Now Ray Lahey Down to Sleep, He Asks the Lord...

[karrie]

Granted in part, but mandatory celibacy in the Latin Rite (With exceptions, of course) means that those who enter the priesthood are self - selected from the larger population. So, there may be ...
Ask your parish priest about the "third way."
Ask your priest (or research it yourself) if priests in the Eastern Rites, who are allowed to marry before ordination, have the same history of paedophilia as do those ordained in the Latin Rite. And, among women clergy in other denominations.

While I get what you're saying, I think it's a matter of splitting hairs. These men are self selected from a larger population, yes, but no statistic I've seen shows higher rates of paedophilia, or sexual abuse in general, among priests as opposed to married men in the general population. If these men are self selected from a population, they seem to still be fairly representative of that population, and I fail to see how drawing MORE men to the clergy by opening marriage laws, will make them somehow better than the general population in terms of abuse statistics.

Personally, I'd like to see marriage allowed Spade, simply to combat the troubles of getting and keeping good leaders in the church, but I have no illusions about it 'curing' mankind in any way shape or form.

 

[gerryh]

While I get what you're saying, I think it's a matter of splitting hairs. These men are self selected from a larger population, yes, but no statistic I've seen shows higher rates of paedophilia, or sexual abuse in general, among priests as opposed to married men in the general population. If these men are self selected from a population, they seem to still be fairly representative of that population, and I fail to see how drawing MORE men to the clergy by opening marriage laws, will make them somehow better than the general population in terms of abuse statistics.

Personally, I'd like to see marriage allowed Spade, simply to combat the troubles of getting and keeping good leaders in the church, but I have no illusions about it 'curing' mankind in any way shape or form.

I REALLY wish I could give you a greenie....but still can't.

 

[AnnaG]

While I get what you're saying, I think it's a matter of splitting hairs. These men are self selected from a larger population, yes, but no statistic I've seen shows higher rates of paedophilia, or sexual abuse in general, among priests as opposed to married men in the general population. If these men are self selected from a population, they seem to still be fairly representative of that population, and I fail to see how drawing MORE men to the clergy by opening marriage laws, will make them somehow better than the general population in terms of abuse statistics.

Personally, I'd like to see marriage allowed Spade, simply to combat the troubles of getting and keeping good leaders in the church, but I have no illusions about it 'curing' mankind in any way shape or form.

It'd be a step towards joining the rest of humans and actually viewing people as humans for a change. Then maybe men could become nuns, too.

 

[gerryh]

It'd be a step towards joining the rest of humans and actually viewing people as humans for a change. Then maybe men could become nuns, too.

Just when I start to like you again.... you say something assinine like this.:roll:

 

[AnnaG]

Just when I start to like you again.... you say something assinine like this.:roll:

Grow a sense of humor, Gerry. Do something beside snivel.

 

[karrie]

It'd be a step towards joining the rest of humans and actually viewing people as humans for a change. Then maybe men could become nuns, too.

While I get what you're saying Anna, that's for the Catholics to decide. Right now we're just discussing the paedophile issue, not every reason other people dislike the Catholic church. The church can decide for itself, and the priests for themselves.

 

[karrie]

Damn Anna, stop slipping a smiley at the end... lol... I keep missing it.

 

[AnnaG]

Damn Anna, stop slipping a smiley at the end... lol... I keep missing it.

Sorry. I post something and then I think of something to add to it so I go back and edit and the smilie is for when I forget to tell the dummies that I was joking.. lol Paying attention, Gerry?

 

[Spade]

May I recommend?
The Writers' Union of Canada - Elizabeth Abbott
A history of celibacy - Google Books

 

[karrie]

None of that really comes as news to me, nor does it have anything to do with the issue of paedophilia. In fact, it goes to further prove that celibacy does not drive priests to molest children, when it claims more than half of priests are actually not celibate anyway, and spells out that they seek 'the third way'.

 

[Spade]

None of that really comes as news to me, nor does it have anything to do with the issue of paedophilia. In fact, it goes to further prove that celibacy does not drive priests to molest children, when it claims more than half of priests are actually not celibate anyway, and spells out that they seek 'the third way'.

It is an unnatural prescription that inhibits healthy sexuality in the clergy!

 

[gerryh]

what is "healthy sexuality"?

 

[karrie]

It is an unnatural prescription that inhibits healthy sexuality in the clergy!

Did you even bother reading my earlier post in reply to you?
I, as a Catholic, would choose to see it come to an end. But we are discussing paedophilia in this thread, and the assertion that celibacy is the cause of paedophilia. You have yet to do anything to back up the claim that it does in any way shape or form, and instead are just bringing up other reasons you personally dislike it.

Feel free to start a thread about the other reasons you dislike celibacy (or pick one of the 50 others you'll likely be able to find searching the forum). But for now, in THIS thread, I'd like to stick to the discussion at hand.

I've spent the better part of my evening googling for statistics on paedophilic abuse rates in priests, and they are the same as the general populace from everything I can find. Has anyone else turned up any stats that say otherwise?

 

[Spade]

what is "healthy sexuality"?

Not paedophilia

 

[gerryh]

Not paedophilia

Sorry, celibacy has nothing to do with pedophilia.....Like Karrie, I would also like to see you back up your assertions, because in all my research on pedophilia, I came up with the same thing Karrie did. The numbers are basically the same between the general population and the Preisthood.

 

[Spade]

Child Abuse by Christian Priests: Horror, Paedophilia and the Clergy

 

[gerryh]

sorry..... I would like to see direct references to studies showing that pedohilia is more "rampant" in the Preisthood than it is in the general population.

 

[Spade]

The changing face of the priesthood ... - Google Books

 

[gerryh]

again...what does homosexuality have to do with pedophilia. Study's of pedophiles have shown that over 80% of pedohiles are married males.

 

[karrie]

Child Abuse by Christian Priests: Horror, Paedophilia and the Clergy

From your source...

""2% of the priest population can be classified as true pedophiles with a three to one preference for boys. This gender attraction is reversed in the general population. [...] 4% of the priest population become sexually involved with adolescents"2.

From 'What is Pedophilia and why is it such an epidemic? - RegisteredOffendersList.Org'

"Four percent of the population suffers from sexual orientation toward children. In 1999, 93,000 kids were sexually abused. 50% of the abusers were parents of the children. 18% were relatives. This means that almost 70% of children were molested by family members, fathers, uncles, and grandfathers – males they trusted."


So does celibacy cause paedophilia?