Residential Schools....Are You Kidding me

[Scott Free]

Bigotry and prejudice... yes, you've done a fine job of pointing out its existence, and most importantly, illustrating its formation. It was a neat lesson. Thanks Scott.

This strikes me as sarcastic.

So if I'm so wrong what would you recommend I do about my experience?

Am I to pretend I didn't see the things I saw in Alberta? Or pretend that it wasn't almost everyone I encountered that exhibited a dislike for my native friend?

What point is it that you think I'm missing?

 

[Lester]

Indigenous would infer that natives evolved here, they did not. There are piss tanks and dope addicts from all races and all walks of life, the last Job I was on a Native was in charge (Superintendent because he is the sharpest knife in the drawer) he went to powwows every weekend, he has a great house and family and lives on the reserve in cold lake. I also have two greatnephews and one greatneice that are half and half they are bright and articulate and I love them dearly,drunken indian is a stereotype. I have never been a racist and never will be, different cultures fascinate me to no end. The residential schools were from an antiquated era that is far behind us. On the otherhand don't natives already get counselling for drug abuse? free education? housing?they get lots of perks the rest of us don't. So on that point I agree with Albertabound they should not receive any counselling.

 

[karrie]

This strikes me as sarcastic.

So if I'm so wrong what would you recommend I do about my experience?

Am I to pretend I didn't see the things I saw in Alberta? Or pretend that it wasn't almost everyone I encountered that exhibited a dislike for my native friend?

What point is it that you think I'm missing?

The point that I think you're missing? I went over that way back... the issue of those who treat us poorly standing out in our minds, while those who don't fade away and don't register. So if I walked past 60 people in a day, and 3 treated me badly, it might seem like everyone I saw that day treated me badly. "Those____ are all a rude bunch of ____."

That, and the fact that you probably haven't seen 'the majority' of Alberta. You've seen a handful of the people who populate Alberta. But, your handful of bad apples become your defining factor. They become 'them' when you discuss Albertans in general, just as the OP used a broadstroke to discuss all those who received settlements in terms of those who've drank themselves to death or done nothing with their money.

 

[karrie]

I have never been a racist and never will be, different cultures fascinate me to no end. The residential schools were from an antiquated era that is far behind us. On the otherhand don't natives already get counselling for drug abuse? free education? housing?they get lots of perks the rest of us don't. So on that point I agree with Albertabound they should not receive any counselling.

What strikes me from seeing all the programs in place is that the only true solution would be to force people to attend the existing ones. And frankly, that's not a solution at all. That's just government nannying, stripping people of their rights. I don't know where in the bouts of alcoholism and drug abuse I've seen, someone could draw that line for someone else and essentially say 'we're locking you up in a program now.'

 

[gerryh]

Indigenous would infer that natives evolved here, they did not. There are piss tanks and dope addicts from all races and all walks of life, the last Job I was on a Native was in charge (Superintendent because he is the sharpest knife in the drawer) he went to powwows every weekend, he has a great house and family and lives on the reserve in cold lake. I also have two greatnephews and one greatneice that are half and half they are bright and articulate and I love them dearly,drunken indian is a stereotype. I have never been a racist and never will be, different cultures fascinate me to no end. The residential schools were from an antiquated era that is far behind us. On the otherhand don't natives already get counselling for drug abuse? free education? housing?they get lots of perks the rest of us don't. So on that point I agree with Albertabound they should not receive any counselling.

The comment in red.....I'll educate you there:

Eleven hundred students initially attended 69 schools across the country. In 1931, at the peak of the residential school system, there were about 80 schools operating in Canada. They were in every territory and province except Newfoundland, Prince Edward Island and New Brunswick. There were a total of about 130 schools from the earliest in the 19th century to the last, which closed in 1996.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/aboriginals/residentialschools.html


The comment in blue....... educate yourself before you start spewing anymore bullshyte.

 

[Lester]

As far as Natives blowing all their dough on drugs and booze, I know a few whites that have done the same thing (one guy I knew blew eighty grand on dope in six months)They shouldn't have given people that kind of money if they don't know how to handle it, maybe financial counselling would have been a better idea, help them start a business maybe- but it is about free will and they were entitled to the money, so who are we to tell them how to spend it. I can't think of any solution that would be acceptable or appropriate.

 

[Lester]

The comment in red.....I'll educate you there:



http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/aboriginals/residentialschools.html


The comment in blue....... educate yourself before you start spewing anymore bullshyte.

What, you googled it ten minutes ago and now your an expert. anyway it was a question not a statement.

 

[gerryh]

What, you googled it ten minutes ago and now your an expert. anyway it was a question not a statement.

Considering my heritage and my wifes heritage..... I knew about res schools a LONG time ago.... and your comment concerning the school's themselves was not a question, it was a statement. Your other comments are typical uneducated, bigoted BS.

