Younger Generation - Dumb or Stupid or Both- Yes or No

[TenPenny]

At work before I retired, the company, like most companies would hire students for summer relief.
We always got the usual, smart ,dumb, good workers and lazy bums in about the same ratio as the working adults.
This young man worked on my crew that summer, all thumbs when doing manual labour, but he was always looking for an easier way to do something, which unlike others, I didn’t hold against him.
So one day at lunch time he comes to ask about a job we had to do that afternoon, that usually took one hour , using overhead hoists, cable, and other mechanical lifts (no need to describe the job in details)

After having done that job with us a few times, he explained to me how it could be done easier and faster.
His idea made so much sense that I went and talked to the whole crew about it…
All of the guys said …”We have been doing it a certain way for years, it’s not the time to change”
Except the crew leader….he agreed with me that since the machine was shut down for the whole day this was the perfect time to experiment.
So when it was time to do the job, he stayed with the crew leader to direct the tradesmen that were also involved in the operation.
Instead of taking one hour, the job took 40 minutes and the manual labour part was a lot easier,
That job has been done that way since……

The only thing I hold against that kid, is that he went on to become a lawyer…….

Sometimes, smart and lazy is a good combination.

 

[Praxius]

Younger Generation - Dumb or Stupid or Both- Yes or No

I see in my work a large number of 18 to 25 or year old persons

I see some in supervisory position with no interpersonal skills what so ever. And yes they send emails and cannot even be bothered to use the auto spell check.

I see employees that have the same talents as mentioned above

I see many who need help to even change their mind - the inability to think a simple problem through to a conclusion is unbelievable

I see this day after day.

I see a lack of ethics - both moral and work - They will blame someone else when something goes wrong instead of facing the music.

I see losers that will go through life complaining about everything that is wrong yet do nothing to change the situation

And yes men are the majority.

And no this is not all but a substantial number.

Then I see the others that will be highly successful in life.

And how old are you?

Do you remember what you were like at those ages?

Do you even know what others thought of you when you came on board at that age?

Chances are they thought you were just as dumb and limited in thinking as well.... as least a good portion of your co-workers at the job you were at at that age thought that.

The thing is, at that age range, you have limited hands-on experience compared to someone in their 30's or 40's..... you either just got out of high school or just got out of college and just because you just got out of college doesn't automatically mean you're any better then the person who just came out of high school since while you may have more education under your belt, you still lacked the hands-on experience.

I remember growing up as a child hearing the people on TV and the radios claim the new generation coming in were stupid and a bunch of stuck up morons who thought they were experienced and knew it all..... then when my generation came in, it was the same thing from that same generation who was called stupid and dumb....... and now here's my generation doing the exact same thing.

You know what?

My parents generation was called the same thing in the 70's...... and those before them in the 60's..... yup..... and 50's??

This mentality is nothing new..... and it proves nothing.

Many of those mistakes you listed above are mistakes I made when I first came into the work force which I don't make anymore.... but I'll admit I'm not perfect and I still make mistakes sometimes, though certainly not as many as I used to..... and I have employees here where I work who are in their 40's, 50's and one who was in his 60's who make just as many mistakes as I, if not more and I end up fixing them for them....... what does that tell you about them? Should I brand their generations as you branded this generation you're complaining about?

...... and not accepting blame?

I guess you forgot what it's like being the new guy on the job who's younger then everybody else there, who's continually reminded that you have no experience, who's always put in the spot light to prove themselves because if you screw up, you'll easily be replaced because there's a whole line up of others like you waiting at the door to take your place for that piddily amount of money tossed at you.

Yeah, they have no pressure on them to avoid screw ups....... yes.... it's completely realistic to expect them to perform just as good, if not better then you or someone else with more experience and know-how of how things work there.

Do you even know what it's like to be in a supervisory position over people twice your age who look at you with contempt and smugness that they're taking orders from a child... who are just waiting for one excuse to get them tossed out on their ass?

You see their problems and flaws shine out perfectly like a lighthouse beacon, simply because of their age and lack of experience and somehow think their problems are far worse then anything you had to go through at that age..... and because they're still trying to gain experience and the pressure to prove themselves makes them sometimes cut corners or miss a few steps..... they're a bunch of morons compared to your genius'ness.

Maybe instead of trashing the crap out of them and treating them like idiots who should be working at Dairy Queen, you should actually try and help them.... be their friend..... toss in a few pointers that you had to learn over the years.

Maybe then they might not seem like such douches, grow up a little faster and make the whole workplace seem a little better for everyone...... as I'm pretty damn sure you needed help at some point too and those older then you seeing you walk in the door for the first time thought you were just as stupid and just as ignorant as you see these fresh faces.

The more things change, the more they stay the same....... some people just seem to forget their own earlier experiences.

Sure.... maybe you were really good at what you did....... and chances are you also acted like you were really good at what you did....... and I bet a few others you worked with complimented you on your abilities and good a worker you were...... and I also bet there were even more who mocked you behind your back and were jealous of your position at such a young age, who focused on the little petty things you screwed up on or what they saw as you avoiding responsibility and pinning it on someone else...... who thought you were stupid and shouldn't be in the position you are in and only ass-kissed those who put you there.

