avro arrow

Tecumsehsbones

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Mar 18, 2013
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Oh sure....why not go where the price jumps by 3000% every time someone cancels an order and you have to sign a contract saying the US government and military retain ownership and control of the software and can shut it down remotely at any time anywhere in the world causing your new F-35 to fall from the sky like a rock.

Such an awesome deal....
Some restrictions apply.

Seeing as how a MAJOR part of the War of 1812 had to with the US removing British influence from the continent entirely and the US utterly failing in that attempt, I'd say the War of 1812 was a huge fail for the US. You got your asses handed to you by a ragtag group of militia, Native warriors and handful of British regulars.
America: The only country I know whose national anthem is about a war they didn't win.

That's right sport. The border that divided the US and BNA didn't move a single millimeter after the war. You see, I know Americans like to fool themselves into thinking they won that war because it's "too embarrassing" to admit otherwise. But when you fail to come close to achieving a primary goal in a war you started, it means you didn't win.

At best it was a draw for you guys. You didn't remove British influence from the continent at all but you did at least get the RN to stop screwing with your maritime commerce.
Is that what they teach y'all the war was about?
 

Murphy

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Apr 12, 2013
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You remember the Edsel? It was named after Edsel Ford, Henry's only child. The Ford family had real trouble in the fifties.





The Avro Arrow was made by American company, Ford Aerospace, from plans prepared in Mexico. It was named after Avro Ford, nephew of Henry. When Avro was 8 or 9, he would often get away from his nannies and run around the estate where he he lived, pretending to fly planes. The trouble was, he ran around naked and drooled a lot.

In the early 1950s, while making cars and military equipment, Ford decided to create a plane which would later become known as the Avro Arrow. He hoped that it would curb Avro's intense desire to be naked and reduce his drooling. By 1950, he had matured, and it was embarrassing for the family when he would dash across the patio, when his parents had people over. It was said that Avro was very well endowed, which was a distraction.

Because the family was embarrassed about young Avro and his eccentricities, they decided to have the plane made. But they didn't want anyone to know why it was being built or who it was for. The Fords decided to make it in Canada. They hired a drunken British engineer, Eldon Myers, and paid him to show up to work in Malton (now a part of Mississauga, just outside of Toronto), pretend to be in charge (but actually drink for the day) and then be driven home.

Ford got their plane, but sadly, Avro never got to see it. He was struck by a delivery van on the estate grounds in the summer of 1957, about 8 months before the plane's first flight. The body went for almost two weeks before the Ford family identified him. The trouble? When police arrived, they couldn't find any identification on the body because Avro was naked.

 

Curious Cdn

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Feb 22, 2015
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The Avro Arrow was made by American company, Ford Aerospace, from plans prepared in Mexico. It was named after Avro Ford, nephew of Henry.


Does that explain why the front end of the fuselage looks like one of Jane Russell's boobs?
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
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Diefenbaker Sold out to the US

And made good money. Avro would have been a good bomber but F15-16 were being developed and Canada/A.V. Roe made more from the Space Race than they ever would have with the Arrow.

It was the Arrow or T.C. Douglas' Universal Health Care that Douglas and Pearson pushed for in Opposition.
 

MHz

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Probably just political since I believe we had two more conservative majority following diefenbaker
There ya go, sold out to have a seat at the corruption table.

Would the design have a place in drone work in the far north or as a weapons delivery platform at mach 3 and above?
 

Curious Cdn

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And made good money. Avro would have been a good bomber but F15-16 were being developed and Canada/A.V. Roe made more from the Space Race than they ever would have with the Arrow.

It was the Arrow or T.C. Douglas' Universal Health Care that Douglas and Pearson pushed for in Opposition.

The F-4 Phantom was being developed, at that time and many Avro Canada engineers ended up working at McDonnell.
 

taxslave

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Nov 25, 2008
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Oh sure....why not go where the price jumps by 3000% every time someone cancels an order and you have to sign a contract saying the US government and military retain ownership and control of the software and can shut it down remotely at any time anywhere in the world causing your new F-35 to fall from the sky like a rock.

Such an awesome deal....

If it runs on Microsoft all they have to do is wait and it will crash all on it's own.

All salty because of the failure known as the Avro.

How did that Rwanda thing workout? FAIL... Libya? FAIL... 1812? FAIL

Keep them tears coming B00Mer!

1812? Isn't the when a couple of the boys oversampled the shine and wondered down to Washington and started a wee bonfire in the shack your Prez was squating in?
 

MHz

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Made in Canada, eh!! :canada:
Add 2 more engines and more wing and how much weight can it haul at supersonic speeds?

Canada's role should include super conductors as we have places like Baffin Island that could become a space launch facility that bypasses the radiation belt..
 

B00Mer

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Sep 6, 2008
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Add 2 more engines and more wing and how much weight can it haul at supersonic speeds?

Canada's role should include super conductors as we have places like Baffin Island that could become a space launch facility that bypasses the radiation belt..

You mean the Avro Canada C102 Jetliner?

[youtube]GSHMC_ThYCQ[/youtube]

 
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Curious Cdn

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Feb 22, 2015
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Add 2 more engines and more wing and how much weight can it haul at supersonic speeds?

Canada's role should include super conductors as we have places like Baffin Island that could become a space launch facility that bypasses the radiation belt..

Avro Canada engineers also worked on the Concorde.
 

PoliticalNick

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Mar 8, 2011
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Unfortunately for those of us committed to purchase F-35s we have been duped into believing it is not just a fantastic aircraft but also a fantastic deal. Wrong on both counts. The VTO system has had major issues and even a complete catastrophic failure. It apparently bleeds fuel when inverted. The thrust vectoring tabs which are supposed to add maneuverability have a habit of sticking making it harder to fly and the power to weight ratio leaves it much slower than many fighters from 20+ years ago. Add in that the US government and military have designed the sales contracts to retain complete control over the software and maintenance parts supply and it's really a piece of junk.

Now if you want a real military aircraft the the Typhoon Euro-fighter is probably the best thing going at the moment unless you can figure out how to get your hands on the F-22 Raptor which puts every other plane to shame.
 

Murphy

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Apr 12, 2013
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Money was the big thing. The CF101 (Voodoo) was originally purchased for $750,000 a unit. That was a figure bashed around when I was still in uniform. I cannot find a cite. In contrast, the Arrow's price tag was considerably more. Voodoos were in production in the US, with no no build costs, just a straight across purchase.

In contrast, 27 million dollars was given out by the Cdn govt for development of the Arrow. A further $260 million was scheduled to be released for 5 test Arrows. To be fair, this included the start up costs - facilities and people - but that would have put the price tag at $287 million, in 1950s dollars, with no sales and only five a/c. And, being the cynic, I believe those costs would have climbed. After all, the government was funding it.

My personal belief is, that despite all the flag waving and improvements in performance, the price tag was too high.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avro_Canada_CF-105_Arrow
 
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