Young adults have a right to be up in arms

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
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Young adults have a right to be up in arms

Talk to your kids before you dismiss those Quebec student demonstrators as a bunch of spoiled malcontents.

Even if they’re not on their way into the streets to protest rising university tuitions, young adults have some legitimate grievances about the growing financial divide between them and the older generation.

Think about jobs – more people are expected to remain in the work force after age 65, which means less opportunity for recent graduates to find their first career-building position.

Think about housing – the baby boomers bought up all the cheap houses and now it’s prohibitively expensive to buy in some big cities.

Think about social programs – Old Age Security is being preserved untouched for today’s seniors by taking benefits away from younger Canadians, and we haven’t yet seen what changes will be required to our health care system as the population ages.

The Quebec demonstrations can’t be dismissed as simply an example of the province’s strong tradition of social activism, and neither are they the actions of selfish youths who aren’t satisfied with the lowest post-secondary tuitions in North America. What’s going on in the province is a fight by twentysomethings to be heard by governments that seem to have little interest in them.

As our population ages, young adults are increasingly being marginalized in a demographic sense. And they’ve never been much of a force politically. It’s no wonder, then, that politicians have little or nothing to say about the growing economic divide. You don’t win an election addressing that issue.

Tuition fees are the gateway problem for today’s young people in a financial sense. Some argue that cutting tuition only benefits well-off families because they’re the only ones who can afford to send their kids to university or college. Maybe so, but the net result of tuition costs at current levels is that, according to the Canadian Federation of Students, the average debt for university graduates is almost $27,000. At today’s interest rates for student loans, it would cost a grad a hefty $530 a month to pay that debt off over five years.

Large student debts would be both tolerable and fair in an economy where graduates can get on with their careers fairly quickly. But, anecdotally at least, this doesn’t seem to be the case. A quick summary of stories I’ve heard from recent graduates since my new book, How Not To Move Back In With Your Parents: A Young Person’s Guide to Financial Empowerment, was published last month:


  • The only jobs I can find are unpaid internships.

  • The job I have doesn’t pay me enough to take care of my student loans and afford my own apartment.

  • All I can get are short-term contracts.

  • I’m competing for jobs against people who are way overqualified.

I spoke with Zach Dayler, national director of the Canadian Alliance of Student Associations (CASA), in researching this column. He mentioned that his organization recently posted an opening for an entry-level policy and research analyst. People with law and master’s degrees are applying.

Once they land a job, the dream of home ownership lives strong in today’s young adults. Unfortunately, the flip side of all the money made in housing by baby boomers is sky-high prices for first-time buyers. It’s easy to say these buyers should suck it up and wait their turn, but that means enduring the older generation’s advice that renting is the dumbest financial move ever (actually, it’s buying a house you can’t properly afford).

One reason for pessimism in the outlook for twentysomethings is that governments are cutting both jobs and spending. Part of the government’s rationale is that it must prepare for the financial needs of the aging baby boom generation. The last federal budget announced a reform of OAS that will gradually raise the age of eligibility to 67 from 65 starting in 2023. People 54 and older are untouched by the changes. These are the very same retirees who in many cases binged on debt, neglected their retirement savings and thus will have to stay in the work force longer. Twentysomethings, get a load of your new competitors in the job market – mom and dad.

So why haven’t more kids been demonstrating like those Quebec students? Mr. Dayler, of CASA, said students in other provinces are accustomed to tuition increases and the idea that a post-secondary education means going into debt. The anger is there, however. “Just ask most young people what they think of their political representatives.”

_______


Notes

-a floating rate loan at prime+2.5 percentage points is used for this example
-an assumption is made here that the student will take advantage of a six-month repayment grace period after graduation (interest accrues during that period and is added to the amount owing)

Young adults have a right to be up in arms - The Globe and Mail
 
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taxslave

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 25, 2008
36,362
4,336
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Vancouver Island
Would these students rather the government borrow even more money so they can have a free education and a higher government debt to pay for? Despite what the free loaders want there is no such thing as a free lunch unless you are a government employee.
Some of these students might think of looking for a job outside of city center as well.
 

