Softwodd Lumber Dispute

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
I saw a political analyst predicting that the NDP could give the Conservatives a real run for the official opposition position if a trade war goes ahead. I haven't been following things closely enough for the past couple weeks to guess whether he's right or wrong, but Canadians are really fed up with US trade policies right now.

McKenna was making trade war noises today though, so the Liberals are at least willing to talk tough about this.

The American position is that want to negotiate. I have news for them, we already did the negotiating. It's called NAFTA. If they can't abide by it, then I guess they don't want our energy and don't want access to a market of over 30 million wealthy, educated consumers.
 

Can Man

New Member
Aug 25, 2004
6
0
1
It really come down to what Bush wants. With what happened in New Orleans and Mobile today, they really do need some reasonably priced 2x4's. If there was ever incentive for them to comply or at least settle it is now.
 

mrmom2

Senate Member
Mar 8, 2005
5,380
6
38
Kamloops BC
I'm sure the people down there want cheaper better quality wood the problem is Bush don't care about the people only his corporate friends :wink:
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
RE: Softwodd Lumber Dispu

That isn't the real issue though. The real issue is that the lumber industry spends a huge amount of money funding both Democrats and Republicans. They want to be repaid for that support and screwing Canada is how that happens.

The only way to beat the lumber lobby is to swing a bigger political hammer. Getting our politicians on US TV in swing ridings and saying, "Smarten the hell up or pay the price," is how to do this.

The catch is that we have to be willing to follow through. No empty threats. If we say that we will introduce an export tax on all energy going to the US, we have to be willing to do just that.

It also has to be publicised. Most Americans don't even know that they are paying extra for lumber so that the politicians can repay political favours. We need to get that on the US media. Again, energy is the way to do that...they pay very little attention to anything else.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
RE: Softwodd Lumber Dispu

It's an interim decision, first of all. All of the arguments haven't been heard yet. The final decision on that particular case will be this fall sometime.

Second of all, the US does have huge political influence within the WTO. Even with that, they've lost every other case on softwood lumber.

Third of all, the NAFTA panel (with more Americans than Canadians on it) is supposed to have the final word in trade disputes between Canada and the US. That's the point of the agreement.
 

Shiva

Electoral Member
Sep 8, 2005
149
0
16
Toronto
Well, it seems we're giving up on the American market, not that I have any problem with diversifying our trade:

Martin pitches softwood to China

By DANIEL LEBLANC AND PETER KENNEDY

Monday, September 19, 2005 Posted at 1:55 AM EDT

From Monday's Globe and Mail

Prime Minister Paul Martin made a direct pitch to Chinese President Hu Jintao over the weekend to sell more Canadian softwood to China in an effort to lessen Canada's reliance on the contentious U.S. market.

The overture was made amid growing calls for a tougher Canadian response to the lingering softwood trade dispute with the United States, which will see a bump in demand for softwood as a result of the rebuilding effort along the storm-savaged Gulf Coast.

The Conservative Party welcomed the government's efforts to help open the Chinese market to more softwood, saying that Opposition Leader Stephen Harper called last month for that exact approach.

Conservative MP Monte Solberg said that given the dispute with the United States, Canada needs to adopt an “aggressive strategy” to open up the Chinese market.

“It's pretty obvious that if the Americans seem to have gone soft on the whole concept of free trade, we just have to find other markets for our products, and China is going, of course, to be a major market for these products,” he said.

Mr. Martin made his pitch to sell more softwood in China during weekend talks in Vancouver with Mr. Hu, who was finishing a 10-day visit to North America.

There was talk of improving human rights in China during the visit, but also a deep focus on increasing trade with the most populous country in the world.

“We discussed softwood lumber, in terms of the ability for Canada to increase its exports of softwood lumber to China,” Mr. Martin said after the meeting.“We obviously discussed the strategic partnership which the Chinese announced that they wanted to have with us in a wide range of areas, from higher technologies to natural resources.”

Mr. Hu was open to the proposal as he called for increased ties — and trade — between Canada and China in coming years.

“The Chinese government attaches great importance to Asia Pacific regional co-operation,” Mr. Hu told guests at a luncheon. He said he wanted China and Canada to increase commerce “with a view to bringing two-way trade to over $30-billion (U.S.) by 2010.”