Sure, there's always one or two people who are truly morons and should never be in the position they're in, who always pass blame onto the other person...... the guy I mentioned in his 60's I worked with was one of them and everybody else around him were always trying to fix his screw ups, because he simply didn't give a damn..... he was retiring soon anyways so what did it matter to him?

Should I brand his entire generation with the same brush as you are doing?

No.

 

[critter171]

Younger Generation - Dumb or Stupid or Both- Yes or No

I see in my work a large number of 18 to 25 or year old persons
So what is wrong with this?

I see some in supervisory position with no interpersonal skills what so ever. And yes they send emails and cannot even be bothered to use the auto spell check.
so wait you looking into something that none of your buisnesss from the start i am sure the business rather make money than worry about using spell check.


I see employees that have the same talents as mentioned above

Do you really know there talent your just judging by a far away?

I see many who need help to even change their mind - the inability to think a simple problem through to a conclusion is unbelievable
Ladies change there mind all there time. to think simple? really how do you know if its simple or not without knowing what it is?

I see this day after day.

No your just see what you wanna see there a diffrence.

I see a lack of ethics - both moral and work - They will blame someone else when something goes wrong instead of facing the music.

Oh yea that so true oh wait... how many adults have also plan school how many of you have blame the adults for your own fault oh wait .... you don't here the music yourself.

I see losers that will go through life complaining about everything that is wrong yet do nothing to change the situation

everyone complains this is nothing new

And yes men are the majority.

can you acutally proe this have you been to each and every job to know anything base on this than where you work? no so this it just a huge assumption

And no this is not all but a substantial number.

Then I see the others that will be highly successful in life.

You talk about younger greation being stupid yet you adults can't accpet the fact gays should have a right to marriage and we view our own future. not base on what you guys want. We know what we want. and were already ahead of you by the time you got to our age.

shameful that many adults can't give people there rights..... yet young people are not afraid to stand up for there rights or other people rights.

 

[Praxius]

Well we both know along with others on this Forum that you and I disagree -

The facility i work at had at one point over 800 employees - Then the reoged the place opened another building and moved the admin staff all in to one working place.

As to the mirror - Shove it up your asssse -

No i alwys do not use spell check - good you and Jbeee have something in common

Again shove the mirror up your miserable asssses

A perfect example of what I was just saying.... maybe you should get a browser that spell checks for you too before you bitch at others for the exact same mistakes.

And your cocky attitude towards someone's view you don't agree with?

Yeah..... you're so much better then the people you're complaining about. :roll:

The generation before you acted, talked and treated people like you just as you are doing right now to the next........ As the world turns, these are the days of our lives.

Well Gerry i had to quit school at an early age - it supported my mother, brother and sister. So guess what - Fujk you.

Awwww.... now the poor old coot is avoiding responsibility and passing blame onto others for his misfortune..... :lol: Where did I hear this from before?

I worked my ass of to get where I am today - so hung up on spell check and those that do not use it - manyou are fuked.

No, it seems you are because you're so stuck up your own generation's omnipotence, you can't even see reality for what it truly is.

You worked your ass off?

Who the hell hasn't? I worked my damn ass off too..... yet I was still treated with the same crap attitude your dishing to these kids, acting as though they're breezing through.

Maybe you breezed through by continually playing the sob card of your poor hard life and people gave you sympathy for your plight........ see how this works?

You are one miserable sob and bring it every wheres you travel - So stop jumping on me - find an old mattress and some Vaseline.

What's the problem? Can't take what you dish out?

Guess it sucks to be you.

At work before I retired, the company, like most companies would hire students for summer relief.
We always got the usual, smart ,dumb, good workers and lazy bums in about the same ratio as the working adults.
This young man worked on my crew that summer, all thumbs when doing manual labour, but he was always looking for an easier way to do something, which unlike others, I didn’t hold against him.
So one day at lunch time he comes to ask about a job we had to do that afternoon, that usually took one hour , using overhead hoists, cable, and other mechanical lifts (no need to describe the job in details)

After having done that job with us a few times, he explained to me how it could be done easier and faster.
His idea made so much sense that I went and talked to the whole crew about it…
All of the guys said …”We have been doing it a certain way for years, it’s not the time to change”
Except the crew leader….he agreed with me that since the machine was shut down for the whole day this was the perfect time to experiment.
So when it was time to do the job, he stayed with the crew leader to direct the tradesmen that were also involved in the operation.
Instead of taking one hour, the job took 40 minutes and the manual labour part was a lot easier,
That job has been done that way since……

The only thing I hold against that kid, is that he went on to become a lawyer…….

Exactly..... there are going to be people pissed that some kid came along with a better idea on how to do things then what they've been doing...... but that's the way it goes.

