The New Paganism and the Culture of Death

[RomSpaceKnight]

Heretic Heart


Catherine Madsen

I am a bold and a Pagan soul
A-ramblin' through this land
I judge the world by my own lights
And I come by my own hand
And if you ask me where I learned
To live so recklessly
My skin, my bones, my Heretic heart
Are my authority
My mother was a singer of tales
My father a dreaming man
And I have swung from the dragon's tongue
And danced on Holy Land
I've sung the seed up out of the ground
And the bird down from the tree
My skin, my bones, my Heretic heart
Are my authority
I once was found but now I'm gone
Away from the "Faithful Fold"
Of those who preach that holiness
Is to do as you are told
Though law and scripture, priest and prayer
Have all instructed me
My skin, my bones, my Heretic heart
Are my authority
Now they tell me Jesus loves me
But I think that he loves in vain
He must go unrequited
On me he has no claim
For the man who would command me must
(Alt: My Goddess is our Lady Moon)
Wear the horn and let me be
(Alt: Whose tides run deep in me)
My skin, my bones, my Heretic heart
Are my authority
And while I breathe this glorious air
An outlaw I'll remain
My body will not be subdued
And I will not be "saved"
And if I cannot shout it loud
I'll sing it secretly
My skin, my bones, my Heretic heart
Are my authority
​

 

[selfactivated]

So Mote It Be

 

[Dexter Sinister]

Exactly, but let's be honest. It's really not of any importance to our real lives. It's a diversion, an exercise. I very much doubt most of us would speak the same to one another if we were physcially in a room together.

In fact, I'd bet most of us would get on just fine, different beliefs and all.

You're probably right, but for how long? Spending a social evening with people can be just as artificial and limited a situation as this little piece of virtual reality is.

And just as a point of interest, I would probably speak exactly the same way to any of you I met in person as I do here. I'm not pretending to be anyone else here, this is really me, what you see is what you get. One of my best friends in the world is an Anglican minister, though alas, he's recently taken a posting in Victoria and moved far away, and I have exactly the same kind of exchanges in person with him that I do with you here. You remind me very strongly of him. We agree on much, in terms of personal values and philosophies, we just disagree on where they come from. We argue about the meaning and purpose of it all, he says something dumb, I correct him, I say something dumb, he corrects me, then we pour us each a glass of our favourite scotch (The Macallan) and laugh about taking ourselves too seriously. I think I could probably do that with you too. (I've read your poetry, remember, and it probably says more about you than anything you've posted here. ) There are others here who share your faith that I know I could not do that with, and wouldn't even consider trying.

One of the nicer things about this forum, actually, is that it's a lot easier to avoid saying something dumb. I have time to think about what I want to say, and time to check references to be sure I've got my facts straight, that I really don't have in a face to face conversation. Some of my posts (not many) I've thought about for days, composed off-line with a word processor, then C&P'd into here when I was content with them. .

Sorry, bit of a hijack, but your comments really piqued my interest.

 

[RomSpaceKnight]

Our family's best friends are church going Catholics. The mother does try to get across her RC convictions but politely. Not by calling names and insinuating ties with Nazis. They are good Christians who show respect and politeness. Guess Aholes come in all creeds.

 

[sanctus]

You're probably right, but for how long? Spending a social evening with people can be just as artificial and limited a situation as this little piece of virtual reality is.

Very good point. I tend, to be honest with you, to very much dislike those sort of evenings, mouthing platitudes with people I really have no great interest in being around.

And just as a point of interest, I would probably speak exactly the same way to any of you I met in person as I do here. I'm not pretending to be anyone else here, this is really me, what you see is what you get. One of my best friends in the world is an Anglican minister, though alas, he's recently taken a posting in Victoria and moved far away, and I have exactly the same kind of exchanges in person with him that I do with you here. You remind me very strongly of him. We agree on much, in terms of personal values and philosophies, we just disagree on where they come from. We argue about the meaning and purpose of it all, he says something dumb, I correct him, I say something dumb, he corrects me, then we pour us each a glass of our favourite scotch (The Macallan) and laugh about taking ourselves too seriously.

I concur. I feel the same towards you. I had a friend like you as well, oddly enough. We were great mates and debated endlessly these same things. I found it easier to express myself with him than with some of my peers. sometimes, in truth, some of the people in the Church are a bit much to handle, even for me.

I think I could probably do that with you too. (I've read your poetry, remember, and it probably says more about you than anything you've posted here. ) There are others here who share your faith that I know I could not do that with, and wouldn't even consider trying.

I think poetry is the most sublime art form. One has to be so concise and for me it is an ultimate release of those inner thoughts that we often fail to express "live". I was quite drawn to that world as a young man, and in University was very much an "artsie", the whole coffee shop, etc. sort of thing. Interestingly enough, I was also convinced there was no God in University. Used to mock the faith and Christians in general all the time.