Canada sells $9.5-billion (Canadian) worth of goods to China a year, and buys $10.5-billion from the Chinese, according to data from International Trade Canada.

“Both sides agree to upgrade China-Canada relations to a level of strategic partnership. This move meets the needs of our times and the wishes of our two peoples,” Mr. Hu said.

The Americans have refused to comply with a recent NAFTA panel ruling that said there is no basis to impose trade tariffs on Canadian softwood, insisting instead on a negotiated solution to the dispute.

Canada cannot retaliate by slapping tariffs on other U.S. goods, because it has lost a separate case before the World Trade Organization.

Any effort to open the Chinese market further to Canadian lumber will be greeted with cautious optimism by the domestic forestry sector, one industry official said. That's because the forest industry's dependence on the United States market has cost it $5-billion in trade duties in the past five years.

“However, we have to be realistic about how much lumber shipments to China are likely to grow in the next few years,'' said Rick Doman, a timber trader based in Duncan, B.C.China remains a small market for lumber-producing provinces such as British Columbia, which accounts for 54 per cent of all Canadian softwood exports to the United States. Last year, B.C.'s softwood shipments to China accounted for only 5 per cent of the value of lumber that it shipped to the United States.

Efforts to increase the Chinese market are expected to be hampered by cultural differences, including the fact that wood frame homes are considered a fire hazard in China.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
RE: Softwodd Lumber Dispu

We've won eight and they've won one. More than that, they need our lumber. Talk to an American contractor about the low quality of the wood produced in the US. It's crap. Filled with knots and prone to twisting.

It's time to sell our lumber everywhere else before we even look at the US market.

It's also time to rip up NAFTA. If the US won't abide by its rulings, then neither should we.
 

PoisonPete2

Electoral Member
Apr 9, 2005
651
0
16
I hope we have enough time before the next election to see if Paul Martin actually has the cajones to invite the U.S. government into an American Court to have them face the consequences of not following their NAFTA obligations. Somehow i feel Martin is only playing for the Public and will do nothing after the next election. Unfortunately he is the one in control of the election timing. He is so totally a phoney. I would ask him why his company was given 160,000,000 taxpayers dollars while he was finance minister.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
RE: Softwodd Lumber Dispu

I think Martin is playing to the public too. With Dingwall flaring up and Gomery about to be back in the spotlight he needs something.

Let's see what he does though. Even if he just playing to the public, he'll have to back his words up with actions soon.
 

no1important

Time Out
Jan 9, 2003
4,125
0
36
58
Vancouver
members.shaw.ca
RE: Softwodd Lumber Dispu

Now they need "clarification" This was the 5th time they were told to drop duties. Actually I think we should pull out of the Nafta as America seems to only hinourit when it suits them. They always have one excuse after another. I sure hope China and India buy enough so we do not have to worry about our southern thugs anymore.

Washington again dodges ruling slashing softwood lumber tariffs

OTTAWA (CP) - Washington has again delayed acting on a NAFTA ruling that ordered it to drastically cut some duties on Canadian softwood lumber exports.

The U.S. Department of Commerce says it needs clarification from the trade body on an order that would essentially eliminate crippling countervail duties that total more than 16 per cent on softwood exports.

It's the fifth time the department has been ordered to cut the duties. And this latest delay sends a negative signal to Ottawa as to the prospects of the multibillion-dollar trade dispute ending any time soon.
 

Reverend Blair

Council Member
Apr 3, 2004
1,238
1
38
Winnipeg
RE: Softwodd Lumber Dispu

I have some clarification for them. Hey, USA! You were cheating. You got caught. You lost your case. Give us back our $5 billion. Play by the rules.
 

mrmom2

Senate Member
Mar 8, 2005
5,380
6
38
Kamloops BC
How about hey USA you don't want to play by the rules of NAFTA it aint worth the paper its written on .So go feck yourself no more Hydro no gas no oil unless you pay a surcharge say around 5 billion to start :wink:
 

Ten Packs

Council Member
Nov 21, 2004
1,505
5
38
Kamloops BC
Nah, mom - it'd be a lot easier if you and your work-mates would just get used to the idea of renting an cheap apartment and feeding your family KD for the rest of your life....