When I went into photography and worked on grad photos and school photo packages..... the process of cropping, color correcting and packaging the files in the program we were using took close to 2 minutes per person...... with hundreds and hundreds of packages of students per school of dozens of schools each year..... that was a considerable amount of time I thought.

Eventually I got fed up and took a couple of hours out of the day to work on my own process to make it more streamlined, against the wishes of the owner, simply because we didn't have the time to screw around with it.

I knew I could do it and I went ahead and did it.

I cut down each package process from close to 2 minutes..... down to less then 35 seconds each...... obviously my process replaced the old one, but did I ever get a thanks or a good job-pat on the back for my work?

No..... I was still the 21 year old kid who didn't know a lump of sh*t from a cob of corn...... even when I also improved their color correcting process and retouching process of grad photos to look more professional and more realistic.

It seems most of the older generations get pissy about the new generation coming in because they think what they spent all their life doing is better and doesn't need fixing...... but I at least hope that when the new generation starts to tred on my territory, I don't start thinking that way and I actually help them to be better then I am...... that's how it's supposed to work.

 

[karrie]

A couple thoughts on the matter.

1...You date yourself when you complain about the kids nowadays... lol.

2...Older generations have lived in fear of the stupidity and folly of the younger generation for all of written human history.

3...The youth society turns out are a malleable product. How children develop, how they learn, is affected largely by their environment. The fact that they've turned out different than previous generations says nothing about their faculty, it only shows that the environment they were tailored to has changed since your generation was raised (which is why my point number 2 has repeated itself throughout history).

 

[ironsides]

Younger Generation - Dumb or Stupid or Both- Yes or No

I see in my work a large number of 18 to 25 or year old persons

I see some in supervisory position with no interpersonal skills what so ever. And yes they send emails and cannot even be bothered to use the auto spell check.

I see employees that have the same talents as mentioned above

I see many who need help to even change their mind - the inability to think a simple problem through to a conclusion is unbelievable

I see this day after day.

I see a lack of ethics - both moral and work - They will blame someone else when something goes wrong instead of facing the music.

I see losers that will go through life complaining about everything that is wrong yet do nothing to change the situation

And yes men are the majority.

And no this is not all but a substantial number.

Then I see the others that will be highly successful in life.

Don't blame the younger generation for what they are, after all we are the ones who made them that way.

 

[Goober]

A perfect example of what I was just saying.... maybe you should get a browser that spell checks for you too before you bitch at others for the exact same mistakes.

And your cocky attitude towards someone's view you don't agree with?

Yeah..... you're so much better then the people you're complaining about. :roll:

The generation before you acted, talked and treated people like you just as you are doing right now to the next........ As the world turns, these are the days of our lives.



Awwww.... now the poor old coot is avoiding responsibility and passing blame onto others for his misfortune..... :lol: Where did I hear this from before?



No, it seems you are because you're so stuck up your own generation's omnipotence, you can't even see reality for what it truly is.

You worked your ass off?

Who the hell hasn't? I worked my damn ass off too..... yet I was still treated with the same crap attitude your dishing to these kids, acting as though they're breezing through.

Maybe you breezed through by continually playing the sob card of your poor hard life and people gave you sympathy for your plight........ see how this works?



What's the problem? Can't take what you dish out?

Guess it sucks to be you.



Exactly..... there are going to be people pissed that some kid came along with a better idea on how to do things then what they've been doing...... but that's the way it goes.

When I went into photography and worked on grad photos and school photo packages..... the process of cropping, color correcting and packaging the files in the program we were using took close to 2 minutes per person...... with hundreds and hundreds of packages of students per school of dozens of schools each year..... that was a considerable amount of time I thought.

Eventually I got fed up and took a couple of hours out of the day to work on my own process to make it more streamlined, against the wishes of the owner, simply because we didn't have the time to screw around with it.

I knew I could do it and I went ahead and did it.

I cut down each package process from close to 2 minutes..... down to less then 35 seconds each...... obviously my process replaced the old one, but did I ever get a thanks or a good job-pat on the back for my work?

No..... I was still the 21 year old kid who didn't know a lump of sh*t from a cob of corn...... even when I also improved their color correcting process and retouching process of grad photos to look more professional and more realistic.

It seems most of the older generations get pissy about the new generation coming in because they think what they spent all their life doing is better and doesn't need fixing...... but I at least hope that when the new generation starts to tred on my territory, I don't start thinking that way and I actually help them to be better then I am...... that's how it's supposed to work.

Well we both know along with others on this Forum that you and I disagree -The facility I work at had at one point over 800 employees - Then the reoged the place opened another building and moved the admin staff all in to one working place.As to the mirror - Shove it up your asssse -No I alwys do not use spell check - good you and Jbeee have something in commonAgain shove the mirror up your miserable asssses

A perfect example of what I was just saying.... maybe you should get a browser that spell checks for you too before you bitch at others for the exact same mistakes.
Good idea - perhaps I will - any suggestions?

And your cocky attitude towards someone's view you don't agree with?

