I Watched a Public Execution Today

[Timetrvlr]

Missile posted:

On the News this morning ,I saw a group of New Orleans policeman ,lined up with guns aimed at a Black with a small knife in his hand. Did they try to disarm him? Or use their guns to wound him? no,they fired en masse into him until he died.

Yes, I saw that too and it was more than a public execution; he was tried, found guilty, and executed by cops. I hate to see that system supplant our rule by law because I could be a victim of it too, so could you, or your kids.

When I was watching that, I thought how easy it would be to safely disarm and subdue him. Any cowboy would rope him and hogtie him in under 8 seconds! Seriously though, animal control officers are confronted by that scenario on a regular basis when they have to remove vicious dogs. They slip a noose around the animals neck. The rope is contained in a long barrel so that the animal can't get close enough to bite them. A similar "humane" system could be used to control crazy people but it's not nearly as much fun for macho cops!
:wav:

 

[Nosferax]

Missile posted:

On the News this morning ,I saw a group of New Orleans policeman ,lined up with guns aimed at a Black with a small knife in his hand. Did they try to disarm him? Or use their guns to wound him? no,they fired en masse into him until he died.

Yes, I saw that too and it was more than a public execution; he was tried, found guilty, and executed by cops. I hate to see that system supplant our rule by law because I could be a victim of it too, so could you, or your kids.

When I was watching that, I thought how easy it would be to safely disarm and subdue him. Any cowboy would rope him and hogtie him in under 8 seconds! Seriously though, animal control officers are confronted by that scenario on a regular basis when they have to remove vicious dogs. They slip a noose around the animals neck. The rope is contained in a long barrel so that the animal can't get close enough to bite them. A similar "humane" system could be used to control crazy people but it's not nearly as much fun for macho cops!
:wav:

But then you would have people shouting "Look, they are treating him like a dog, it's a human being, don't use the leash..."

 

[Ocean Breeze]

Re: RE: I Watched a Public Ex

they didn't have to shoot him, there are non-lethal ways to disarm somebody with a knife, and I find it hard to believe that cops aren't trained in such methods.

with you on this one. These guys have to be trained in all kinds of disarming techniques or what the heck are they doing in this job??

But what the heck....... shooting is the line of least resistance......and with the guy being black......

rather pathetic when you consider the odds. 5 trained cops armed and dangerous.......to 1 chap with a knife. Bet they didn't even try to talk him down.... or calm him down. Why would they?? when point and shoot is so expedient.

oh well.........justice amerikan style.

we better be careful in CA that we don't take on any of this crap in dealing with situations here now.

amerika = VIOLENCE, GUNS, KILLING and WARS.

 

[MMMike]

:twisted: So from the comfort of your living room you have tried and convicted these officers and found them guilty? They killed the guy because they are cowboys, because they are racist, or just for fun? These are normal people, subject to the same fears and stresses and anyone of us. How would you react to a knife-wielding crazy person coming at you? Would you risk your own life to try and disarm him somehow?

There are definitely questions that could be and should be asked: did these officers act in accordance with the department guidelines, and are there better ways to deal with these situations? If they acted in accordance with the rules, you have no grounds for denouncing these people.

 

[tracy]

[ya know......offering up worst case scenarios , Is a stretch.
. )

Sort of like you bringing up a neurological disorder as a reason this man was waving the knife around?

Reading other threads I think I have very little in common with Nascar's political views. But on this one, I have to agree with him. It isn't like these cops got up in the morning thinking "Wow, I hope I can find a black guy with parkinson's and a knife so I can kill him!". They were faced with a threatening man with a weapon. He was told to drop the knife. He didn't. They tried pepper spray to get him to drop it. Didn't work. Then according to the witnesses (I saw the man who shot this tape on the news) the man lunged at the cops with his knife. Sorry, but if you try to kill a cop you don't have the right to safety anymore. Sure, the 5 cops could have restrained this man without killing him, but how many of the cops would have been stabbed in the process? Even if it's "only" one cop, that's one too many. One violent criminal's safety is not worth the life of one cop.

There are plenty of examples of police brutality and I would normally be the first one screaming about it, but I don't see it here.

 

[tracy]

Re: RE: I Watched a Public Ex

[we better be careful in CA that we don't take on any of this crap in dealing with situations here now.

I think that's an absurd comment. I'm embarassed at how smug my fellow Canadians can be sometimes. Do you really think Canada doesn't have problems with police abuse, racism and violence ALREADY? You don't remember a dead native man in Saskatchewan who was last seen in police custody? A Vancouver cop found guilty of assaulting young drug users? Those were a while ago, so I can see how people could forget, but how about that kid shot at a police station in Houston? Has that been explained? There weren't any video cameras there...

 

[#juan]

Even if it's "only" one cop, that's one too many. One violent criminal's safety is not worth the life of one cop.

Nobody here seems to realise the damage that can be done with a police billy or baton. It is easily possible to break a man's arm, or his head. The police took the easy way out and shot the guy about ten times. A bit like killing an ant with a sledge hammer.

 

[Ocean Breeze]

Re: RE: I Watched a Public Ex

[we better be careful in CA that we don't take on any of this crap in dealing with situations here now.

