Private Schools vs. Public Schools

[JLM]

Have to disagree with you. Life is a place for making fashion and economic statements. One must learn to deal with these things in a timely fashion, throwing someone into the real world with no experience with apparent class barriers isn't being fair to a person.

Children need to develop social skills in a real social environment, not a sterile one.

"Freedom of expression does not extend to students." I never made that statement. If you are going to discredit me, then do it honestly. All you done here is compromised your own credibility.

 

[Ariadne]

The reason for this is what I am claiming and offering evidence of: it is the socioeconomic status of the students that accounts for this.

I suppose so, but not exclusively. Private schools locally are several thousand dollars, and overseas are about 40k annually. Those that can afford the private school, with classroom ratios of sometimes 9 students per teacher, have a better chance of seeing their children educated. Public schools often have up to 32 students per teacher, which means about 1-2 minutes per student per class - if they're lucky. Many students slip through the cracks.

Public school teachers are overworked, and often desperate to obtain permanent certification and jump hoops. They over extend themselves, are climbing all over each other to get ahead, and often the student is a low priority. Once teachers have their permanent certification (anytime after 2 years), they are tenured, and basically cannot be fired without doing something criminal. Public school teachers are not all bad, but the good ones are few and far between.

Public schools typically have a no fail policy until the student reaches high school, so parents often don't realize that their children can't spell, do cursive writing, or divide until grade 10. Parents that can afford private school often choose that option because they realize their children have learned nothing in public school - that is, the children need to learn or their life long opportunities will be handicapped. Given the choice of spending 40k on a new car, or their child's education, they choose education.

 

[JLM]

I suppose so, but not exclusively. Private schools locally are several thousand dollars, and overseas are about 40k annually. Those that can afford the private school, with classroom ratios of sometimes 9 students per teacher, have a better chance of seeing their children educated. Public schools often have up to 32 students per teacher, which means about 1-2 minutes per student per class - if they're lucky. Many students slip through the cracks.

Public school teachers are overworked, and often desperate to obtain permanent certification and jump hoops. They over extend themselves, are climbing all over each other to get ahead, and often the student is a low priority. Once teachers have their permanent certification (anytime after 2 years), they are tenured, and basically cannot be fired without doing something criminal. Public school teachers are not all bad, but the good ones are few and far between.

Public schools typically have a no fail policy until the student reaches high school, so parents often don't realize that their children can't spell, do cursive writing, or divide until grade 10. Parents that can afford private school often choose that option because they realize their children have learned nothing in public school - that is, the children need to learn or their life long opportunities will be handicapped. Given the choice of spending 40k on a new car, or their child's education, they choose education.

Yep, not failing students is sure not preparing them for the real world. I think one of the main problems with young people today is that many of them have never been forced to face disappointment (while others of course have faced nothing but disappointment)

 

[YukonJack]

My children got their education from G9 to G12/13 in a private school.

Expensive, but the best decision I ever made.

 

[TenPenny]

One of the biggest reasons that kids from better socioeconomic status do better than other kids is because their parents are involved, and these kids typically are busy learning and developing over the summer, going to summer camps, etc etc.

Parents who are involved with their kids and motivate them will help their kids be successful.

My older daughter goes to what has to be the worst school in the city, from the setting/neighborhood/societal point of view. It's dismal, but the Province won't allow the district to move it.

 

[GreenFish66]

Great thread ..The ol private vs public schools debate...

Not sure if I have any extra points of value to contribute on this subject..All the sides are pretty much covered, but I'll throw it out there anyway..

Private schools have more opportunities then common public schools...More funding from it's source..Rich parents ..

Most can't afford a private school and it is far more convienent to put their child in a communitee public school close to their house...Private school is not an real option for most.Have to make the best out of what we have...

.As for uniforms..It might be beneficial for public schools to go to uniforms..Cheaper for cloths in the long run..But a public school is just that ..A Public school..Kids have to learn how to deal with , and accept their common neighbours (regardless of class)and find their own place in it...Part of that quest for individuality is finding your style /image/your friends/Your voice/Your place given your reality.It's about finding Your confidence to keep going no matter what the probable future holds...Your must find your likes and dislikes and then try to convince others ..along with your group of friends..Your way is as acceptable as anyone elses...