Cocky - As in what way -

Yeah..... you're so much better then the people you're complaining about.
No I am not
Judgmental call - back it up
The generation before you acted, talked and treated people like you just as you are doing right now to the next........ As the world turns, these are the days of our lives.
Well Gerry I had to quit school at an early age - it supported my mother, brother and sister. So guess what - Fujk you.

Awwww.... now the poor old coot is avoiding responsibility and passing blame onto others for his misfortune.....

Where did I hear this from before?

No I am not blaming anyone - That was life - buckled down and carried on - Problem with that?

I worked my ass of to get where I am today - so hung up on spell check and those that do not use it - manyou are fuked.

No, it seems you are because you're so stuck up your own generation's omnipotence, you can't even see reality for what it truly is.
You worked your ass off?

Who the hell hasn't? I worked my damn ass off too..... yet I was still treated with the same crap attitude your dishing to these kids, acting as though they're breezing through.

Maybe you breezed through by continually playing the sob card of your poor hard life and people gave you sympathy for your plight........ see how this works?
You are one miserable sob and bring it every wheres you travel - So stop jumping on me - find an old mattress and some Vaseline.

What's the problem? Can't take what you dish out?
Guess it sucks to be you.
No it does not suck to be me - I have a good life. Again a hasty call based on??????The only thing I hold against that kid, is that he went on to become a lawyer…….

Exactly..... there are going to be people pissed that some kid came along with a better idea on how to do things then what they've been doing...... but that's the way it goes.

It seems most of the older generations get pissy about the new generation coming in because they think what they spent all their life doing is better and doesn't need fixing...... but I at least hope that when the new generation starts to tred on my territory, I don't start thinking that way and I actually help them to be better then I am...... that's how it's supposed to work.


Well then anyone who cannot respect a better way of doing things and gets all pissy about it is ignorant and dumb. Just because something has always been done that way means it could need a look over for a better way to do it.

Don't blame the younger generation for what they are, after all we are the ones who made them that way.

I agree for the most part - some had opportunities and walked away - Life choice - Some had none but made them by hard work, perseverance.

 

[lone wolf]

I wonder if some folks read training manuals the same way they read forum posts - the headline, a couple of lines, then fill in the rest with mouth and mad?

 

[Goober]

I wonder if some folks read training manuals the same way they read forum posts - the headline, a couple of lines, then fill in the rest with mouth and mad?

Perhaps I should rewrite the original then.

 

[Tonington]

I wonder if some folks read training manuals the same way they read forum posts - the headline, a couple of lines, then fill in the rest with mouth and mad?

I think so. Since I started with the company I work for, I've been measuring far more water quality parameters than they were before, just to bring us into compliance with the regulations. Since then, I've been moved to fill a position left vacant by someone who resigned. In the meantime, some co-workers are taking over my responsibilities. I showed them the SOP I wrote, the manual that the probe came with, and even showed them how to do it by doing it myself. They could do it when I gave the probes to them. But a few days afterwards they were already doing things way wrong. I told them to follow the SOP...and the end result is that now my probes have to be sent away for re-calibration....

Not impressed.

 

[Goober]

I think so. Since I started with the company I work for, I've been measuring far more water quality parameters than they were before, just to bring us into compliance with the regulations. Since then, I've been moved to fill a position left vacant by someone who resigned. In the meantime, some co-workers are taking over my responsibilities. I showed them the SOP I wrote, the manual that the probe came with, and even showed them how to do it by doing it myself. They could do it when I gave the probes to them. But a few days afterwards they were already doing things way wrong. I told them to follow the SOP...and the end result is that now my probes have to be sent away for re-calibration....

Not impressed.

So do you go thru it again with them? Do they think it is outside of their and I use the term job description - Can they do it??

 

[DurkaDurka]

The older generations have these sort of complaints about the younger generations.

"back in my day, we had no machines to help us do our jobs, these young folks severely lack drive & effort!"
"back in my day, we had no computers to help us do our jobs, these young folks severely lack drive & effort!"

 

[wulfie68]

I think there are a couple things at play here.

First old timers always complain about the lack of "common sense" in youngsters. What we forget is that a lot of "common sense" comes from experience that the younger people in question may not have accumulated yet. An example: my first job after college, involved a lot of compressed air outdoors. Now when you compress air, you get condensation from the moisture in the air. I knew to keep emptying the little tanks/scrubbers where the water would accumulate from word go but I never thought about aiding alcohol (methanol) to the systems to tie up the water until I experienced some freezing problems and was told that it would help.

Now that doesn't play into the work ethic displayed by kids. I don't think that the next generation is much if any different than all the ones prior to them: some people have drive and ambition, some people just want to coast, and some are in between.

I will take issue with some of what our education system and our society as a whole allows and accepts in terms of their language and spelling. I am not the best example, I make my mistakes, as most of us do, but I do think the level off acceptance that net/text speech has gained isn't a positive. Yes, it is convenient for fast communication but it also lacks precision. The fact that some school districts deem this as acceptable is ridiculous to me. I do think that is reflected in the lack of spelling ability in people and while spell checks can mitigate some of the issues associated, its a skill that needs to be maintained on at a minimum level, just like math, even though most of us use calculators, PDAs etc now.