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
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454
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Would these students rather the government borrow even more money so they can have a free education and a higher government debt to pay for?

Quebec can keep their tuition levels the same if they raise taxes or cut back on funding something else that they receive equalization for.
 

bobnoorduyn

Council Member
Nov 26, 2008
2,262
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Mountain Veiw County
It's hard to believe, but I was young once. I remember kvetching about the rich ba$tards who owned houses I could only dream of. Now the youth are kvetching about folks like me. I worked my arse off to get where I am, so pogue ma thoin! I get that tuition is a prohibitive expense, I owe more for my daughter's university than I paid for my first house. I should be the one protesting, not the spoiled brat young'ns who have more years ahead of them than I have, (matter of fact, I have more years behind me than they have in front of them).

Quebec of all places, they should try going to Dal. Quebec is only outplaced by Memorial in Newfoundland for cheapness.
 

bobnoorduyn

Council Member
Nov 26, 2008
2,262
28
48
Mountain Veiw County
Yeah, sure, David Dingbat, too bad he's a Caper, gives Cape Breton a bad name, I guess. But do you know why they don't play baseball on the Island? The ump yells "Strike", and averyone goes home.
 

Niflmir

A modern nomad
Dec 18, 2006
3,460
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Leiden, the Netherlands
It's hard to believe, but I was young once. I remember kvetching about the rich ba$tards who owned houses I could only dream of. Now the youth are kvetching about folks like me. I worked my arse off to get where I am, so pogue ma thoin! I get that tuition is a prohibitive expense, I owe more for my daughter's university than I paid for my first house. I should be the one protesting, not the spoiled brat young'ns who have more years ahead of them than I have, (matter of fact, I have more years behind me than they have in front of them).

Quebec of all places, they should try going to Dal. Quebec is only outplaced by Memorial in Newfoundland for cheapness.

You owe more for your daughter's education? Good for your daughter, she can actually start off with nothing. I don't wish student loans on anyone, you included. Most people moving out into a career nowadays start with less than nothing, and you should be proud that you are able to shield your daughter from that. Strange that you think the complaint is about rich people though, these people are actually complaining about their own problems, not somebody else's lack of problems.

Funny thing about OAS is, at this point in my life, it is approaching certainty that I will never qualify for it. Even having paid into it for quite some time, those years spent abroad make it increasingly that I will never qualify. Such is life.
 

skookumchuck

Council Member
Jan 19, 2012
2,467
0
36
Van Isle
What a steaming reeking pile of dung this premise is!
In the early 60's i spent two fekking years working in the north to save money for my tuition at a trade school, i stayed there for months at a time also when others were "going to the city" every couple weeks to party and blow money. I had enough by then to go to university, barely, but did not want that.

When i decided to have a home i went to a rural area which was cheaper and lived like a mole in a hastily erected basement while i built the upper floor, had a wife and two kids by that time also. I had to learn carpentry the hard way and used to drive into town to a subdivision where the builders would tell me how to do something on their coffee break if i brought donuts. I know it sounds like 10 miles to school uphill both ways but this is the simple truth.
I got caught in the mortgage spiral when i was building in 1980 which nearly doubled my payments so i worked two jobs and toughed it out.

Nothing has changed regarding the ratio of annual wage to the coat of an ordinary home unless these poor entitled dip****s insist on a job and home in just the right area of a major city. Twas the same back then, too expensive for a middle income wage earner.

I have immediate family currently working in the boonies for the same reason. One nephew in particular is making over a hundred grand a year in the bush and saving 30 of it towards an education, another had the sense not to knock up some girl and is saving for a home under the same circumstances, he, btw, grew up in a city. Yep saving, no 5-10 percent down, he is thinking 60% down and not in an upscale neighborhood, just an entry level new home.

Gad! It is sickening to listen to young people who have been brainwashed to think they can demand any living they wish.
 

