Proof of Christianity

alasdair

Nominee Member
Oct 1, 2006
60
0
6
Hi

Please take a look at the following website for proof of Christianity:

www.worldends.co.uk

Proof for Christianity
Evidence for God
The lost art of spiritual healing
How to follow the true faith
Solving poverty

With best wishes,
Alasdair
 

gc

Electoral Member
May 9, 2006
931
20
18
There is no "proof" on that website. I think your definition of "proof" is a little off.
I could post a proof for the non-existance of God if you'd like.
 

Dexter Sinister

Unspecified Specialist
Oct 1, 2004
10,168
536
113
Regina, SK
This is proof positive.
Your standards of evidence are very low. There's no proof of anything in there, it's just another tortured interpretation of the apocalyptic passages in Daniel and Revelation. That one's no better or more convincing than any of the dozens of others I've encountered.

Go to a good library or used book shop and try to locate a copy of Asimov's Guide to the Bible. It'll set the proper historical context for those things. For instance, about Daniel, Asimov writes: "It was going to be the writer's purpose to denounce the Seleucid Empire, which in the second century B.C was persecuting Judaism ferociously. To avoid charges of rebellion and treason, the writer had to refrain from attacking the Seleucids directly. By putting the book into a period of past disaster, he could attack them indirectly. He could make Babylon and Nebuchadnezzar surrogate villains for Syria and the Seleucids and his readers would know what he meant while the overlords might have trouble proving it."

You're never going to make sense of the Bible without understanding the historical context in which it was written. All you'll be able to do is produce more of the flimsy and ill-informed arguments such as are in that .pdf file you linked to.
 

alasdair

Nominee Member
Oct 1, 2006
60
0
6
It is actually an interpretation of most of the Bible, not just the traditionally prophetic texts. Did you read all of it?
 

alasdair

Nominee Member
Oct 1, 2006
60
0
6
Well, I've clearly got a tough job then if everyone gives the same response as you! I've been put on the Earth, surrounded by people following the external form of the Christian faith, and have to teach them the true faith in order to eliminate the overwhelming evil in the world and poverty too! So it might be worthwhile for you to look at the whole site (to save your soul, assuming that you think church and hymns have anything to do with the true Christian faith?).
 

Andem

dev
Mar 24, 2002
5,643
128
63
Larnaka
Well, I've clearly got a tough job then if everyone gives the same response as you! I've been put on the Earth, surrounded by people following the external form of the Christian faith, and have to teach them the true faith in order to eliminate the overwhelming evil in the world and poverty too! So it might be worthwhile for you to look at the whole site (to save your soul, assuming that you think church and hymns have anything to do with the true Christian faith?).

You also put yourself on this web site to spam members with your ideas, not to discuss them.
 

Dexter Sinister

Unspecified Specialist
Oct 1, 2004
10,168
536
113
Regina, SK
I've been put on the Earth, surrounded by people following the external form of the Christian faith, and have to teach them the true faith in order to eliminate the overwhelming evil in the world and poverty too!
Um... okay, so who exactly do you think you are? If you're really that important, and you really do have the truth, surely there's some Biblical prophecy that refers to you. And what makes you think you have the truth of things and nobody else does?

Just so's you know, I'm an unrepentent old atheist, and you're highly unlikely to be able to convince me you have the truth of anything, unless you have some absolutely startling and extraordinary claims I've never encountered before, and the evidence and reasoning to back them up. What I've read so far at your links strongly suggests you don't have any of those things.
 
Last edited:

feronia

Time Out
Jul 19, 2006
252
0
16
Well, I've clearly got a tough job then if everyone gives the same response as you! I've been put on the Earth, surrounded by people following the external form of the Christian faith, and have to teach them the true faith in order to eliminate the overwhelming evil in the world and poverty too! So it might be worthwhile for you to look at the whole site (to save your soul, assuming that you think church and hymns have anything to do with the true Christian faith?).


Trying to force your faith on others isn't Christian. According to Jesus he told the disciples not to force their ways on the people they were missionaries to. He said if they did not listen leave them and as you walk away dust the sand off their feet and never look back.
 

humanbeing

Electoral Member
Jul 21, 2006
265
0
16
DexterSinister said:
...Go to a good library or used book shop and try to locate a copy of Asimov's Guide to the Bible...

