Re: RE: The Collapse of Globa
No credibility with darkbeaver! Oh no, my career is in the tank!
Haha, its always about oil to the Far Left. And not drinking the kool-aid is "discounting".
Oh, and on the world bank and Stiglitz, I love how you guys lump all these things into the one big evil mantra of "globalization" and exhibit this Pavolvian response. Its so hilariously simplistic. You see dude, I don't necessarily disagree with Stiglitz and his criticisms of the World Bank.
Saul argued that we didn't come out of the recession. That is a joke! We have NOT had a steady decline in real incomes since the early 1970s. Maybe you have, but everyone else hasn't.
Ya wanna see? Here are the wages, right from the Bureau of Economic Statistics.
Total US nominal wages paid
http://www.bea.doc.gov/bea/dn/nipaweb/IndexW.htm#W - Wages and salary disbursements, Table 2.1
in billions
1929 $50.5
1940 $49.9
1950 $147.2
1960 $272.9
1970 $551.6
1980 $1,377.7
1990 $2.754.0
2000 $4,892.4
2004 $5,389.4
Annual growth in total nominal wages by decade
1930s -0.9%
1940s 11.4%
1950s 6.8%
1960s 7.2%
1970s 9.3%
1980s 7.5%
1990s 5.6%
2000s 3.8%
Total 6.3%
Annual growth in total national income by decade. This includes rent, dividends, interest payments, and other returns to capital.
1930s -1.5%
1940s 11.0%
1950s 6.6%
1960s 7.1%
1970s 10.2%
1980s 8.3%
1990s 5.5%
2000s 4.5%
Total 6.4%
Real wage growth
(You'll have to adjust for inflation yourself. http://www.bea.doc.gov/bea/dn/nipaweb/IndexW.htm#W - Price indexes, Table 1.1.4)
1930s 1.2%
1940s 5.7%
1950s 4.3%
1960s 4.7%
1970s 2.5%
1980s 2.7%
1990s 3.3%
2000s 1.6%
Total 3.3%
Real total income growth
1930s 0.5%
1940s 5.3%
1950s 4.1%
1960s 4.6%
1970s 3.4%
1980s 3.4%
1990s 3.2%
2000s 2.2%
Total 3.4%
Real per capita wage growth.
(You'll have to adjust the per capita figures yourself http://www.bea.doc.gov/bea/dn/nipaweb/IndexW.htm#W - Population Growth, Table 7.1)
1930s 0.4%
1940s 4.3%
1950s 2.5%
1960s 3.3%
1970s 1.4%
1980s 1.7%
1990s 2.0%
2000s 0.6%
Total 2.1%
Real per capita total income growth.
1930s -0.2%
1940s 4.0%
1950s 2.3%
1960s 3.2%
1970s 2.3%
1980s 2.5%
1990s 1.9%
2000s 1.2%
Total 2.2%
Looked at another way, real per capita annualized wage growth
1935-1944 9.3%
1945-1954 -0.5%
1955-1964 1.9%
1965-1974 2.7%
1975-1984 1.1%
1985-1994 1.6%
1995-2004 2.1%
or
1945-1974 1.4%
1975-2004 1.6%
or
1980-2004 1.7%
Real per capita annualized income growth
1935-1944 8.1%
1945-1954 0.0%
1955-1964 2.1%
1965-1974 3.1%
1975-1984 2.3%
1985-1994 1.8%
1995-2004 2.1%
1945-1974 1.7%
1975-2004 2.1%
or
1980-2004 2.1%
Conclusion - this idea that wages have been falling the past few decades is false. In fact, they have accelerated since 1980.
darkbeaver said:It has been difficult for me to afford you much credibility Toro, first and several times I have seen you discount the importance of oil, incorrectly,and now you discount Sauls statement about the depression that I have witnessed since the early seventys, I will repeat the fact, there has been a steady decline in the real income
of north americans since the very early seventies.While you may not see this as a depression millions do. You are not an economic genius yourself.
PS The world bank , see Stiglitz.
No credibility with darkbeaver! Oh no, my career is in the tank!
Haha, its always about oil to the Far Left. And not drinking the kool-aid is "discounting".
Oh, and on the world bank and Stiglitz, I love how you guys lump all these things into the one big evil mantra of "globalization" and exhibit this Pavolvian response. Its so hilariously simplistic. You see dude, I don't necessarily disagree with Stiglitz and his criticisms of the World Bank.
Saul argued that we didn't come out of the recession. That is a joke! We have NOT had a steady decline in real incomes since the early 1970s. Maybe you have, but everyone else hasn't.
Ya wanna see? Here are the wages, right from the Bureau of Economic Statistics.
Total US nominal wages paid
http://www.bea.doc.gov/bea/dn/nipaweb/IndexW.htm#W - Wages and salary disbursements, Table 2.1
in billions
1929 $50.5
1940 $49.9
1950 $147.2
1960 $272.9
1970 $551.6
1980 $1,377.7
1990 $2.754.0
2000 $4,892.4
2004 $5,389.4
Annual growth in total nominal wages by decade
1930s -0.9%
1940s 11.4%
1950s 6.8%
1960s 7.2%
1970s 9.3%
1980s 7.5%
1990s 5.6%
2000s 3.8%
Total 6.3%
Annual growth in total national income by decade. This includes rent, dividends, interest payments, and other returns to capital.
1930s -1.5%
1940s 11.0%
1950s 6.6%
1960s 7.1%
1970s 10.2%
1980s 8.3%
1990s 5.5%
2000s 4.5%
Total 6.4%
Real wage growth
(You'll have to adjust for inflation yourself. http://www.bea.doc.gov/bea/dn/nipaweb/IndexW.htm#W - Price indexes, Table 1.1.4)
1930s 1.2%
1940s 5.7%
1950s 4.3%
1960s 4.7%
1970s 2.5%
1980s 2.7%
1990s 3.3%
2000s 1.6%
Total 3.3%
Real total income growth
1930s 0.5%
1940s 5.3%
1950s 4.1%
1960s 4.6%
1970s 3.4%
1980s 3.4%
1990s 3.2%
2000s 2.2%
Total 3.4%
Real per capita wage growth.
(You'll have to adjust the per capita figures yourself http://www.bea.doc.gov/bea/dn/nipaweb/IndexW.htm#W - Population Growth, Table 7.1)
1930s 0.4%
1940s 4.3%
1950s 2.5%
1960s 3.3%
1970s 1.4%
1980s 1.7%
1990s 2.0%
2000s 0.6%
Total 2.1%
Real per capita total income growth.
1930s -0.2%
1940s 4.0%
1950s 2.3%
1960s 3.2%
1970s 2.3%
1980s 2.5%
1990s 1.9%
2000s 1.2%
Total 2.2%
Looked at another way, real per capita annualized wage growth
1935-1944 9.3%
1945-1954 -0.5%
1955-1964 1.9%
1965-1974 2.7%
1975-1984 1.1%
1985-1994 1.6%
1995-2004 2.1%
or
1945-1974 1.4%
1975-2004 1.6%
or
1980-2004 1.7%
Real per capita annualized income growth
1935-1944 8.1%
1945-1954 0.0%
1955-1964 2.1%
1965-1974 3.1%
1975-1984 2.3%
1985-1994 1.8%
1995-2004 2.1%
1945-1974 1.7%
1975-2004 2.1%
or
1980-2004 2.1%
Conclusion - this idea that wages have been falling the past few decades is false. In fact, they have accelerated since 1980.