Why Obama is not a Christian
- Thread starter In Between Man
- Start date
Actually the cause of believers and non believers can be growing at the same time because there is one
hell of a vacuum in the middle. Tough times are creating something for people to believe in to take some
of their personal torment away. It is so comforting to believe in something if you feel hopeless or if you
want to blame someone else for you actions later.
There are people out there who believe Christ said it this way and that is the only explanation, if you don't
believe the same way you are a sinner and sinners will be judged and sent to hell. I have a problem with
that. The original Christians believed in forgiveness and Baptism gave you a chance to start over again.
One day, politics came to the Church and everything changed. Four people fought for power over the
flock and their books were more about religious politics than redemption. It is coming to light more and more
that there were several other accounts that never made it to the four books of the Bible. Some should be a
little more charitable if they are believers for Christ spoke about being charitable, he spoke about forgiveness
and other things. Especially for those who believe and judge, he spoke about bearing false witness against
their neighbours. Today many churches are saving souls on mass, believe this and be saved. If you look
deep into the Bible, I think Christ was speaking of a personal journey toward ones own salvation.
If there are more than four books of the Bible and we are not privy to all the books of the Bible how can people
make firm decisions of incomplete information.
I ask these questions as someone who gave up on organized religion many years ago, that does not mean I
have forgotten what I was taught. It just means I don't think I got satisfactory answers to the questions I asked.
I don't dismiss everything out of hand, but I can't for the life of me believe that a kind and loving God who would
profess to be our father would throw you in the furnace for attitude offensive to him. He would seek correction
like any other parent, followed by forgiveness.
There are also, so many mean spirited people with so much judgement and hatred in their own souls that at
the same time profess to be followers of a kind and loving God, it is no wonder that so many choose a
different path that one int the church. It is said that our actions mirror the vision of our human spirit, who we
are is who we are. There are a lot of believers and a hell of a lot of non believers that I know are kind and loving
people,. It is inconceivable that these people would be abandoned by God, regardless of what they believe.
I guess it comes down to this, I don't have trouble with the concept of God but I have a lot of difficulty with a
whole bunch of people who claim to represent him. Obama is both a Christian, and an American Citizen, and
those who keep spreading false hoods are bearing false witness, Wonder how those people will justify their
actions of their personal day of reckoning
hell of a vacuum in the middle. Tough times are creating something for people to believe in to take some
of their personal torment away. It is so comforting to believe in something if you feel hopeless or if you
want to blame someone else for you actions later.
There are people out there who believe Christ said it this way and that is the only explanation, if you don't
believe the same way you are a sinner and sinners will be judged and sent to hell. I have a problem with
that. The original Christians believed in forgiveness and Baptism gave you a chance to start over again.
One day, politics came to the Church and everything changed. Four people fought for power over the
flock and their books were more about religious politics than redemption. It is coming to light more and more
that there were several other accounts that never made it to the four books of the Bible. Some should be a
little more charitable if they are believers for Christ spoke about being charitable, he spoke about forgiveness
and other things. Especially for those who believe and judge, he spoke about bearing false witness against
their neighbours. Today many churches are saving souls on mass, believe this and be saved. If you look
deep into the Bible, I think Christ was speaking of a personal journey toward ones own salvation.
If there are more than four books of the Bible and we are not privy to all the books of the Bible how can people
make firm decisions of incomplete information.
I ask these questions as someone who gave up on organized religion many years ago, that does not mean I
have forgotten what I was taught. It just means I don't think I got satisfactory answers to the questions I asked.
I don't dismiss everything out of hand, but I can't for the life of me believe that a kind and loving God who would
profess to be our father would throw you in the furnace for attitude offensive to him. He would seek correction
like any other parent, followed by forgiveness.
There are also, so many mean spirited people with so much judgement and hatred in their own souls that at
the same time profess to be followers of a kind and loving God, it is no wonder that so many choose a
different path that one int the church. It is said that our actions mirror the vision of our human spirit, who we
are is who we are. There are a lot of believers and a hell of a lot of non believers that I know are kind and loving
people,. It is inconceivable that these people would be abandoned by God, regardless of what they believe.
I guess it comes down to this, I don't have trouble with the concept of God but I have a lot of difficulty with a
whole bunch of people who claim to represent him. Obama is both a Christian, and an American Citizen, and
those who keep spreading false hoods are bearing false witness, Wonder how those people will justify their
actions of their personal day of reckoning
I don't know what BS fundy branch you belong to, but I was raised and confirmed as a Lutheran, and in that church to be a Christian you had to:
- accept Christ as your saviour
- repent your sins (privately between you and God)
Those were the big ones (you're supposed to respect God's laws and all that but sins can be forgiven so...). There is no atonement mentioned as necessary in the new testament. Jesus told his disciples to spread his word but thats not something he said was necessary for redemption.
As for this Obama not being Christian, I am rather more suspicious of his detractors in that regard: Jesus preached love, forgiveness and acceptance to all, not just to members of his club. The people that want to accuse Obama seem more out of tune with JC's true message than he does.
And as for Ghandi being in hell, well if hell exists and Ghandi is there, I look forward to conversing with him there after I die, because my agnostic ass doesn't want to be any part of a heaven thats like the fundies want.
You've said it well and myself being an agnostic too, wouldn't want to be in "Heaven" with a bunch of hypocrites. :lol:
And to Christians, bringing the Son of God (Jesus) to the level of a pedophile terrorist (Mohammed) is offensive to say the least.
You have every right to be offended, but others have every right to be offensive.
Honestly, now, would you say the same thing if the offended one was gay or black?
Or would howl "HOMOPHOBE" and "RACIST"!?
As I'm sure Jesus would be offended by what has been done with his teachings. He railed against the self righteous and the money lenders and was, for all intents and purposes, anti-religion. He never claimed to be THE son of god. The original translations has him declaring that he was A son of god and that we are all children of god. The THE son bit was an intentional mis-translation in order to start a religion by Paul, a man who did not know Jesus personally. But it fitted nicely into his political ambitions to be the leader of this new religion.
I've yet to see a Christian be like Christ. He was a hard core activist that physically trashed things, he humiliated the corrupt leaders vocally and very publicly.
A racist black gay?
Whenever the disconnect between what Jesus taught and Christian practice is raised, adherents claim "He couldn't have been serious!"