Canada Pays More For Monarchy Than UK
- Thread starter dumpthemonarchy
- Start date
That's close to one of the most incorrect statements on this thread.
There's a pretty big chunk of Quebec that wants constitutional change - they want out.
Or perhaps the biggest road block to constitutional change is juvenile anti-Quebec sentiment like yours...
When I want to cheer up someone, I usually show them a couple of Gerry's posts... They laugh instantly..
As others in this thread, there would be massive divides with no resolution: the Prairie provinces would want one thing (Alberta might want something different from the other two as well), BC would want another, Ontario another, Quebec a 4th option, and the Maritimes would want a 5th. Logically I can see some basis for agreement among the smaller population regions, but I don't think the way the country is divided regionally that they would ever find something to bridge that gap.
Quite so, Wulfie. Dumpthemonarchy has posted a poll showing that a majority of Quebecois support getting rid of monarchy. I suppose it is reasonable to expect that French Quebec wants to get rid of British monarchy. However, Quebec will have its own alternative as to what it should be replaced with, and very likely will throw a tantrum if it doesn’t get its way. Talk of independence or autonomy will become widespread.
There is really no reason, no incentive for provinces to agree on an alternative, it is just not a burning issue. If Canadians really are in favor of getting rid of monarchy, then the first task before anti-monarchists is to raise the profile of the issue, make it into a burning issue. Unless that is accomplished, nothing will get done.
Quite so, Wulfie. Dumpthemonarchy has posted a poll showing that a majority of Quebecois support getting rid of monarchy. I suppose it is reasonable to expect that French Quebec wants to get rid of British monarchy. However, Quebec will have its own alternative as to what it should be replaced with, and very likely will throw a tantrum if it doesn’t get its way. Talk of independence or autonomy will become widespread.
There is really no reason, no incentive for provinces to agree on an alternative, it is just not a burning issue. If Canadians really are in favor of getting rid of monarchy, then the first task before anti-monarchists is to raise the profile of the issue, make it into a burning issue. Unless that is accomplished, nothing will get done.
I also see a problem with the referendum. While referendum is not necessary (nor binding), it will be a useful first step. It will be nonsense to hold a referendum on whether monarchy should be abolished, without also specifying the alternative.
And that is where the problem will come. Some people may want to get rid of the monarchy, but may think that the alternative proposed is worse than monarchy. So even if they may be against monarchy, they may vote to preserve the monarchy, because they don’t like the alternative.
In Australia the anti-monarchists were quite confident of winning at the start of the campaign. In the end they lost convincingly.
And that is where the problem will come. Some people may want to get rid of the monarchy, but may think that the alternative proposed is worse than monarchy. So even if they may be against monarchy, they may vote to preserve the monarchy, because they don’t like the alternative.
In Australia the anti-monarchists were quite confident of winning at the start of the campaign. In the end they lost convincingly.
I agree that it is outdated. However, it works reasonably well, and will be difficult to get rid of.
I suggest we live things just the way they are.
Countries around the world envy our political system and I personally see no reason to scrap it.
I think it is disingenuous to complain about the cost of the Governor General or the Lieutenant Governors.
Our political system and constitution was repatriated years ago.
Canada in no legal or political way answers to the UK and never will.
The GG and the LG's are simply names referring to components of our legislative systems.
Complaining about their costs is like complaining about the cost of printing the Queens head on our money or naming the RCMP the RCMP.
It means nothing its just a name and a tradition and it has nothing to do with costs.
But I do understand that the Quebecois would like to purge all traces of the monarchy from Canada's history.
And so I would assume would posters with the name "DumptheMonarchy".
And I do realize that some folks may dislike or even despise Canada's history and traditions but that's your thing not mine.
So assuming we are not going to reopen the constitutional debate and all that entails it seems to me that the GG and LG's are safe for the moment.
Anyway I like Michaelle Jean and I think she is doing a heck of a job.
Lucky to have her I say.
So lets just talk about the few mill it costs us to host the Royal's.
Frankly I could care less if they came over here or not.
Most of us agree they are simply traditional figureheads of times gone by.
But are they useful?
I think maybe so.
It gives Canada another attachment and communication pipeline to the UK and hence the EU.
Granted the Royal's are primarily ceremonial in function but make no mistake they do have contacts and linkages to the very highest levels of government in the UK.
And if the chips were really down having a backdoor to the highest level of government within the UK possibly could be handy.
Is that worth having?
Again I think possibly so.
After all its all about connections and linkages and networking.
The UK is probably as good an ally to have as any and I think networking into the EU community is probably not a bad idea for Canada.
I think Canada needs to establish as many and as diverse a group of links as it can get.
Which brings me to the Commonwealth thing.
Why not be a member?
It's another set of linkages that Canada could possibly use for trade or business purposes.
I see nothing wrong with exploiting our common past with Australia, New Zealand, Singapore or India.
Maybe we could make a buck or two at it.
Anything to diversify our connections and trade partners I say.