 

[Lester]

That is not the question in Blue you will notice there are question marks, does that not denote a question? as far as residential schools go I will apologize for that as I thought such a thing would have been gone in the fifties. There is native blood in my family as well gerry and I take offence at being called a bigot.

 

[karrie]

That is not the question in Blue you will notice there are question marks, does that not denote a question? as far as residential schools go I will apologize for that as I thought such a thing would have been gone in the fifties. There is native blood in my family as well gerry and I take offence at being called a bigot.

Race issues are just one of those subjects where it's almost impossible to talk, from either side, without setting people's teeth on edge in some way shape or form.

 

[Lester]

Race issues are just one of those subjects where it's almost impossible to talk, from either side, without setting people's teeth on edge in some way shape or form.

I'm not here for a fight Karrie, I'm here to discuss and understand.
race means nothing to me, it's the character of people that's important. If someone wants to take cheap shots because they're a hothead, fine go ahead.

 

[Zzarchov]

Oppressed people don't usually know they're oppressed. The fact that you have family there is irrelevant in negating my OPINION but my OPINION still makes sense in the context of your EXPERIENCE since you have an emotional investment in your community, where I do not, BUT DO HAVE AN EMOTIONAL INVESTMENT IN MY FRIEND. All I have is my OPINION with how my native friend was treated and as I said, she wasn't the first to notice the prejudice - that is typical of oppressed people. So while my friend would have said everything is fine, we her three white friends, would have said they were not. Since apparently we were more able to know what being treated normally was like then she was; we noticed the prejudice first and pointed it out to her.

Now I am pointing it out to you.

I fixed your post for you, it had some typos that were making your message unclear.

 

[Scott Free]

The point that I think you're missing? I went over that way back... the issue of those who treat us poorly standing out in our minds, while those who don't fade away and don't register. So if I walked past 60 people in a day, and 3 treated me badly, it might seem like everyone I saw that day treated me badly. "Those____ are all a rude bunch of ____."

That, and the fact that you probably haven't seen 'the majority' of Alberta. You've seen a handful of the people who populate Alberta. But, your handful of bad apples become your defining factor. They become 'them' when you discuss Albertans in general, just as the OP used a broadstroke to discuss all those who received settlements in terms of those who've drank themselves to death or done nothing with their money.

I disagree. My experience was based on those people I interacted with not the people I passed on the street.

I can not negate my experience with your experience nor will I prefer yours to mine. I am also suspicious because not only does your position contradict my own but it also sounds like some multicultural, Oprah feel good, PC propaganda where I am to forget my experience and take on a new attitude based on wish thinking: "I wished everyone had been nice to my native friend in Alberta so I will ignore that most were not and say that they were bad apples and that I only, against all odds, ran into bad apples but that counter to my experience, most if not all Albertans are really very enlightened people with not a trace of racism in them (counter to scientific findings)" completely outrageous and total BS!

What's more you have no argument that would persuade me to interpret my experience differently than I have! Your only argument is about my assumptions and methods of gaining my opinion, where by the way, you are in error.

I will also point out that you fingered me as a "bad apple" because I conveyed my experience in Alberta and my opinion of the majority of people there. So you are condemning me the very same way you accuse me of condemning people in Alberta! If the people in Alberta don't want to be accused of being racist f**ks then I would suggest they stop acting like racist f**ks. You can accuse me of generalizing about Albertans all you want because it is true! Based on my experience Albertans by and large are racist bigots. I think it is probably due to their culture but I don't know.

Really karrie, about all you can convince me off is that some Albertans aren't racist f**ks (which I know anyway); that some are not bad apples (which I know anyway) or that you have some kind of handicap where you can't recognize hyperbole and it makes you fly off the handle.

 

[Scott Free]

I fixed your post for you, it had some typos that were making your message unclear.

Your too dumb for this thread but thanks for playing anyway. :roll:

 

[gerryh]

Personally...I found more racists and bigots in BC than I have in Alberta.

 

[Scott Free]

Personally...I found more racists and bigots in BC than I have in Alberta.

It can be very bad here too, I don't dispute that.

Most people in BC are definitely racist.

 

[mt_pockets1000]

Racism, prejudice and discrimination are all alive and well right across Canada. You gotta get down to the grassroots to see it displayed at it's nastiest. I was onsite at Canada Post in Ottawa around the time of the Iraq invasion. There were a few Middle Eastern people working at the facility. A couple of white Canadian boys were yelling and screaming at them, telling them to get the hell out of this country, shouting the worst kind of obscenities, blaming them and their 'kind' for all of the troubles in the world. It was unsettling to witness this outright hatred for another human because of his background.

