Pacifists versus peace
- Thread starter Freethinker
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RE: Pacifists versus peac
According to that same Bible that so many right wingers claim to believe in, nobody who adheres to its teachings will be attacked. {op cit}
According to that same Bible that so many right wingers claim to believe in, nobody who adheres to its teachings will be attacked. {op cit}
RE: Pacifists versus peac
Who's truth are you looking for? If I stated mine you'd crucify me too.
No way! What do you take me for, some kind of Jerry Falwell or something???? LOL!
Who's truth are you looking for? If I stated mine you'd crucify me too.
No way! What do you take me for, some kind of Jerry Falwell or something???? LOL!
Simpleton said:
It is my opinion that the peacemaker or pacifist and the warrior can be and is the same entity. The warrior would rather be hunting deer than a human being. Survival for the pacifist and the warrior are the same. They both want to be left to have a quiet and productive life for themselves and the ones they take care of.
So if its not the warrior that perpetuates the war who is it and to what purpose does it serve? In my opinion it’s the warmonger, the power hungry, the fear evokers. They feed on the idea that we need to have what the others have. They create the idea that we can’t live without what our neighbors have. Oil, minerals, currency are just to name a few of the things that are coveted by the Power hungry and the warmongers in the world.
The Pacifists and the peacemakers are one and the same with the Warriors; they all want to survive in a calm and secure environment. Ask any Military Man in the field where he'd rather be and what he'd rather be doing.
feronia said:
I don't totally disagree with your post, warriors would rather be home and at peace, but you did not take into account the other side of the coin which is the ones being preyed on by the warmongers etc. A warrior living in a peaceful, just, and fair society when faced with an attack by a warmonger will without hesitation rise to defend his countrymen and needn't be manipulated into doing so, simply, it's the right thing to do. Would a pacifist do the same or let himself be bowled over, give up his freedoms, and choose to live peacefully but oppressed under the warmonger's rule?
Nice post Lineman.
Look at israel. Rabin and Sharon were both very strong army generals both reached out and sought peace in their time. Netanyahu and Olmert neither military men have shown themselves to be warhawks. I think the military men have nothing to prove (having already done so) and are able to look honestly for peace knowing what failure means.
Look at israel. Rabin and Sharon were both very strong army generals both reached out and sought peace in their time. Netanyahu and Olmert neither military men have shown themselves to be warhawks. I think the military men have nothing to prove (having already done so) and are able to look honestly for peace knowing what failure means.
"Sharon sought peace in his time"??????
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!! QUOTE OF THE YEAR!!!!
Sharon :evil: is not a warrior but a criminal:
http://www.indictsharon.net/
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!! QUOTE OF THE YEAR!!!!
Sharon :evil: is not a warrior but a criminal:
http://www.indictsharon.net/
RE: Pacifists versus peac
Shaolin Monks are pacifists but can put the hurt on every one of you folks. They wouldn’t however because they recognize that the use of force is a very last resort. Hurting the people here, regardless of how easy, wouldn’t solve anything. Rather it’s best to respect life. Even the life of someone who wants to make an enemy of themselves.
What always impresses me is when a person can show restraint even when they know they are the more powerful.
Shaolin Monks are pacifists but can put the hurt on every one of you folks. They wouldn’t however because they recognize that the use of force is a very last resort. Hurting the people here, regardless of how easy, wouldn’t solve anything. Rather it’s best to respect life. Even the life of someone who wants to make an enemy of themselves.
What always impresses me is when a person can show restraint even when they know they are the more powerful.
"that the use of force is a very last resort"
Yes, but now let's define what would be the point where you would consider you're at the "the last resort". Before you're physically attacked, after you've been hit 2 times, when your life is starting to fade? How much violence and death must be inflicted before a country is at its "last resort"? How many deaths are acceptable to remain peaceful?
Yes, but now let's define what would be the point where you would consider you're at the "the last resort". Before you're physically attacked, after you've been hit 2 times, when your life is starting to fade? How much violence and death must be inflicted before a country is at its "last resort"? How many deaths are acceptable to remain peaceful?
RE: Pacifists versus peac
The founder/inventor Master Ueshiba Morihei of the martial arts form, Aikido was a pacifist. He grew up in a very violent time during war. His father was even beaten by a bunch of thugs hired by a political opponent. He definitely didn’t want to be weak in life.
However, one his greatest revelations came when he was challenged to combat by a Kendo master. He didn’t wish to fight the Kendo master but the person kept insisting. When the other practitioner attacked him with his kendo sword, Ueshiba Morihei was able to redirect the attacks away from himself. Eventually the opponent simply gave up out of futility and wasn’t even harmed in the process.
As such he promoted the philosophy that it is one’s responsibility is to show peaceful restraint, rather than to create harm even when engaging an opponent.