 

[DaSleeper]

I think so. Since I started with the company I work for, I've been measuring far more water quality parameters than they were before, just to bring us into compliance with the regulations. Since then, I've been moved to fill a position left vacant by someone who resigned. In the meantime, some co-workers are taking over my responsibilities. I showed them the SOP I wrote, the manual that the probe came with, and even showed them how to do it by doing it myself. They could do it when I gave the probes to them. But a few days afterwards they were already doing things way wrong. I told them to follow the SOP...and the end result is that now my probes have to be sent away for re-calibration....

Not impressed.

There is always a certain amount of "politics" in every job environment...meaning there is always a good ole boys network.
You find a member of that network that is more in line with your way of thinking (making sure he's not one of those that will take your ideas and use them as his own) and you run them past him, because sometimes your particular idea has been tried before...
That is why having a senior guy on your side is a good idea because you will know when to buck the system or go with the flow...

 

[JLM]

Younger Generation - Dumb or Stupid or Both- Yes or No

I see in my work a large number of 18 to 25 or year old persons

I see some in supervisory position with no interpersonal skills what so ever. And yes they send emails and cannot even be bothered to use the auto spell check.

I see employees that have the same talents as mentioned above

I see many who need help to even change their mind - the inability to think a simple problem through to a conclusion is unbelievable

I see this day after day.

I see a lack of ethics - both moral and work - They will blame someone else when something goes wrong instead of facing the music.

I see losers that will go through life complaining about everything that is wrong yet do nothing to change the situation

And yes men are the majority.

And no this is not all but a substantial number.

Then I see the others that will be highly successful in life.

I see a lot of truth in what you are saying, but I think the title should read "smart or stupid" rather than "dumb or stupid". I see a lot of sincere, articulate, meticulous young people today, but I would agree that ability in the spoken and written language is badly lacking by the majority. Teachers keep screaming for more and more benefits and pay blah, blah, blah and on occasion even threaten to go on strike. Where the hell would kids to day get an inkling about work ethic, the teachers should be setting the standards here as most kids don't see much of their parents at work? I'm not knocking ALL teachers, just the majority. Knowledge of computer operation is almost essential today but the basics of writing, speaking, spelling and basic mathematics has to be mastered first & the computer should be used as the carrot. Sadly an attitude that started in the 60s of "do your own thing" is still in evidence today. I think both you and Gerry make good points, but don't see why the insults- "I disagree" is a very acceptable reply.

 

[Goober]

I think so. Since I started with the company I work for, I've been measuring far more water quality parameters than they were before, just to bring us into compliance with the regulations. Since then, I've been moved to fill a position left vacant by someone who resigned. In the meantime, some co-workers are taking over my responsibilities. I showed them the SOP I wrote, the manual that the probe came with, and even showed them how to do it by doing it myself. They could do it when I gave the probes to them. But a few days afterwards they were already doing things way wrong. I told them to follow the SOP...and the end result is that now my probes have to be sent away for re-calibration....

Not impressed.

Forgot to add this

I also have written SOP's and a large number of them. many people think they are easy to write until they have to do them

Couple of questions

I write out the steps as I am doing them - Did you?

I add the rare things that can going wrong or askew and add those. Did you

I would also add if you have not already the step by step for care, handling and maintenance of these expensive tools.

Then write up the various problems that can be encountered and how to address them - In particular if one problem is a rarity it would generally show up when someone else is doing the tests.

Lastly the old technique of

I do

we do

you do

and repeat it until they are comfortable - You should be able to tell that quite easily as you work with them.

Last but most importantly - Do not get mad - That does not work - ask what happened so that we - and stress the WE - can all address it as a team so it does not happen again. And them thank them for the help. And ask for any and all ideas or suggestions - They have to buy into the work.

 

[Praxius]

Well we both know along with others on this Forum that you and I disagree

And why is that relevant? Because you disagreed with my point of view in the past, you automatically have to disagree with me even if what I say might actually make sense or might be true? That's not a very healthy attitude.

-

The facility I work at had at one point over 800 employees - Then the reoged the place opened another building and moved the admin staff all in to one working place.As to the mirror - Shove it up your asssse -No I alwys do not use spell check - good you and Jbeee have something in commonAgain shove the mirror up your miserable asssses

Again, why is it relevant if your company had 800 or 2 employees? Exactly how does that justify your position on the "younger generation?"

And I might shove a mirror up my ass when you learn to grow the hell up and take conflicting opinions like an adult without resorting to childish attacks for something You started.

Good idea - perhaps I will - any suggestions?

Firefox Browser | Free ways to customize your Internet

Cocky - As in what way -

"So guess what - Fujk you."

"manyou are fuked."