Also available at the link below, for free:

http://thepiratebay.org/tor/3530316/The_Complete_Asimov.pdf

The [almost] complete works of Isaac Asimov. Awesome stuff. 4000 pages of the dude.

If anyone needs a hand on using torrents, just ask me and I will help.

btw, if you ain't big on reading off a monitor, or don't wanna print a bunch of pages, then Dexter is right: you will often find a half dozen books of his at a time on sale at a used book store. Then of course, the library is always good for stuff too. No shortage of his books anywhere you go, as far as I can tell.
 
Last edited:

alasdair

Nominee Member
Oct 1, 2006
60
0
6
There are no coincidences. Luck is next to Lucifer, fate is next to fatal. An example of a very convincing proof (ten million to one) on the site is this:


Taking just two instances of the number of the beast 616:

616 years between the birth of Jesus and the revelation that Muhammad received

Verse 61:6 in the Koran quoting Ahmed as coming after Jesus.

These are just about as promenent positions for 616 as you can get.

If you assume that they are random, what is the probability that the both occured?

Say Islam could have formed anywhere between 200AD and 1800AD. There are 6234 verses in the Koran.

Therefore, the probability of occurance is

(1/1600)*(1/6234)=0.0000001

or one in ten million
 

Dexter Sinister

Unspecified Specialist
Oct 1, 2004
10,168
536
113
Regina, SK
Therefore, the probability of occurance is

(1/1600)*(1/6234)=0.0000001

or one in ten million

Your understanding of probability theory is evidently about as limited as your knowledge of the Bible's historical context. Besides, things with one in ten million or worse odds against them happen all the time. Odds against winning at Lotto 6/49, for instance, are about 14 million to one, but people win it regularly. Your argument's meaningless.
 

alasdair

Nominee Member
Oct 1, 2006
60
0
6
The argument isn't meaningless - it is exactly as stated: from just two elements of evidence you can show that the likelihood of both occuring by random chance is one in 10 million. In combination with all the other proof on the website, Christianity is shown to be an absolute certainty, which is of course the nature of the apocalypse.
 

Dexter Sinister

Unspecified Specialist
Oct 1, 2004
10,168
536
113
Regina, SK
The argument isn't meaningless - it is exactly as stated: from just two elements of evidence you can show that the likelihood of both occuring by random chance is one in 10 million. In combination with all the other proof on the website, Christianity is shown to be an absolute certainty, which is of course the nature of the apocalypse.

Yeah well... There are others who will tell you, with proofs no better than what you've offered, that the number of the beast is 666, not 616. In fact most people who know anything about it would probably tell you it's 666. The KJ version is pretty clear about that: Rev 13:18. "Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six." A score is 20, threescore is thus 60, so the number is 666. According to Asimov's guide, some old manuscripts of Revelation do have 616, but the weight of evidence is that the number is 666. You have to understand that right up to Medieval times it was common to use letters of the alphabet to also signify numbers. No doubt you've seen Roman numerals; the Greek and Hebrew languages assigned numerical values to every letter, not just the few the Romans used for numbers, so all words in Greek and Hebrew would have numerical value. Jewish mystics would naturally assume the words of scripture had numerical significance as well, and spend a lot of time trying to analyze such things.

Apart from that, Jesus' birth year is not known with certainty. It isn't even known with any certainty that he was actually a historical person, there's almost no Bible-independent documentation of his existence. There is I think one mention in the writings of Josephus, who was citing secondary sources. As far as I know, there's no mention of him in the Roman records of the period covering his life, ministry, and death, and the Romans were almost as fanatical about record-keeping as the Nazis were. Moreover, why would you connect the number of the beast specifically with verse 61:6 of the Koran? Why not verse 6:16 of the Koran, or verse 6:16 of any book of the Bible that has at least six chapters and the sixth chapter has a 16th verse? I'll tell you why: because those don't work for the pointless argument you're trying to make. You're engaging in selective thinking, picking facts that appear to suit your purposes and ignoring any that don't. If the number of the beast is indeed 616, then why would there be any particular significance to it written as 61:6 or 6:16 and used as in index into some other document? You're not making sense. You're going to have to produce verse 6:16 of the Koran and verses 6:16 of every book of the Old and New Testaments and explain how and why they do or do not bear upon your argument. Until you do that, I'm calling BS on you.

Give it up alasdair. You cannot prove the truth of Christianity, or any other religious belief system, it's a logical impossibility, as you'd know if you understood anything about the nature of evidence and how to think clearly.