I think that's an absurd comment. I'm embarassed at how smug my fellow Canadians can be sometimes. Do you really think Canada doesn't have problems with police abuse, racism and violence ALREADY? You don't remember a dead native man in Saskatchewan who was last seen in police custody? A Vancouver cop found guilty of assaulting young drug users? Those were a while ago, so I can see how people could forget, but how about that kid shot at a police station in Houston? Has that been explained? There weren't any video cameras there...

:roll:

No need to be embarrassed. Furthermore you are an American now........ so what is the issue?? I raised a possible medical problem..........because one never knows.. Common......you know better than that......and as a nurse you would have considered that possibility too. His moving around might just have been fear , terror and a reaction to hi stress. We just don't know all the details and probably never will.......so for all intents and purposes ........what we are doing is opining and speculating....

the situation has brought forth many opinions and thoughts......but one conclusion that can be drawn.......is that some investigation is called for.

 

[Nosferax]

Even if it's "only" one cop, that's one too many. One violent criminal's safety is not worth the life of one cop.

Nobody here seems to realise the damage that can be done with a police billy or baton. It is easily possible to break a man's arm, or his head. The police took the easy way out and shot the guy about ten times. A bit like killing an ant with a sledge hammer.

But to use the baton you have to put yourself in range of the knife... Sorry but no. Those aren't soldier, they aren't paid to die for there country, they are paid to do a job and that is to uphold the law. The law says that you can't wave a knife and be threatening people with it. It also tell the policemen that they can use deadly force when confronted by an armed men who is threatening them with said knife.

They did try to disarm him (bark order, pepper spray) but he didn't.


Here a solution to not get shot by the police: DROP THE FRIGGIN KNIFE WHEN THEY TELL YOU SO!

 

[zenfisher]

To use pepper spray you would have to put yourself in range of the attacker. The pepper spray was still ineffective according to paper down here today.

 

[Nosferax]

Re: RE: I Watched a Public Execution Today

To use pepper spray you would have to put yourself in range of the attacker. The pepper spray was still ineffective according to paper down here today.

mmmm... Police pepper spray can be used at a distance of 10 feet and they all had one..... Those aren't the small dispencer women carry and the stuff is also more potent... Billy club is about 24 to 30 inches and you can only go 1 or 2 at a time since while you club you are in the way of the others... Remember this ain't like in the movie, you just don't get those high flying karate move a la Jet Li... As a matter of fact those move never really work in actual combat situation... Go see an extreme fighting competiton and try to guess who get there $#% kick out every time... I'll tell you now to spare you the spectacle, it's those Kung Fu artist...

 

[the caracal kid]

is pepper spray more effective on people than bear spray is on bears?

 

[zenfisher]

Somewhere i this thread is a statement about the range of someone weilding a knife is 25 feet. The police still would have been in danger spraying him.

The Seattle Times reported the knife was three inches long. Five billy clubs 24 inches long is still a considerable advantage. It is precisely right ...this ain't like a movie...especially a martial arts one....five defenders would subdue one attacker.

 

[tracy]

Re: RE: I Watched a Public Ex

[we better be careful in CA that we don't take on any of this crap in dealing with situations here now.

I think that's an absurd comment. I'm embarassed at how smug my fellow Canadians can be sometimes. Do you really think Canada doesn't have problems with police abuse, racism and violence ALREADY? You don't remember a dead native man in Saskatchewan who was last seen in police custody? A Vancouver cop found guilty of assaulting young drug users? Those were a while ago, so I can see how people could forget, but how about that kid shot at a police station in Houston? Has that been explained? There weren't any video cameras there...

:roll:

No need to be embarrassed. Furthermore you are an American now........ so what is the issue?? I raised a possible medical problem..........because one never knows.. Common......you know better than that......and as a nurse you would have considered that possibility too. His moving around might just have been fear , terror and a reaction to hi stress. We just don't know all the details and probably never will.......so for all intents and purposes ........what we are doing is opining and speculating....

the situation has brought forth many opinions and thoughts......but one conclusion that can be drawn.......is that some investigation is called for.

I'm not an American. I just live in the US. I'm prone to it too, but I see a lot of the same behavior that we used to always contribute to those arrogant Americans coming from Canadians (the "we're so much better than them" attitude because that kind of thing would never happen in Canada). There are a lot of Americans who will join with you and say this was the most barbaric thing they've ever seen and there are a lot of Canadians (like me) who would disagree. It's not fair to insult an entire country based on one incident, especially when it's a bit like the pot calling the kettle black. I saw the same thing with the whole Abu Ghraib scandal. It was horrific to be sure but I was surprised at how many Canadians said it would never have happened with Canadian soldiers. Apparently they forgot what happened with a certain group of Canadian soldiers in Somalia who tortured a boy to death. This is no different given that we have a past of police brutality and racism too. I know lots of cops (Canadian only) and think many of them are racist.

Yes, it's possible he had Parkinson's. My nursing background actually wouldn't make me suspect that, I would assume some sort of drugs were involved. My only point there was that it isn't fair to discount the possibility that he was on PCP so easily and assume he had a neurological condition. It could be either and the cops there couldn't possibly have known.

 

[tracy]

Re: RE: I Watched a Public Execution Today

is pepper spray more effective on people than bear spray is on bears?

My brother and his whole troop was pepper sprayed during training. They all said it was extremely painful. Grown men were crying, redfaced, running out to put snow onto their faces.