"Again shove the mirror up your miserable asssses"

"Scary is it not that they will be making decisions that affect us all. " - (Something said about your own generation at one time, don't forget)

"You are one miserable sob and bring it every wheres you travel - So stop jumping on me - find an old mattress and some Vaseline."

Last I checked, this was a debate forum, thus you created a thread to debate your views and how you see the new generation coming into the work force..... then people disagree with you and counter your arguments and mentality..... then you get all pissed off and attack them and insult them as if we're all supposed to just accept your gospel as fact like you know everything, that it's some how an insult that people don't agree with you...... to me, that sounds like someone being a tad on the cocky side of things.

If you didn't want people disputing your original claims, perhaps you should have written a blog, rather then a debate topic.

No I am not

Judgmental call - back it up

Just did..... and if that's not good enough for you, by all means, re-read through this thread again and view the atmosphere created.

No I am not blaming anyone - That was life - buckled down and carried on - Problem with that?

My problem is that you're acting like these kids didn't have to either and everything is just handed to them..... do you even have the slightest idea what these kids you're complaining about have gone through or are going through right now?

Do you even know what their everyday life entails? What they're going through right at this very moment?

You claim that was your life and that you're not blaming anybody..... you complain that none of them know how to use something as simple as a spell checker...... yet when you're pointed out for not using one, you back peddle and excuse it by saying you dropped out of school at a young age or you don't have the time to go back and spell check...... which to me sounds like the exact attitude you're complaining about in these kids...... last I checked, that's called hypocrisy.

You had reasons/excuses for why you dropped out of school and granted, while I agree that that was your choice and you might have done it for noble reasons..... you are certainly in no position to bitch and moan about these kid's limitations in the same fields you're limited in.......

..... maybe they too had to drop out of school to support their family, maybe they have a learning disability..... maybe they have some other justifiable reason why their skills and abilities are not up to your expectations..... but you have no right to sit on your high horse and finger wag at them for being stupid and dumb because they don't have the experience and know-how which you gained over more years then what they have yet to face..... it's an unfair and quite ignorant position to be holding, especially with your own self-admitted background, lack of education and poor spell checking from not bothering to use what you demand they should be using.

No it does not suck to be me - I have a good life. Again a hasty call based on??????

Based on a point being made which you either didn't get, or refuse to see...... I purposely expressed the exact same mentality you are giving these kids and you are given an opportunity to explain and excuse your pros and cons in your life...... but the difference is that these kinds you're trashing on don't have this opportunity to explain themselves or justify their failures to you..... because in your eyes, they're already stupid morons who can't do anything right and will only end up dooming us all.

You claim I made a "Hasty Call"...... yet again, what are you doing that's so different?

You're making hasty calls on an entire generation of people based on your ignorance and hatred for people you think have an easy life and have no problems to worry about.

That's why people in here are telling you to look in the mirror.

I myself, look in the mirror everyday (metaphorically speaking) and see what others have to deal with in their lives compared to what I have had to deal with in my life...... I grew up hearing how my parent's generation was mocked and called stupid & dumb, who'd probably start WWIII and all of us would die..... then it moved to my generation who grew up in the 80's and graduated in the 90's where Grunge and Hip Hop was popular...... we were told we were idiots and morons, that our parents failed us and we'll ruin the whole planet too........ Now here we are in jobs and starting businesses, getting into politics and virtually taking over what our parents are retiring from........ and now I hear people in or near my generation bitching and moaning about the generation after mine..... the 19-25 year olds coming into the work force who are apparently idiots and morons who will doom us all and destroy the planet.

And guess what?

When they're our age, a number of them will probably say the exact same things about the generation coming in after them.

And you don't see this pattern inside your own way of thinking?

I do.

One of my ex girlfriend's parents used to trash me and belittle my efforts of getting a decent job with a decent pay...... they knew little about me, ignorant on what I had to go through to get to where I am today..... but had no issues labeling me a loser and a dumb idiot.

Why?

Because I work with computers and an artist..... but because I didn't go into auto mechanics or decided to slave away in some coal mine like they did for 30-40 years of their lives and ended up crippled, my job wasn't a "Real Job"

It didn't matter that nobody in their family graduated high school, let alone bothered to go to college like I did (except my ex who was the only one)...... to them, I was a complete waste of space and would amount to nothing.

Same with my ex before her..... her family treated me the exact same way..... despite the fact that my ex only graduated high school (the only one in her family) that she dropped out of university, her mother was a tramp who survived by sleeping around with whatever man had money she could get, or that her father was on unemployment most of the time and only worked part time as a taxi dispatcher who lived in the same one bedroom apartment for the last number of decades right above the taxi stand because of a favor from the owner..... last I heard he was working at Home Depot, he finally moved up in the world.......

..... But No... I was the idiot loser who'd amount to nothing and wasn't good enough to be dating their precious daughters who didn't amount to very much more then themselves.

My pointis that you probably only know a fraction of what these people are going through in their lives, let alone their potential to amount to something great...... all you see are their trivial failures and mistakes and suddenly they're just a bunch of idiot morons who'll end up destroying the world.