I suspect now it was a reaction. I envy sometimes the experiences some people have had in their upbringing, for mine was fairly conventional. Parents married, stable, supportive homelife, close with siblings(still am as a matter of fact). My brother and two sisters and I were not abused, rejected, or any of those things. Mother very religious, but not fanatic. Religious in the way that generation was, Mass on Sunday for the whole family, involved in the parish. Both my brother and I were altar boys. In short, a fairly "normal" family life.

One of the nicer things about this forum, actually, is that it's a lot easier to avoid saying something dumb. I have time to think about what I want to say, and time to check references to be sure I've got my facts straight, that I really don't have in a face to face conversation. Some of my posts (not many) I've thought about for days, composed off-line with a word processor, then C&P'd into here when I was content with them. .

Sorry, bit of a hijack, but your comments really piqued my interest.

hijack away, I found your comments educational!

 

[sanctus]

Guys somepeople think this is all a joke, that it doesnt hurt anyone. Ive spent nights crying, praying to Fae an Pan that Id find the right words or the right tone so that those that read my words find solice or fellowship. But there are those that find this all a game that think that hurting words do nothing to the reader. I Thank Goddess for friends like you Bear and Rom that see this isnt a game. You see that this touches REAL people and I thank you for your words.

MUCH Love
Tam

I deeply apologize if you have been hurt by any of my offhand comments. You're right of course, and i hadn't thought of the potential that people are taking these words terribly seriously. for me, it's an intellectual rest, a sort of place to exchange ideas, a diversion from reality. I tend, therefore, to not take these sorts of forums very seriously.

 

[mapleleafgirl]

I deeply apologize if you have been hurt by any of my offhand comments. You're right of course, and i hadn't thought of the potential that people are taking these words terribly seriously. for me, it's an intellectual rest, a sort of place to exchange ideas, a diversion from reality. I tend, therefore, to not take these sorts of forums very seriously.

i wouldnt apologize if i were you. their comments and attitude towards your church and you have been uncalled for, rude and nasty. in fact, i have them to partially thank for my faith choices cos after reading all the nastiness about the catholic church i just had to wonder what made them so irate and i realized it had to be the fact they know deep in their hearts theyre wrong.

 

[mapleleafgirl]

If you are making a pagan reference, it's actually called a "besom" if a witch uses it for rituals and such.

brooms??? that sounds kinda silly.do pagans use dustpans too?hah hah hah

 

[mapleleafgirl]

I have several I use them to sweep out negitive feelings and energies in my house

youre kidding, right? my mom uses brooms to sweep up dirt, hey, whatever turns your crank...

 

[m_levesque]

No matter how you dress it up, paganism is an offence to God who made us in His image. It is evil because it completely opposes the will of God. According to the pagan/wiccan rede, the following things are OK:-

- all forms of sexual perversion (I don't have to name them)
- adultery (as long as partner doesn't find out), fornication
- Cheating on tax payments
- Self mutilation (and suicide?)
- Viewing hard-core porn, paedophilic porn, snuff movies
- Taking hard drugs, getting blind drunk.
- Contraception, abortion.

Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.​

 

[m_levesque]

Heretic Heart


Catherine Madsen

I am a bold and a Pagan soul
A-ramblin' through this land
I judge the world by my own lights
And I come by my own hand

Are my authority
​

The 'pagans' of today are not 'connected' with the so-called 'pagans' of the past, or the 'wise' Druids, or even the earliest 'wise women' of prehistory. Those people and groups evolved or were self-limiting. "Pagans" of today are part of a new-age group which thinks, based on 'books', that they are part of those 'old times'. Like a person in the "Society for Creative Anachronism", you carefully select a character for yourself, surround yourself with contemporarily made 'old time' costumes and trappings, and 'play a part.

I was 'there' in the 70s when all these new 'pagan' and 'witchcraft' books started appearing. I read them then; I read them now. They are carefully crafted (hah) to achieve just exactly the results I see in those who call themselves pagans and witches today--a blindness which thinks it sees everything 'new', a skepticism about everything but the pseudo beliefs they themselves embrace. . .and the people responsible for this are not, sadly, 'long dead.'

 

[selfactivated]

i wouldnt apologize if i were you. their comments and attitude towards your church and you have been uncalled for, rude and nasty. in fact, i have them to partially thank for my faith choices cos after reading all the nastiness about the catholic church i just had to wonder what made them so irate and i realized it had to be the fact they know deep in their hearts theyre wrong.

Little girl I have treated you with nothing but utmost respect and I will not tolerate your disrespectful attitude. As I have Sanctus I will now put you also on ignore. Im glad you found your path, it suits you.

 

[selfactivated]

youre kidding, right? my mom uses brooms to sweep up dirt, hey, whatever turns your crank...

What turns my crank Little one will take you several lifetimes to appreciate. I hope you grow up and loose the mean streak.

