Quote: Originally Posted by Colpy
Well then, what the **** are we talking about???????????
Nobody knows yet because nothing has been released.... all we know at this time is that the US is trying to PR their allies and prep them for some nasty news about their actions which might piss a lot of people and countries off...... which is basically what the US has been saying themselves.
The news reports say it is expected that much of what is to be revealed has to do with the USA twisting the arms of allies to take released Gitmo detainees from their countries.......thus the Khadr statements in my post....as in this CBC article......
CBC News - Canada - U.S. nervously awaits next Wikileaks
Expected is one thing..... what it will actually be is another, so to jump on everybody who posted in here as anti-Americans acting like hypocrites over their Gitmo transfers is jumping the gun a little bit, especially since nobody in here commented on the Gitmo transfers until you brought it up.
That may be so, but it was not just dragged out by CTV (see above) and my posts don't necessarily depend on your opinion of what is, or is not, relevant at the moment.
It does when you come all up in here on your high horse and call us all anti-american hypocrites over things none of us said at the time...... it does when you claim we made comments towards the Gitmo transfers and try and use something that doesn't exist to support your continued finger pointing at us for things we didn't even do or say yet.
CBC, CTV and the man on the moon are all speculating at this time and assuming what these documents might be, just like you are...... nobody else in here prior to you posting made any references to what the documents might be..... those who posted in here prior to you made comments towards the US's actions of trying to put out a fire before the first starts...... a fire they seemed to have created themselves by their own actions which are going to soon be exposed to the rest of the world.
What that fire is, remains to be seen.
That doesn't surprise me.
No contradiction at all.
The USA has not zapped him, thus they are not the monster most here seem to think.
Yet you think they should be the "Monsters" people think they are by doing exactly what those people think they will do.
Even though they would be justified in zapping him IF he was exposing their intelligence sources to repercusions by their enemies.
No contradiction at all.
So they would be justified in killing someone for exposing to the public (The US public included, to whom those their government and military are supposed to serve and their allies who are sending their own troops to be sacrificed for these guys own interests)
their own clear violations and wrong-doings?
That's the whole point of leaking these things in the first place..... if they didn't do anything wrong, it wouldn't be worth leaking would it?
If it's worth leaking, then logically they did something wrong that needs to be exposed in order to prevent these asshats from continuing to do more wrong.
And just because they're the government or they're the military, doesn't mean they get to have free range to do whatever the hell they damn well please, illegal or not, against human rights and international law or not...... and if countries around the world decide to punish the US and their diplomats for leaked information that exposes their wrong doings to a point to justify such punishment..... then the US only has themselves to blame and no one else.
And if they have such an issue with such information being leaked..... maybe they shouldn't have fk'd around and committed such actions that would piss their allies off in the first place. Don't blame WikiLeaks for showing us the wrong doings the US military/government did..... that's equal to shooting the messenger.
Nobody would be complaining if WikiLeaks dished out information on Iran, North Korea, the Soviet Union, Nazi Germany, WWII Japan, etc.........
I'd want to know what my enemies are doing just as much as I'd want to know what my allies and my own nation are doing..... and just because they may provide information that may not shed my country or my allies in a good light, doesn't mean I should get all up in an outrage for what they did...... I should be focusing my anger towards my nation's leaders or my allies for the wrongs they committed.
Would you rather be protected by a police force that abide by the rules and laws they're supposed to uphold and protect.... or would you rather take your chances on a corrupt police force that bend the rule or even break them to do what they personally think is right and wrong, regardless of the laws and rules they're supposed to uphold?
A good point.
Unless the leaks are costing lives.
Someone providing information of wrong-doings overrides what hypothetical lives might be lost, since those wrong-doings were probably already responsible for more lives lost then would possibly be lost by these leaks.
And citing National Security or claiming the risk of lives lost by not telling the public you serve what's really going on is no excuse.... it is no justification and our governments and militaries, US, Canada, UK, Australia, France, etc..... should all be held accountable by their people and held responsible for their actions.
They serve us...... we don't serve them..... that's what a Democracy was supposed to be all about I thought..... our governments are accountable, they owe us explanations for what they do or don't do and they do not have free range to do whatever they damn well please behind closed doors..... otherwise you might as well toss democracy out the window and just accept dictatorships, because that's exactly where we're heading when we defend and excuse idiot governments like this or let them just get away with anything they do, right or wrong.
If our own government and militaries won't give us the information we deserve to know, then we should get that information ourselves.... which is exactly what WikiLeaks does.
They're the ones who pushed for war.... they're the ones sending our fellow citizens around the world to blow up countries and kill people, they're the ones who ignore human rights and international law in order to punish people they suspect are the enemy..... and if nobody reigns them in and if their wrong-doings are not exposed to the public and if they're not held accountable for their actions and wrong-doings...... then who will reign them in and ensure they do what is expected of them..... which is to do the right thing and abide by the principles, rights and laws our western societies claim to defend and believe in.
If we don't control our own governments then we don't control our militaries either..... and if we don't control any of that, then we don't control anything at all...... thus not a democracy.
Last edited by Praxius; Nov 26th, 2010 at 09:30 AM..