So excuse me for not seeing your point of view or jumping on your band wagon of trashing the next generation coming in based on limited understanding.

 

[Tonington]

Forgot to add this

I also have written SOP's and a large number of them. many people think they are easy to write until they have to do them

Couple of questions

I write out the steps as I am doing them - Did you?

I wrote the SOP first, and then printed it off. Then I did the task using only the SOP. There were a few little tricks that I had forgot to add to the SOP, that I remembered when I was going through the task. So I made note of them, and went back to revise the SOP before sending it off for review by the quality assurance folks.

One of the things I had neglected to add was the disnfection process. The probe sensors are quite sensitive, they have to be to pick up the change in gas pressure in the water. The sensor degrades if the probe is left too long in the disinfectant we use, and then the readings are nonsense. I made a cardinal mistake there, and assumed that people would only disinfect equipment for the required 15 minutes of contact time. The probe was actually left in the net bath overnight....

So, that's my fault for not including that caveat in the SOP, and the fault of the others in that we're not supposed to leave equipment in the net baths longer than required. It degrades equipment.

I would also add if you have not already the step by step for care, handling and maintenance of these expensive tools.

Oh yes, that was in there, minus the warning against extended periods in an oxidative net bath!

I wasn't mad...at least not mad at my co-workers. I've been working on addressing the assumptions I make. I can't really fault them for skipping over an existing SOP when the one I wrote was missing that reminder.

 

[Goober]

And why is that relevant? Because you disagreed with my point of view in the past, you automatically have to disagree with me even if what I say might actually make sense or might be true? That's not a very healthy attitude.



Again, why is it relevant if your company had 800 or 2 employees? Exactly how does that justify your position on the "younger generation?"

And I might shove a mirror up my ass when you learn to grow the hell up and take conflicting opinions like an adult without resorting to childish attacks for something You started.



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"So guess what - Fujk you."

"manyou are fuked."

"Again shove the mirror up your miserable asssses"

"Scary is it not that they will be making decisions that affect us all. " - (Something said about your own generation at one time, don't forget)

"You are one miserable sob and bring it every wheres you travel - So stop jumping on me - find an old mattress and some Vaseline."

Last I checked, this was a debate forum, thus you created a thread to debate your views and how you see the new generation coming into the work force..... then people disagree with you and counter your arguments and mentality..... then you get all pissed off and attack them and insult them as if we're all supposed to just accept your gospel as fact like you know everything, that it's some how an insult that people don't agree with you...... to me, that sounds like someone being a tad on the cocky side of things.

If you didn't want people disputing your original claims, perhaps you should have written a blog, rather then a debate topic.



Just did..... and if that's not good enough for you, by all means, re-read through this thread again and view the atmosphere created.



My problem is that you're acting like these kids didn't have to either and everything is just handed to them..... do you even have the slightest idea what these kids you're complaining about have gone through or are going through right now?

Do you even know what their everyday life entails? What they're going through right at this very moment?

You claim that was your life and that you're not blaming anybody..... you complain that none of them know how to use something as simple as a spell checker...... yet when you're pointed out for not using one, you back peddle and excuse it by saying you dropped out of school at a young age or you don't have the time to go back and spell check...... which to me sounds like the exact attitude you're complaining about in these kids...... last I checked, that's called hypocrisy.

You had reasons/excuses for why you dropped out of school and granted, while I agree that that was your choice and you might have done it for noble reasons..... you are certainly in no position to bitch and moan about these kid's limitations in the same fields you're limited in.......

..... maybe they too had to drop out of school to support their family, maybe they have a learning disability..... maybe they have some other justifiable reason why their skills and abilities are not up to your expectations..... but you have no right to sit on your high horse and finger wag at them for being stupid and dumb because they don't have the experience and know-how which you gained over more years then what they have yet to face..... it's an unfair and quite ignorant position to be holding, especially with your own self-admitted background, lack of education and poor spell checking from not bothering to use what you demand they should be using.



Based on a point being made which you either didn't get, or refuse to see...... I purposely expressed the exact same mentality you are giving these kids and you are given an opportunity to explain and excuse your pros and cons in your life...... but the difference is that these kinds you're trashing on don't have this opportunity to explain themselves or justify their failures to you..... because in your eyes, they're already stupid morons who can't do anything right and will only end up dooming us all.

You claim I made a "Hasty Call"...... yet again, what are you doing that's so different?

You're making hasty calls on an entire generation of people based on your ignorance and hatred for people you think have an easy life and have no problems to worry about.

That's why people in here are telling you to look in the mirror.

I myself, look in the mirror everyday (metaphorically speaking) and see what others have to deal with in their lives compared to what I have had to deal with in my life...... I grew up hearing how my parent's generation was mocked and called stupid & dumb, who'd probably start WWIII and all of us would die..... then it moved to my generation who grew up in the 80's and graduated in the 90's where Grunge and Hip Hop was popular...... we were told we were idiots and morons, that our parents failed us and we'll ruin the whole planet too........ Now here we are in jobs and starting businesses, getting into politics and virtually taking over what our parents are retiring from........ and now I hear people in or near my generation bitching and moaning about the generation after mine..... the 19-25 year olds coming into the work force who are apparently idiots and morons who will doom us all and destroy the planet.

