no prophets in the religious sense of somebody who can say what a deity is going to do or what it wants, never have been, and never will be, because deities are human inventions that exist only as ideas.

.... or at the very least, are unknowable.

 

[AnnaG]

In the second part you are wrong; God is existing and is the genuine truth;

That's merely a matter of opinion.

And the wonders of the Quran have no end, some of which I may tell you later on.

We await, breathlessly. lol

 

[Spade]

I though religious institutions were non profit?

 

[eanassir]

The Quran cannot be invented by Mohammed himself.

How is this true?

Prophet Mohammed passed in many situations where he was embarrassed by the mockery, ridicule and hurt of the idolaters and disbelievers.

Then he complained it to God, so God instructed him to show patience in facing the hurt and mockery of the disbelievers, and to forbear patiently all that.

Moreover, he was sad for that they did not believe, and God instructed him not to be sad.

( [O Mohammed] forbear patiently [the mockery and hurt of your people], yet is your patience only with the help of God. ​

And do not grieve for them, ​

nor let you[r chest] be straitened for what they devise.​

Surely, God is with those who ward off [the association and disobedience] and who are charitable [to the poor.])​

The above between brackets is the explanation of the Quran ayat 61: 127-128​

وَاصْبِرْ وَمَا صَبْرُكَ إِلاَّ بِاللّهِ وَلاَ تَحْزَنْ عَلَيْهِمْ وَلاَ تَكُ فِي ضَيْقٍ مِّمَّا يَمْكُرُونَ . إِنَّ اللّهَ مَعَ الَّذِينَ اتَّقَواْ وَّالَّذِينَ هُم مُّحْسِنُونَ​

http://www.quran-ayat.com/​

 

[AnnaG]

The Quran cannot be invented by Mohammed himself.

How is this true?

Prophet Mohammed passed in many situations where he was embarrassed by the mockery, ridicule and hurt of the idolaters and disbelievers.

Then he complained it to God, so God instructed him to show patience in facing the hurt and mockery of the disbelievers, and to forbear patiently all that.

Moreover, he was sad for that they did not believe, and God instructed him not to be sad.

( [O Mohammed] forbear patiently [the mockery and hurt of your people], yet is your patience only with the help of God. ​

And do not grieve for them, ​

nor let you[r chest] be straitened for what they devise.​

Surely, God is with those who ward off [the association and disobedience] and who are charitable [to the poor.])​

The above between brackets is the explanation of the Quran ayat 61: 127-128​

وَاصْبِرْ وَمَا صَبْرُكَ إِلاَّ بِاللّهِ وَلاَ تَحْزَنْ عَلَيْهِمْ وَلاَ تَكُ فِي ضَيْقٍ مِّمَّا يَمْكُرُونَ . إِنَّ اللّهَ مَعَ الَّذِينَ اتَّقَواْ وَّالَّذِينَ هُم مُّحْسِنُونَ​

http://www.quran-ayat.com/​

lol So the Quran says that the Quran could not have been written by a human. Interesting. I guess Muslims aren't very good at writing books then.
Lao Tzu wrote the Tao Te Ching, Vyasa or Badarayana wrote the Vedas, Shakespeare wrote lots of stuff, etc.

 

[eanassir]

Then his people kept up on hurting him and mocking him, and he again complained to God; so God told him also to forbear patiently all that.

([O Mohammed,] follow that which is revealed to you [from your Lord],

and forbear patiently [the hurt and denial of your people] until God shall judge [between you and them];

for He is the Best Of Judges [Who will let His religion prevail.] )


The above between brackets is the explanation of the Quran ayat 10: 109​

وَاتَّبِعْ مَا يُوحَى إِلَيْكَ وَاصْبِرْ حَتَّىَ يَحْكُمَ اللّهُ وَهُوَ خَيْرُ الْحَاكِمِينَ​

http://www.quran-ayat.com/​

 

[AnnaG]

Galileo was ridiculed, the Wright Bros. were ridiculed, etc. Life's a beach. lol

 

[eanassir]