To fit in ..given your circumstances

A lot of factories still allow you to wear what you want..but more so ever year more industrial jobs now require slave drones to wear uniforms...Although they still wear jeans and a t-shirt underneath..

Problem is the factories charge the employees for the uniform!...

A private school student has a set future ..It is fine to try to mold them into that image..

A public student is more than likely gong to be responsible for his/her own future with no $$ or sustainable future prospect.All the best to them..

Let the children /parents do all they can to find their own way...Public school teachers are there to teach the basics..instill individuality..confindence..acceptance of all others equally..regardless of beliefs or upbringing..


Public school parents just want a good life for their kids ..knowing the realities of their situation..


Private school teachers are there to direct/dictate their students into a certain /specialized field of work..prepare them to get ready for college/university..More disipline is required

Private school parents are mostly already established in the carreer world and have a focused specialized field of study they would like their children to follow in..More choices /better options

High class /or no class seems to be the deciding factor in the private/public school paradigm...

Good thread ...Just thought I'd throw my two cents in..Point or not...

Frogive me for my spew ..I was a simple ex-public school student who had to fight for everyhting I have..That's not a lot..Still can't get my book published...Not in the book club..!lol...

 

[YukonJack]

As I said in an other thread, my kids graduated in a private school. Wore uniforms for four years, were proud of it.

TenPenny, you appear to be totally inexperienced in this field. But I respect your opinion.

 

[YukonJack]

"Private schools have more opportunities then common public schools...More funding from it's source..Rich parents .."

Aren't you being just a tad stereotypical, GreenFish66??

Let me assure you, when our kids were in private school, we were far from being "RICH". We paid our 18% mortgage, thanks to Democrats in the U.S. and Liberals in Canada.

Willing to make sacrifices for the future of your children is not the same as being rich.

 

[JLM]

My children got their education from G9 to G12/13 in a private school.

Expensive, but the best decision I ever made.

That's good Y.J. I personally don't see much wrong with private schools, unless it's that in some private school graduates I have noticed a hint of narrow mindedness and possibly a little less tolerance for others. Maybe that's not true - just an old codger nattering.

 

[Cliffy]

All this is rather moot in view of the utter chaos on our streets and in the economy. The problem is not whether or not kids are learning more in one environment or another but that what we are teaching our kids have no real meaning or human value in the world. Our priorities and value systems are all back asswards.

What we teach our kids about success is that to be so is to beat everybody up around them in order to get ahead of them on the socio/economic ladder. "Look out for number one" is a stupid way to look at life and is why we are rearing children with no respect for anybody, who are greedy and have no idea how to survive without their electronic gadgets and mindless drivel on TV.

This whole debate is the beyond silly when our priorities as a society are so mixed up, so directionless, that life has become meaningless, mindless consumerism. Our economy, politics and social structures are based on consumerism and is bringing us to the brink of self annihilation. Time to pull our collective heads out of our collective asses and look around at where our "thinking" is getting us.

 

[L Gilbert]

Have to agree to disagree on that. School is not the place for making a fashion statement or displaying financial status and uniforms just take away one more distraction.

Yup. Ever since uniforms went by the wayside, we haven't had any bright kids. :roll:
I went to a school that had us all running around in uniforms. A few of us kept in touch afterwards and none of our grades dropped after we left and started wearing normal clothes. And when we went places no-one made stupid jokes about us as they did when we had uniforms on. It got so bad that the headmaster had us put on normal clothes when we went out. (We weren't allowed to deck any of the bigmouths).

 

[L Gilbert]

"Private schools have more opportunities then common public schools...More funding from it's source..Rich parents .."

Aren't you being just a tad stereotypical, GreenFish66??

Let me assure you, when our kids were in private school, we were far from being "RICH". We paid our 18% mortgage, thanks to Democrats in the U.S. and Liberals in Canada.

Willing to make sacrifices for the future of your children is not the same as being rich.

Same with my parents and the 3 years I spent in private school. My father was a machinery operator and then became a school janitor (no I don't normally use PC terms) and my mother ran a department in the local Hudson's Bay store. Hardly rich.