And guess what?

When they're our age, a number of them will probably say the exact same things about the generation coming in after them.

And you don't see this pattern inside your own way of thinking?

I do.

One of my ex girlfriend's parents used to trash me and belittle my efforts of getting a decent job with a decent pay...... they knew little about me, ignorant on what I had to go through to get to where I am today..... but had no issues labeling me a loser and a dumb idiot.

Why?

Because I work with computers and an artist..... but because I didn't go into auto mechanics or decided to slave away in some coal mine like they did for 30-40 years of their lives and ended up crippled, my job wasn't a "Real Job"

It didn't matter that nobody in their family graduated high school, let alone bothered to go to college like I did (except my ex who was the only one)...... to them, I was a complete waste of space and would amount to nothing.

Same with my ex before her..... her family treated me the exact same way..... despite the fact that my ex only graduated high school (the only one in her family) that she dropped out of university, her mother was a tramp who survived by sleeping around with whatever man had money she could get, or that her father was on unemployment most of the time and only worked part time as a taxi dispatcher who lived in the same one bedroom apartment for the last number of decades right above the taxi stand because of a favor from the owner..... last I heard he was working at Home Depot, he finally moved up in the world.......

..... But No... I was the idiot loser who'd amount to nothing and wasn't good enough to be dating their precious daughters who didn't amount to very much more then themselves.

My pointis that you probably only know a fraction of what these people are going through in their lives, let alone their potential to amount to something great...... all you see are their trivial failures and mistakes and suddenly they're just a bunch of idiot morons who'll end up destroying the world.

So excuse me for not seeing your point of view or jumping on your band wagon of trashing the next generation coming in based on limited understanding.

I was not criticizing you in my opinion - - Gerry and I have an intense dislike - If you were not aware of it now you are - He sometimes comes at me - and I refuse to be polite in return comments for him & him alone - Regardless of his point of view - This has happened on other threads so that is the way it is. I can live with it.

As to insults - It was Gerry and myself - If I can live with, perhaps you can ship over those posts.

Lastly -
And yes men are the majority.

And no this is not all but a substantial number.

Then I see the others that will be highly successful in life.

Did you miss this part?

 

[Praxius]

I was not criticizing you in my opinion - - Gerry and I have an intense dislike - If you were not aware of it now you are - He sometimes comes at me - and I refuse to be polite in return comments for him & him alone - Regardless of his point of view - This has happened on other threads so that is the way it is. I can live with it.

Fair enough, but my point is that if you feel that way about the new generation based on a few you work with, then you might as well slap me and others of our generation into that same category, because I can relate to much of what many of them are going through and the crap they get from older generations who give them few chances to prove themselves who also don't seem to remember how they were treated.

As to insults - It was Gerry and myself - If I can live with, perhaps you can ship over those posts.

I believe you also said I could shove the mirror up my ass and for me to kiss your ass along with Gerry.... so you brought me into it as well.

Lastly -
And yes men are the majority.

And no this is not all but a substantial number.

Then I see the others that will be highly successful in life.

Did you miss this part?

I saw it, and as I understood how you wrote it, you claim the majority of these people who are idiots and morons are men..... but if the majority of those working in your company (of all ages) are men..... then your workplace is not a fair area to judge the entire generation, let alone a specific gender of that generation.

While you said it's not all of the generation, you say it's a substantial number of that generation....... you might as well claim it's all if it's still a substantial number, because that was still the same defense used against our generation and generations past when claiming we're all idiots and losers.

Sure you and I might be the exception out of the majority of our generation of idiots, but do you truly believe that to be the case of our generation?

If no, then why do you believe that to be the case for the new generation coming into the work force?

As with my personal experience past, if someone treats you like crap, thinks you won't amount to anything worthwhile and no matter what they do, they're losers and stupid..... then they're faced with someone who can not be impressed and their minds will never change.... so why try? They either won't try to advance and prove themselves or leave and work at another job that will give them a chance...... but because they quit and left, some may see that as proof that their assumptions of them were true and they are failures because they couldn't cut it.

Their attitude is reflective of the attitudes surrounding them and if they don't feel they're appreciated, that they're worthless to the company, they're a burden to the company and nobody is willing to see past their age and their lack of experience to help them gain that experience, then don't expect them to accomplish much.

If you think the new generation coming in is mostly made up with losers and dumbasses, then do something about it.... help a few of them make examples for their generation, focus on those who actually look like they give a damn about what they're doing, who are trying hard to do their jobs and make them into something worthwhile.

If you take an interest in them, they can surprise you with what they can actually do and come up with..... but if you keep treating them like idiots and the workplace is a competition, then they'll do the exact same to you..... we're the role models now after all. ;-) We're the experienced ones.