Following that the idolaters went on in their denial and opposing Prophet Mohammed, and refusing to admit that the idols are false gods made of stone and that God Almighty alone is to be worshipped; ​

so the prophet was sad and depressed; therefore God instructed him once again to be patient towards them and their act against him.​

(And be steadfast with patience; for God surely does not waste the recompense of those who work righteousness.)​

The above between brackets is the explanation of the Quran aya 11: 115​

وَاصْبِرْ فَإِنَّ اللّهَ لاَ يُضِيعُ أَجْرَ الْمُحْسِنِينَ​

http://www.quran-ayat.com/​

 

[AnnaG]

I think it's selfish and petty to want to be the only god around that's worshipped. What a sad character it must be.

 

[eanassir]

Afterwards the hurt of the disbelievers increased more and more, and he prayed his Lord, who told him to keep up with patience.
(So forbear patiently to the commandment of your Lord: for surely you [Mohammed] are under Our observation. ​

And celebrate the praises of your Lord, when you rise up [from sleep.]​

And for the [first] part of the night praise Him, as also at the disappearance of the stars [in the late part of the night.])​

The above between brackets is the explanation of the Quran ayat 52: 48-49​

وَاصْبِرْ لِحُكْمِ رَبِّكَ فَإِنَّكَ بِأَعْيُنِنَا وَسَبِّحْ بِحَمْدِ رَبِّكَ حِينَ تَقُومُ ..الخ ​

http://www.quran-ayat.com/​

 

[Cliffy]

I think it's selfish and petty to want to be the only god around that's worshipped. What a sad character it must be.

It also sounds like Mohammad was always whining about people mocking him. Why else would there be so many passages dedicated to telling the wuss to buck up?

 

[eanassir]

So their mockery and ridiculing him was without cessation, and he complained to God Who revealed to him to show more patience.​

(And forbear patiently [O Mohammed] their [mocking] words, ​

and forsake them with good leaving [after you have warned them.])​

The above between brackets is the explanation of the Quran aya 73: 10​

وَاصْبِرْ عَلَى مَا يَقُولُونَ وَاهْجُرْهُمْ هَجْرًا جَمِيلًا​

http://www.quran-ayat.com/​

 

[eanassir]

Then the prophet decided and determined to forbear patiently all that, and said: My Lord, I shall forbear patiently their acts and words;

so God revealed to him the glad-tidings of victory over his enemies the idolaters and disbelievers:

(And We let the people [: the Children of Israel] that were abased [by Pharaoh] inherit all the east and the west of the land which We had blessed [with much trees and fruits]; ​

and perfectly was fulfilled the most fair promise of your Lord [O Mohammed] upon the Children of Israel, for that they endured patiently; ​

and We destroyed utterly the [idols and statues] that Pharaoh and his people had made and what ceilings they had been building [above those idols.])​

The above between brackets is the explanation of the Quran aya 7: 137
وَأَوْرَثْنَا الْقَوْمَ الَّذِينَ كَانُواْ يُسْتَضْعَفُونَ مَشَارِقَ الأَرْضِ وَمَغَارِبَهَا الَّتِي بَارَكْنَا فِيهَا وَتَمَّتْ كَلِمَتُ رَبِّكَ الْحُسْنَى عَلَى بَنِي إِسْرَآئِيلَ بِمَا صَبَرُواْ وَدَمَّرْنَا مَا كَانَ يَصْنَعُ فِرْعَوْنُ وَقَوْمُهُ وَمَا كَانُواْ يَعْرِشُونَ​

Therefore the prophet knew for certain that he will be victorious and his enemies will be defeated.​

The interpretation is according to the late interpreter of the Quran and Bible: Mohammed-Ali Hassan Al-Hilly.

http://www.quran-ayat.com/​

 

[Spade]

Galileo was ridiculed, the Wright Bros. were ridiculed, etc. Life's a beach. lol

The Wright brothers did not invent the aeroplane! It was George Cayley. The Wrights were poseurs!

