Thank you. The United Church is my church.I don't think so. Given the dictionary definition of the occult as "any system claiming use or knowledge of secret or supernatural powers or agencies," and dictionary definitions of cult as "a particular system of religious worship, especially with reference to its rites and ceremonies," or "a group or sect bound together by veneration of the same thing, person, ideal, etc." it seems that any set of religious beliefs could be fairly described as both occult and a cult. It's just that in common usage they have pejorative overtones, they're used by members of one cult to dismiss the beliefs of another as foolish or unreasonable, while of course their own are held to be perfectly sensible, divinely inspired, rooted in sacred texts and profound convictions of certainty, or whatever. I'm reminded of H.L. Mencken's observation that the chief occupation of mankind is believing in the palpably untrue.
With regard to the OP, it seems to me that debating whether or not Mormons are Christians is foolish beyond description. Of course they are. So are Anglicans, Catholics, Lutherans, Calvinists, Baptists, Presbyterians, Methodists, Mennonites, Hutterites... It's a big tent, plenty of room in it for Mormons, though I think the United Church might be just outside the flap, its doctrine got watered down so much in the unification that you don't really have to believe much of anything to belong.
Don't take it personal. It is his opinion.Thank you. The United Church is my church.
You forgot to say that is only your opinion.
Sure, why not?
I agree Mormonism is man made. But, so are all other religions.
Maybe it was because the religious instruction that I did receive was so very brief, but I personally never reached a point where I challenged that, never questioned that of others. I simply came to certain conclusions as I grew older, the main conclusion being that I simply do not know who or what or even if, God is.It was the part about having the one true god that got me. I asked for proof, which I didn't think was an unreasonable request but never got an answer.
Perhaps my definition of Christian is narrow, I can certainly see where someone who believes in a more structured and disciplined sytem of belief may think so, but true Christianity to me, at it's heart, has always been about acceptance, love and inclusion.Then there was one I read but can't remember who the nut was that said" GOd does not hear the prayers of a Jew". Now I confess to never having met god despite some good drugs but I'm fairly certain that Jews would not bother praying if they thought this was true.
I know that many native cultures have more than one god so how can some so called christian call them pagans or heathens?
And, I suppose Aley, because they don't meet your definition, they're going to hell?
PS to Goober,
And you claim the are not ALL man made?
Guess we find out after we are dead. Hell of a way to prove a point.
Mormons are not Christians. The reason Mormonism is not Christian is because it DENIES more than one of the ESSENTIAL DOCTRINES of Christianity. Of the essential doctrines (there is only one God, Jesus is God in the flesh, forgiveness of sins is by grace alone, Jesus physically rose from the dead, and the gospel is the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus), Mormonism denies three of them: how many Gods there are, the attributes of "Christ", and the works of his salvation.
Mormon theology teaches that God is only one of countless gods, that he used to be a man on another planet, that he became a god by following the laws and ordinances of that god on that world, and that he brought one of his wives to this world with whom he produces "spirit children" who then inhabit human bodies at birth. The first spirit child to be born was Jesus. Second was Satan, and then we all followed. This is in strict contrast to the biblical teaching the Jesus Christ is God in the flesh(John 1:1,14), eternal(John 1:2, 15), uncreated yet born on earth(Colossians 1:15), and creator of all (John 1:3, Colossians 1:16-17).
Mormonism teaches among the countless gods, that Jesus is "a" god, one of three who comprise the office of the trinity. These three gods are God the Father, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. Again, a direct contrast to the biblical teaching that there is only ONE God(Isaiah 43:10, 44:6, 8, 45:5) the CORRECT definition of the trinity.
Mormonism teaches that the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross itself (and receiving it by faith) is not sufficient to bring forgiveness of sins. It teaches that the forgiveness of sins is obtained though a cooperative effort with God; that is, we must be good and follow the laws and ordinances of the Mormon church in order to obtain forgiveness. This clearly contradicts the biblical doctrine of the forgiveness of sins by grace through faith, (Romans 5:1, 6:23, Ephesians 2:8-9) and the doctrine that works are not part of our salvation but a result of them(Romans 4:5).
To further confuse the matter, Mormonism further states that salvation is twofold. It maintains that salvation is both forgiveness of sins and universal resurrection. So when a Mormon speaks of salvation by grace, he is usually referring to universal resurrection. But the Bible speaks of salvation as the forgiveness of sins, not simple universal resurrection.
In order to justify its aberrant theology, Mormonism has undermined the authority and trustworthiness of the Bible. The 8th article of faith from the Mormon Church states, "We believe the Bible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly." This means that when the Bible contradicts Mormonism, the Bible isn't trustworthy.
Mormonism is not Christian because it denies that there is only one God, denies the true Gospel, adds works to salvation, denies that Jesus is the uncreated creator, distorts the biblical teaching of the atonement, and undermines the authority and reliability of the Bible.
Becoming a Christian does not mean belonging to a church, doing good things, or simply believing in God. Being a Christian means that you have trusted in the true God for salvation, in the True Jesus - not the brother of the devil, not the god of Mormonism, not the gospel of Mormonism. Mormonism is false and cannot save anyone.
Alley worships at the church of Starbucks where everyone is their own preacher, at least that is what he claims. Many of his beliefs are very similar to the radical right wing fundies, so I think his beliefs are heavily influenced, whether he admits it or not. We'll see when he returns tonight what he has to say about that.As opposed to your religious dogma that must be right because YOUR preacher told you so?
Richard John Neuhaus — Is Mormonism Christian?As opposed to your religious dogma that must be right because YOUR preacher told you so?
Guess we find out after we are dead. Hell of a way to prove a point.
There are numerous suppositions in that statement, few of which I accept.
1. That there is life after death.
2. That there is a "hell." (I thought Christians believed Gawd was infinite in her/his love.)
3. That our present existence is a trial and we'd "damn" well better get it right.
4. That only accepting a well-defined set of beliefs in Gawd assures "salvation."
5. That the majority of humanity is doomed.
6. That good works are irrelevant
... etc.
I admit religions do have some merits. Of course they are defined and evolved over time by clan and tribe, nation and ethnicity, superstition and the state of science in explaining the natural world. However, they offer solace in times of trouble and hardship, they help celebrate life's milestones, and they offer hope. Nevertheless they and their gods are constructs.
Some religious teachers that preached tolerance and forgiveness, community and the communal, peace and pacifism, charity and love are to be admired. Unfortunately their followrs rather believe in the unbelievable and bicker among themselves and eshew and contemn dissenting beliefs than follow their precepts.