My favorite encounter with racism though was in Yellowknife and I was on the receiving end. As a white man in Yellowknife I always felt I was a guest in an aboriginal city. After two years of living there I'd become aquainted with many people from the aboriginal community. The Dene are some of the nicest people around. It was a hot summer day at Folk on the Rocks and I was standing there watching the entertainment on stage. My poor old balding head was burnt a deep red from the sun. This particular fellow of Dene descent walked by and said, 'Geez man look at your head. And you whities have the nerve to call us redmen". Now granted this is a very funny line, especially coming from an aboriginal. But I was more shocked than humoured. My comeback was hey man I didn't coin the term redmen. Just because some uneducated fools from our past thought it was cool to label the aboriginals with that name doesn't mean I do the same. Anyway, the chap was taken by surprise at my response. He expected me to laugh along with the joke but I saw it as a form of racism and reacted accordingly. He apologized for the comment, bought me a beer to show no hard feelings and went on his way.

Look, you have to face racism head on. No beating around the bush. Just grab it by the collars and give it a shake. Tell the idiot who makes a smartass comment to smarten up. Never respond to a racist remark with another racist remark. That only fans the flames and never solves the problem. Always counteract with a steady even voice and really get in there and humiliate the S.O.B. Make eye contact with them and let them know you mean business.

 

[CDNBear]

I agree with Albertabound.

 

[Albertabound]

(ie, the ____ who isn't a jerk is just another person, not a ____, and fades away in our minds).

No...that would be the one that has responsibility in his or her life (oh I don't know ...lets say a job) and not just a burden on society. And yes Karrie I'll keep to my original term of "most". Just so you all know I'm not an Albertan, I am also not from the east where many people do not see the real way of life for a native.......and I am sorry but it is not my fault for their life style. As I stated they have every opportunity to better it but choose not to. Natives ( I refrain from using the term First Nations) given their schooling opportunities ......should be running this country if they so chose to .....they do not.

It all comes down to responsibilities and unfortunately ..yes most...natives don't have any, and I blame the gov. for that. Karrie from the time you were born until now, if you were paid to exist, had a paycheque of sorts come to you continuously with out a fear that it would end .....where do you think you would be in "life" right now? On top of that the whole time you were growing up you were taught to hate the people that are providing you with that money, because they did this to you're people and they did that to you're people. Exactly where would you be ? Remember......a paycheque every two weeks for the rest of your life.

Maybe it is because I come from a community where there are 4 reserves around it and only about 5 to 10% of the natives work. The rest of them just hang around the community (town) mostly loitering, waiting in front of the post office waiting for their cheques, harassing the common public, asking if you would like to buy a joint, and continuously littering the streets where they sit and pass the day away, and where the average reserve home only lasts 13 years after which point it is basically unlivable. No worries....a new one will be built for you. If these people are so concerned about "their" land why are they the biggest litter's (sorry for spelling)I have ever seen. I own a business that is frequented by natives. Tell me why it is that after every visit, I must go out and pick up their litter and then walk 10 steps over and put it in the garbage can. Why is it that I do not have to do this with any one else? If these people care so much for the land that we stole, why do they treat it like sh#t?

All I have is my experience with how my native friend was treated

Come to my town scottfree and I will show you the opposite. My town has a large native population and it is the caucasian type that get harassed. You can not go to the post office with out being asked for some money as they wait for their cheque to arrive. That part I can deal with. It is their reaction when you tell them ..no....that I can't deal with......Well f@#k you then you F*&k'n honkey. Come to my town and I will show you who is racist and who is not. So don't give me this crap about stereotyping and all the rest of it until you've lived where I do. Believe me, I have been in a lot of towns across western Canada and for the most part I see no difference. Once again it all comes down to responsibility......and yes Karrie...most of them do not have any.
A world with out responsibility is a terrible world.

The report by the way comes from Yellowknife

The comment in red.....I'll educate you there:Quote

Should I educate you all on the Doukebour experience when I comes to residential schools. They too were taken from their families, they to were abused in these schools, they to were only allowed to touch their parents through a fence. No crying for money from them however, Like I mentioned in my original post, if these people think money will heal their troubled past, they live in a fantasy land and should be prepared for the outcome of what a sh%t load of money will do to someone that has no responsibility, and don't worry the gov. knows this.

I might also add the gov was doing nothing more than pumping up the economy by doing this. Ford Canada had one of their biggest quarters in X amount of years all due to this payout.

,

so who are we to tell them how to spend it. I can't think of any solution that would be acceptable or appropriate.

How about ....We the gov of Canada will give you this money......HOWEVER,.....a portion of your cherub will come off of it directly and go into social programs in YOUR community and will be used directly for the betterment of YOUR community. Something wrong with that? But I could here the cries from here.....Oh but that is MY money and it is owed to ME not my community. Well screw you then, if you are so greedy that you are not willing to improve your own community with the newly acquired money then why should someone else provide it for you.....Oh yeah ..I forgot we took their land.....Bullsh*t. I didn't take anything and I am tired of paying for it out of my HARD EARNED dollars. When will the responsibility of these peoples actions fall back on themselves.

Unfortunately you guys, this post is not about racism and it was not intended to be about racism, but it sure turned into that.

 

[Zzarchov]

How about we give them the money then say tough ship if they wreck themselves from it?