 

[selin]

Well aren't you touchy.
My native language in English but why do you assume that my only resources are books critical of Islam. What. do you not think that I would actually read the Quran - albeit in my own language? and as far as the language of the Quran - if it was written in Arabic - and if all translations are suspect because they are not Arabic - then as far as i'm concerned it - and the religion - was only meant for Arabic peoples. The book does NOT speak to me, the religion does NOT speak to me. I'm not 'nervous', I'm not afraid. I was brought up as a Christian but after much introspection (and I probably know my bible better than many non-Arab Muslims understand their Quran, as they actually can't understand the language that they recite)I left it - because I read my Bible, I studied my religion and I found that I didn't believe it's fundamental pillars. Islam? I've read it and I find it to be an amalgam of religious 'stuff' gathered from Christianity and Judaism. Einasser - you - can tell me all you want about how wonderful Islam is, but all I see is plagarism.
As far as the original language of the bible? Which Bible - Old or New Testament?And as far as that goes, I've never heard any Christian scholar say that what is written in the New Testament is immutable. As far as the founders of the 'Three'? You have the Talmud: (it pretty much means instruction, or learning) is a central text of mainstream Judaism,regarding Jewish law, ethics, customs and history.And you have the Torah which pretty much refers to the first 5 books of the Old Testament. funny thin g about the Talmud and the Torah, is that there is an acceptance that they are not written in stone and that as the world changes, so does the law. the basics re,main the same - you should not murder, you should not commit adultery, but like life, these books change. And what's your issue with whatever language these texts were written in anyway?
Your statement, how can you be so sure that everything happened just as you have said just reading some books for criticisms about Islam? " - huh? how about you telling me how some guy from Arabia can pontificate on the history of a people he knows nothing about? Just because Mohammed might wanted to think it happened that way doesn't mean it did. I can say God tells me things - it doesn't mean she did, but hey, all I need to do is to be a good salesman and who knows - I might be able to start a whole new religion.
Whatever, but I'll tell you this, DON'T ever assume that my dislike of Islam has anything to do with my just reading some critical books. I do my due diligence - I critique Islam the same way i critique Islam - I read the good, the bad and the ugly. Tell me - what do you read - if you actually do read?

first of all, i am sorry to have been a bit touchy yesterday but sometimes prejudices make me mad. Getting angry with prejudices, i have also gained some prejuducies that foreigns read just critics or watch tv and learn the things about Islam in that way but really , most of the non-muslim do that exept you and some.

the reason why i think your post is a bit unreasonable is that you try to convince as if you saw everything. i feel it necessary to investigate more about even a WRITTEN book( Koran) and be aware of being far away any rumours and comments which would make my mind change in a unpleasant way conradictory with my ideas, the contrast you can talk easly about a story TOLD as if you were in that time .

please , don't be so know-all, even if you were a prophet, or a saint, you shouldn't trust on your studies so much or claim that you know everything better than anyone. i don't try to say that i am better , we don't know that but the clear one is that religion is an issue having to do with faith and perception of the universe with some sources to be said as a guidance, not some subjective surveys.
you don't have to like Islam or anything else and i don't try to show that we are in better way beliving in Islam may be you are right, who knows? but i chosed a path for me eliminating the others and think Islam more reasonable than the others with my own free desire finding something which most of muslims don't know about( if you are interested in the reason why i chose Islam , i can explain, really)

i also studied about religions. if there weren't Islam, i would be a Samanist not others.

The last words to all, please try to seek without prejudices as if you would believe(then go on not believing) ,then you can see what you may miss out or you can feel really sure of what you are talking about .

 

[Dexter Sinister]

and you know this definitively how?

I don't claim to know it definitively, and if you'd asked the questions I'd have qualified my responses differently based on what I know of the way you think. You'd probably have asked the questions differently too. What I claim is that the weight of evidence is heavily in favour of my position, not eanassir's, such that it's the only reasonable conclusion. It may be wrong, but the evidence would have to be powerfully convincing. I know of no such evidence that doesn't admit of much simpler explanations.