And what does it cost really as far as the Royal's are concerned?
20 or 30 million?
For a few parades and a couple of royal visits.
Thats peanuts.
And if we can wangle a few trade deals and network ourselves into high levels of EU government or influence it's REALLY peanuts.
So forgive me if I seem ruthless about the whole deal but I could care less about the parades and visits.
For me its all about Canadian business and influence and trade.
So I can see why Americans and American lovers would oppose Canada improving its non-American foreign connections.
And I can see why the anti-federalist Quebecois would be opposed.
But really, what in the long haul is most advantageous for Canada?
My opinion is to exploit it to the hilt.
Trex
Countries around the world envy our political system and I personally see no reason to scrap it.
I think it is disingenuous to complain about the cost of the Governor General or the Lieutenant Governors.
Our political system and constitution was repatriated years ago.
Canada in no legal or political way answers to the UK and never will.
The GG and the LG's are simply names referring to components of our legislative systems.
Complaining about their costs is like complaining about the cost of printing the Queens head on our money or naming the RCMP the RCMP.
It means nothing its just a name and a tradition and it has nothing to do with costs.
But I do understand that the Quebecois would like to purge all traces of the monarchy from Canada's history.
And so I would assume would posters with the name "DumptheMonarchy".
And I do realize that some folks may dislike or even despise Canada's history and traditions but that's your thing not mine.
So assuming we are not going to reopen the constitutional debate and all that entails it seems to me that the GG and LG's are safe for the moment.
Anyway I like Michaelle Jean and I think she is doing a heck of a job.
Lucky to have her I say.
So lets just talk about the few mill it costs us to host the Royal's.
Frankly I could care less if they came over here or not.
Most of us agree they are simply traditional figureheads of times gone by.
But are they useful?
I think maybe so.
It gives Canada another attachment and communication pipeline to the UK and hence the EU.
Granted the Royal's are primarily ceremonial in function but make no mistake they do have contacts and linkages to the very highest levels of government in the UK.
And if the chips were really down having a backdoor to the highest level of government within the UK possibly could be handy.
Is that worth having?
Again I think possibly so.
After all its all about connections and linkages and networking.
The UK is probably as good an ally to have as any and I think networking into the EU community is probably not a bad idea for Canada.
I think Canada needs to establish as many and as diverse a group of links as it can get.
Which brings me to the Commonwealth thing.
Why not be a member?
It's another set of linkages that Canada could possibly use for trade or business purposes.
I see nothing wrong with exploiting our common past with Australia, New Zealand, Singapore or India.
Maybe we could make a buck or two at it.
Anything to diversify our connections and trade partners I say.
And what does it cost really as far as the Royal's are concerned?
20 or 30 million?
For a few parades and a couple of royal visits.
Thats peanuts.
And if we can wangle a few trade deals and network ourselves into high levels of EU government or influence it's REALLY peanuts.
So forgive me if I seem ruthless about the whole deal but I could care less about the parades and visits.
For me its all about Canadian business and influence and trade.
So I can see why Americans and American lovers would oppose Canada improving its non-American foreign connections.
And I can see why the anti-federalist Quebecois would be opposed.
But really, what in the long haul is most advantageous for Canada?
My opinion is to exploit it to the hilt.
Trex
My view and the view of many others who don't believe a role as fundamentally important as Head of State should be appointed by a system which relies on the reproductive capacities of a foreign family...
Thanks for pointing out what has already been said before. What would we ever do without you?
Sorry, sir impleton, you can't hit a nerve like that. And your attempts are getting more and more feeble the more you try. You are as full of assumptions as the Bible. Perhaps you and it evolved in parallel.
Make the GG a ceremonial president
Yes, as do Iceland, Germany, Portugal, Ireland, Austria, Italy, .... All are stable and prosperous. Most members of the Commonwealth are republics as well, with that organization being the only connection to the British monarchy. We can have the same here in Canada by constitutionally codifying the role and responsibilities of the GG (rather than the unwritten conventions and precedents of now) and democratizing the selection process. Once we do that, then cut the link to the monarchy. Canada will then be 100 percent independent. That is the main motivation. Otherwise, we are just a pseudo-colony pretending to be an independent nation.
Yes, as do Iceland, Germany, Portugal, Ireland, Austria, Italy, .... All are stable and prosperous. Most members of the Commonwealth are republics as well, with that organization being the only connection to the British monarchy. We can have the same here in Canada by constitutionally codifying the role and responsibilities of the GG (rather than the unwritten conventions and precedents of now) and democratizing the selection process. Once we do that, then cut the link to the monarchy. Canada will then be 100 percent independent. That is the main motivation. Otherwise, we are just a pseudo-colony pretending to be an independent nation.
Yes it is that simple. The only problem is people like you with no ability to think for yourself and too lazy to try something new.
Over 300 years and still hanging on to the poodles apron strings. Haven't contributed much have you? Just keep the peons in the colonies down.