 

[selfactivated]

No matter how you dress it up, paganism is an offence to God who made us in His image. It is evil because it completely opposes the will of God. According to the pagan/wiccan rede, the following things are OK:-​

- all forms of sexual perversion (I don't have to name them)
- adultery (as long as partner doesn't find out), fornication
- Cheating on tax payments
- Self mutilation (and suicide?)
- Viewing hard-core porn, paedophilic porn, snuff movies
- Taking hard drugs, getting blind drunk.
- Contraception, abortion.​

Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.​

You just discribed every man I know! (sorry to the general public its an over statement but you get my jist)

 

[selfactivated]

The 'pagans' of today are not 'connected' with the so-called 'pagans' of the past, or the 'wise' Druids, or even the earliest 'wise women' of prehistory. Those people and groups evolved or were self-limiting. "Pagans" of today are part of a new-age group which thinks, based on 'books', that they are part of those 'old times'. Like a person in the "Society for Creative Anachronism", you carefully select a character for yourself, surround yourself with contemporarily made 'old time' costumes and trappings, and 'play a part.

I was 'there' in the 70s when all these new 'pagan' and 'witchcraft' books started appearing. I read them then; I read them now. They are carefully crafted (hah) to achieve just exactly the results I see in those who call themselves pagans and witches today--a blindness which thinks it sees everything 'new', a skepticism about everything but the pseudo beliefs they themselves embrace. . .and the people responsible for this are not, sadly, 'long dead.'

Another Priest judging. Have you been to a circle? Do you know any Pagans? What happened to Judge not? People like you are why people like me try to commit suicide. We believe your self rightious tripe.

 

[hermanntrude]

According to the pagan/wiccan rede, the following things are OK:-

- all forms of sexual perversion (I don't have to name them)
- adultery (as long as partner doesn't find out), fornication
- Cheating on tax payments
- Self mutilation (and suicide?)
- Viewing hard-core porn, paedophilic porn, snuff movies
- Taking hard drugs, getting blind drunk.
- Contraception, abortion.



Please correct me if I'm wrong on this.

​

i doubt that anyone in their right mind believes all of these are all right. although your umberella term of "sexual perversion" probably covers several things which are just fine and dandy by me, and i'm pretty sure i'm not evil. And where does it say in the bible "thou shalt not cheat on your tax payments" and which pagan told you that they condone it?

i could continue

 

[selfactivated]

I deeply apologize if you have been hurt by any of my offhand comments. You're right of course, and i hadn't thought of the potential that people are taking these words terribly seriously. for me, it's an intellectual rest, a sort of place to exchange ideas, a diversion from reality. I tend, therefore, to not take these sorts of forums very seriously.

Im taking you off ignore for 1 day. I want to know at what point did you finaly get that Im a real person with real feelings? Who clued you in? Why didnt you read the other thousand posts I cried myself to sleep over? What makes you think your words dont have an impact? Youve taught the young one well.

 

[m_levesque]

Another Priest judging. Have you been to a circle? Do you know any Pagans? What happened to Judge not? People like you are why people like me try to commit suicide. We believe your self rightious tripe.

Another priest! Thanks for the compliment. Wish I was sometimes, but on the other hand I couldn't handle it as well as they do.

You're taking the internet too seriously. Get away from the computer and go out into the real world for a bit.

 

[selfactivated]

Another priest! Thanks for the compliment. Wish I was sometimes, but on the other hand I couldn't handle it as well as they do.

You're taking the internet too seriously. Get away from the computer and go out into the real world for a bit.

I dont throw that word around as a compliment. Take care of your own life, I do just fine nowadays thank you very much.

 

[RomSpaceKnight]

i wouldnt apologize if i were you. their comments and attitude towards your church and you have been uncalled for, rude and nasty. in fact, i have them to partially thank for my faith choices cos after reading all the nastiness about the catholic church i just had to wonder what made them so irate and i realized it had to be the fact they know deep in their hearts theyre wrong.

hey welcome! my names sue. i just turned 17 a short time ago.im in grade 11. what about you dude?
this list is okay. lots of nice people here. some sort of messed up stuff sometimes! so what else are you into? got a pic to share on the profile thing man?ok, peace out.


i agree, i think great britian is tired and boring..they have the same sort of imperial attitude the yankees have that makes me think they think they are all that. i wish wed get ride of our ties to them. i really do. get rid of the queen and all that stupid royal stuff that is a waste of time and money. my brother says we dont pay directly to the queen, but we still pay for lt gov and the governer general and all that stuff so it is paying to support the queen indirectly. get rid of them and be a totally free country i say.i have no respect at all for england or english people


americans are probably the dumbest people on the planet. they are good in making money and taking adventage of people, and that is about it, and killing, they're really good at killing everyone.
could only be one of two reasons..their welfare cheques are late or the local liquor store closed down....thats about all they care about as a people..


im 18.. so what. does that mean i dont have a voice at all? im sorry, but the royal family is out of date..they are parasites and they are living off the blood of the people their family raped and stole from. they make me sick, all of them...too much money...and not elected into their offices..



You have lied about your age, insulted the English, The Americans and the natives. The RC church can have you. You little girl are not a nice person. I am English, Selfactivated is American and CDN Bear is native. You have personally insulted 3 persons here. Might I suggest you grow up before you turn in to a sour old spinster that no man wants and no woman would befriend.