 

[karrie]

Have to disagree with you. Life is a place for making fashion and economic statements. One must learn to deal with these things in a timely fashion, throwing someone into the real world with no experience with apparent class barriers isn't being fair to a person.

Children need to develop social skills in a real social environment, not a sterile one.

I agree. Personally, I don't think I'd put my kids in a school with uniforms. Private or public, I'd look for a new school.

 

[L Gilbert]

All this is rather moot in view of the utter chaos on our streets and in the economy. The problem is not whether or not kids are learning more in one environment or another but that what we are teaching our kids have no real meaning or human value in the world. Our priorities and value systems are all back asswards.

Society is chaotic, not just ass-backwards and that's why priorities are screwy..

What we teach our kids about success is that to be so is to beat everybody up around them in order to get ahead of them on the socio/economic ladder. "Look out for number one" is a stupid way to look at life and is why we are rearing children with no respect for anybody, who are greedy and have no idea how to survive without their electronic gadgets and mindless drivel on TV.

Sometimes it seems that way. Some kids manage to keep their heads (with help) and steer a good path through life, though.

This whole debate is the beyond silly when our priorities as a society are so mixed up, so directionless, that life has become meaningless, mindless consumerism. Our economy, politics and social structures are based on consumerism and is bringing us to the brink of self annihilation. Time to pull our collective heads out of our collective asses and look around at where our "thinking" is getting us.

Pretty much.

 

[YukonJack]

Private schools MUST BE superior to public schools.

Name one single elected official who does NOT send their kids to private school.

 

[karrie]

Oh... another reason I really like the school that we're in...

I can walk into that school and take my kids out for a week, for a month, whatever I need, with no griping about school work etc., because FAMILY IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN COURSE WORK. They'll still do their best to support me with some work at home, etc., or to catch the kids up when we get back, but there is no complaining if there is something going on in the family that is interfering with their attendance or the completion of their homework, etc.

Some private or separate schools will not hold that kind of attitude. It's all about scoring superior grades.

So my tale and preaching continues... find the school that fits your kids, public, private, separate, and put them in it. Ignore the statistics, because they only apply to the grand scheme, and do what's best for YOUR kid.

 

[Cliffy]

Private schools MUST BE superior to public schools.

Name one single elected official who does NOT send their kids to private school.

Now there is a very good reason to keep your kids out of private schools: they breed greedy, ignorant politicians.:lol:

 

[Niflmir]

So my tale and preaching continues... find the school that fits your kids, public, private, separate, and put them in it. Ignore the statistics, because they only apply to the grand scheme, and do what's best for YOUR kid.

That is solid advice, for sure.

I just had an axe to grind. Coming from a public school, I feel quite proud of the level of education I was exposed to. I had some excellent teachers. (Also some not so excellent ones, what can you do?)

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Quoting Ariadne
It seems that students from private schools tend to score higher on provincial exams - could have something to do with student teacher ratios.

The reason for this is what I am claiming and offering evidence of: it is the socioeconomic status of the students that accounts for this.

I agree Niflmir, private schools can pick and choose who they let in. They let in only the best and the brightest from all the applications they receive. Public schools must let everybody in, regardless of their background. So it is hardly far to compare the two.

I can recall an analogous situation. Asians in North America tend to be upper middle class professionals, with average income higher than that of whites. Their children often excel in school; in competitions etc. (the latest spelling bee champion is an Asian girl).

Is that because Asians are more intelligent than whites (or blacks)? Not really, the immigration policies of USA and Canada admitted only the professional, the cream of the crop from places like India and Pakistan. So naturally they would score higher compared to whites. You are comparing cream of the crop of Asian society with the entire white society.

 

[SirJosephPorter]

That's good Y.J. I personally don't see much wrong with private
schools, unless it's that in some private school graduates I have noticed a hint of narrow mindedness and possibly a little less tolerance for others. Maybe that's not true - just an old codger nattering.

That indeed is a disadvantage of public schools, the kids are mostly exposed to other rich kids, they develop a narrow, provincial outlook. I haven’t seen any studies in this respect, but I wonder if students from private schools grow up to be mostly conservatives?