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
44,850
192
63
Nakusp, BC
is there a Province cheaper than PQ for education?
I don't know what is like today, but wages and the cost of living in Quebec while I lived there were considerably lower than the rest of Canada. I went from being a drafting supervisor at $2/hr in Montreal to sweeping floors in a mill in BC at $4.75/hr with less buying power.
 

DurkaDurka

Internet Lawyer
Mar 15, 2006
10,385
129
63
Toronto
Quebec can keep their tuition levels the same if they raise taxes or cut back on funding something else that they receive equalization for.

Quebec is already the most heavily taxed province, you can only milk so much. These students are delusional, greedy and plain out of touch with reality. Their current tuition is the lowest in the country, I have zero sympathy for them.
 

IdRatherBeSkiing

Satelitte Radio Addict
May 28, 2007
14,591
2,336
113
Toronto, ON
At some point the students need to be responsible for their own education. Why should elective education be free?

If they can't afford it or don't want the debt, don't go.
 

Niflmir

A modern nomad
Dec 18, 2006
3,460
58
48
Leiden, the Netherlands
What a steaming reeking pile of dung this premise is!
In the early 60's i spent two fekking years working in the north to save money for my tuition at a trade school, i stayed there for months at a time also when others were "going to the city" every couple weeks to party and blow money. I had enough by then to go to university, barely, but did not want that.

When i decided to have a home i went to a rural area which was cheaper and lived like a mole in a hastily erected basement while i built the upper floor, had a wife and two kids by that time also. I had to learn carpentry the hard way and used to drive into town to a subdivision where the builders would tell me how to do something on their coffee break if i brought donuts. I know it sounds like 10 miles to school uphill both ways but this is the simple truth.
I got caught in the mortgage spiral when i was building in 1980 which nearly doubled my payments so i worked two jobs and toughed it out.

Nothing has changed regarding the ratio of annual wage to the coat of an ordinary home unless these poor entitled dip****s insist on a job and home in just the right area of a major city. Twas the same back then, too expensive for a middle income wage earner.

I have immediate family currently working in the boonies for the same reason. One nephew in particular is making over a hundred grand a year in the bush and saving 30 of it towards an education, another had the sense not to knock up some girl and is saving for a home under the same circumstances, he, btw, grew up in a city. Yep saving, no 5-10 percent down, he is thinking 60% down and not in an upscale neighborhood, just an entry level new home.

Gad! It is sickening to listen to young people who have been brainwashed to think they can demand any living they wish.

Yup. That's the attitude right there: "When I was young I started out with nothing..." What these students are saying is, "I wish I could start out with nothing."

In the time since the 60's the ratio of the median income of a family to the cost of an education has grown from about 2:1, to about 1:2. The cost of education has been increasing at a much higher rate than inflation since the 60's, and the educational requirements of most jobs has been growing in the meanwhile. We aren't even talking about houses, so what are you on about?

Students are demanding reasonable tuition, and your interpretation is that they want any living they want? Pay closer attention, please. I left the country and went to a university that cost 1/10th the price of the universities I went to in Canada. These are not unreasonable demands, but your attitude is.
 

bobnoorduyn

Council Member
Nov 26, 2008
2,262
28
48
Mountain Veiw County
You owe more for your daughter's education? Good for your daughter, she can actually start off with nothing. I don't wish student loans on anyone, you included. Most people moving out into a career nowadays start with less than nothing, and you should be proud that you are able to shield your daughter from that. Strange that you think the complaint is about rich people though, these people are actually complaining about their own problems, not somebody else's lack of problems.

Nothing like the Bank O' Dad :lol:. But in all fairness, my dad paid for my flight training, as well as my brother's, though he took a different career path, (and makes more money at that). Dad bought a square tail razor back '59 Cessna 150. We learned to fly it together. A commercial pilot's license is basically useless without either an instrument or instructor rating or float experience. I delivered pizzas to pay for my ratings. At least dad made up some of the cost when he sold the thing at a profit, which is registered to someone in Collingwood when I checked last.





Dad smoking his signature pipe during takeoff. Gotta love it.
 

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