Again, I am always impressed by people who can show restraint even when they know they are the more powerful.
The founder/inventor Master Ueshiba Morihei of the martial arts form, Aikido was a pacifist. He grew up in a very violent time during war. His father was even beaten by a bunch of thugs hired by a political opponent. He definitely didn’t want to be weak in life.
However, one his greatest revelations came when he was challenged to combat by a Kendo master. He didn’t wish to fight the Kendo master but the person kept insisting. When the other practitioner attacked him with his kendo sword, Ueshiba Morihei was able to redirect the attacks away from himself. Eventually the opponent simply gave up out of futility and wasn’t even harmed in the process.
As such he promoted the philosophy that it is one’s responsibility is to show peaceful restraint, rather than to create harm even when engaging an opponent.
Again, I am always impressed by people who can show restraint even when they know they are the more powerful.
Re: RE: Pacifists versus peac
The fight with the Kendo Master is a really great story for me. Ueshiba Morihei was definitely no weakling and understood combat and war. He was even in the Japanese army as an infantryman.
Note when reading below:
Osensei means "Great Teacher"
The fight with the Kendo Master is a really great story for me. Ueshiba Morihei was definitely no weakling and understood combat and war. He was even in the Japanese army as an infantryman.
Note when reading below:
Osensei means "Great Teacher"
Re: RE: Pacifists versus peac
Statements like this are Morihei Ueshiba way of describing his own experience with his revelation. He would liken such revelations in terms of a spiritual experience.
Pacifism isn’t a weakness as some would have you believe. To show a sense of control in the face of adversity is a great strength. How a person deals with conflict can then be a measure of his or her character.
Statements like this are Morihei Ueshiba way of describing his own experience with his revelation. He would liken such revelations in terms of a spiritual experience.
Pacifism isn’t a weakness as some would have you believe. To show a sense of control in the face of adversity is a great strength. How a person deals with conflict can then be a measure of his or her character.
RE: Pacifists versus peac
Thanks Feronia. If you know of any other accounts as interesting as those of Master Morihei Ueshiba, I’d always be open to hear of them.
Thanks Feronia. If you know of any other accounts as interesting as those of Master Morihei Ueshiba, I’d always be open to hear of them.
I admire the combination of peace and strength. Thanks for the posts. I'm still trying to "fit" it into todays M/E events as a solution. (I'm likely thinking way too much :scratch: ). Maybe it does all start with the individual. I personally have a good deal of patience but not near enough to be a Shaolin monk.
RE: Pacifists versus peac
There is a food shortage on planet earth?
We could all be the biggest burn outs, and there will be enough food for us all!
The problem is not of shortage, but of distribution:
-in countries with nuts for leaders (N. Korea as one of the few examples), you have famine
-everywhere else, you have poverty and thus malnourishment
If someone were to evenly distribute all food produced, every human being on earth would eat well. Not just well, but super ultra well.
Hell, all other problems that could result aside, we could probably feed upwards of 80 BILLION people for an extended period of time. Then again, we'd have to switch to a predominantly vegetarian diet and eliminate cattle.
There is a food shortage on planet earth?
We could all be the biggest burn outs, and there will be enough food for us all!
The problem is not of shortage, but of distribution:
-in countries with nuts for leaders (N. Korea as one of the few examples), you have famine
-everywhere else, you have poverty and thus malnourishment
If someone were to evenly distribute all food produced, every human being on earth would eat well. Not just well, but super ultra well.
Hell, all other problems that could result aside, we could probably feed upwards of 80 BILLION people for an extended period of time. Then again, we'd have to switch to a predominantly vegetarian diet and eliminate cattle.
My personal Hero is the Dalai Lama.
http://www.dalailama.com/page.62.htm#Solving_Human_problem
There's a great deal of material to read there if you're interested.
This man did. Seven Years in Tibet with Brad Pitt http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120102/ talks about the early years of the Dalai Lama. The Dalai Lama is a man to admire and a man that lives his words.
http://www.dalailama.com/page.62.htm#Solving_Human_problem
There's a great deal of material to read there if you're interested.
This man did. Seven Years in Tibet with Brad Pitt http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120102/ talks about the early years of the Dalai Lama. The Dalai Lama is a man to admire and a man that lives his words.
RE: Pacifists versus peac
By the way, since it's a few pages back...
My post above was a response to an earlier post regarding burn-outs as a factor in world food production.
By the way, since it's a few pages back...
My post above was a response to an earlier post regarding burn-outs as a factor in world food production.
RE: Pacifists versus peac
Ain't no bigger pacifist in human history that Jesus Christ. It's a good bet that if He walked the earth today, the right wing warmongers would kill Him again.
Ain't no bigger pacifist in human history that Jesus Christ. It's a good bet that if He walked the earth today, the right wing warmongers would kill Him again.