Knowing Yourself

[china]

Without knowing oneself, there is no possibility of really searching out what is true, what is significant, what are the right values in life. Without self-knowledge, we cannot go beyond the self-projected illusions of the mind. Self-knowledge, , implies not only the action of relationship between one individual and another, but also the action of relationship with society and there can be no complete, harmonious society, without this knowledge. So, it is really very important and significant that one should know oneself as completely and fully as possible. And, is this knowledge possible? Can one know integrally not partially, the total process of oneself? Because, without knowing oneself, one has no basis for thinking. One gets caught in illusions: political, religious, social illusions - they are limitless, endless. Is it possible to know oneself? And, how is it possible to know oneself - what are the means, what are the ways, what are the processes? J k

 

[hermanntrude]

I very strongly agree that it is important to know oneself.

Once again, though i think you are guilty of asking a question that cannot be answered properly.

One cannot know everything about oneself because one would have to know an almost infinite amount of things, not least of which the nature of matter itself, and obviously psychology is not the most quantitative of sciences.

Having said that I'd say it's possible to know oneself much better than most people do, and on an absolute scale rather than relative, pretty well.

 

[hermanntrude]

having read the other thread, which obviously initiated the thought process which lead to this thread, i'd like to add the following:

Knowing yourself is important for self confidence which allows individuals to achieve things. It's also important because of subjectivity and prejudice: When one is making a judgement, forming an opinion, debating a subject, one is subject to various cultural prejudices and one's judgement can be skewed by any number of personal experiences. If one doesn't know what these prejudices and experiences and the resulting skews are, one cannot even attempt to make objective decisions

 

[MattUK]

Depends what you mean by "knowing yourself" really. I believe that you mind is a million times more powerful than we humans give it credit for.

I am a big believer in the Placebo Effect. I dont take medicine until I am nearly dead. I think that my mind is the best healer.

 

[china]

Hermanntrude says : I very strongly agree that it is important to know oneself.
Once again, though i think you are guilty of asking a question that cannot be answered properly
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I think to find out what are the waysof geting to know oneself, one must find out first, , what are the impediments; and by studying what we consider important in life, those things which we have accepted - the values, the standards, the beliefs, the innumerable things that we hold - by examining them, perhaps we shall find out the ways of our own thinking, and thereby know ourselves. That is, by understanding the things that we accept, by questioning them, going into them - by that very process we shall know the ways of our own thinking, our responses, our reactions; and through them, we shall know ourselves as we are. Surely, that is the only way we can find out the manner of our thinking, our responses: by studying, by going fully into the values, the standards, the beliefs, that we have accepted for generations. And, seeing behind these values, we shall know how we respond, what our reactions are to them; and thereby, perhaps, we shall be able to uncover the ways of our own thinking. To know oneself ,is to studythe responses , the reactions that one has in relation to something.One can't know oneself through isolation..That is an obvious fact. You may withdraw to a mountain, into a cave, or pursue some illusion on the banks of a river; but, if one isolates oneself, there can be no relationship, and isolation is death. It is only in relationship that one can know oneself as one is. So, by studying the things that we have accepted, by going into them fully, not superficially, perhaps we shall be able to understand ourselves. JK

 

[humanbeing]

Well, you go ahead on that search and let me know if you turn up anything interesting!

What kind of stuff have you dug up so far, china?

 

[Dexter Sinister]

I once thought I had some understanding of who you are, China, and what you think about, but this thread and the one about the purpose of life, and a third recent one I can't specifically remember the subject of but in which I quite clearly expressed a complete lack of comprehension of what you were going on about, have left me vastly confused about you. In the "purpose of life" thread your latest response to me seemed to be suggesting, first, that I'm not entitled to challenge your views of reality because I don't share them, and second, and closely related to that, that your views must be accepted respectfully simply because they're spiritually based. I may be misunderstanding you, but if that's what you're claiming I think you're wrong on both counts. First, if you don't want your views challenged, don't put them out in a forum like this. Second, spirituality, or religion if you prefer that term, though they're not quite the same thing, isn't automatically deserving of respect. Any claim has to take its lumps in the marketplace of ideas, and a claim for which there's no good evidence, such as yours about everything having a purpose, deserves to be at least put aside pending receipt of evidence in support of it, and at worst abandoned entirely.

I don't understand you China, but at least you have the great virtue of being an interesting and challenging personality. I think a conversation with you over a pot of good coffee, or some really fine products from the brewing and distilling trades if you prefer that (I do), would be very interesting and entertaining. You remind me of one of my sisters, in fact. She's very bright, IQ in the intellectual stratosphere, a Bahai, has a head full of mystical opinions and beliefs that go right by this old engineer, but there's never a dull moment when she's around. She's full of music and laughter and joie de vivre, I greatly enjoy her company and I love her dearly. But I don't understand her either.

 

[maepaulino]

Knowing yourself is important for self confidence which allows individuals to achieve things. It's also important because of subjectivity and prejudice: When one is making a judgement, forming an opinion, debating a subject, one is subject to various cultural prejudices and one's judgement can be skewed by any number of personal experiences. If one doesn't know what these prejudices and experiences and the resulting skews are, one cannot even attempt to make objective decisions

One of the best messages I have read... I am aware of myself but I do not know myself which is very unfortunate... If there's a book on how to know yourself it must've been sold out already or I am not aware of it...

 

[china]

Dexter Sinister :
I once thought I had some understanding of who you are, China, and what you think about, but this thread and the one about the purpose of life, and a third recent one I can't specifically remember the subject of but in which I quite clearly expressed a complete lack of comprehension of what you were going on about, have left me vastly confused about you. In the "purpose of life" thread your latest response to me seemed to be suggesting, first, that I'm not entitled to challenge your views of reality because I don't share them, and second, and closely related to that, that your views must be accepted respectfully simply because they're spiritually based. I may be misunderstanding you, but if that's what ........
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Dear Dexter Sinister,The topic of the thread was/is not 'what is the purpose of life but " Does life have a purpose " , so perhaps that's where the problem starts .No big deal , we are all guilty of making mistakes ,atleast the persons that I know personaly .
Dexter:I'm not entitled to challenge your views of reality because I don't share them, and second, and closely related to that, that your views must be accepted respectfully simply because they're spiritually based.-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear DS,Reading your posts I have noticed that you dont share with anyones views or opinions, and that's just fine Dexter ,belive me I know your kind very well . In my last response to you I have asked you not to question my reality (which is views ,opinions etc..) as I don't question yours.Ones reality is ones life,what business is it of yours to question anyones life ,especially someone you don,t know.Once again , get off your high horse Dexter ,you aren't an authority.
Dexter Sinister :
First, if you don't want your views challenged, don't put them out in a forum like this.
Like what ,Dexter?...All I can say Dexter is that in my posts my views are my views , and they might be the truth or they can be just alot of bull.I will not give you a "ready answer", there aren't any ,and if there where,they would also be , just a bull.
You have to find you own truth Dexter, and when you find it, live it ,and then the truth will become your living truth ,nobody elses.(and when I come back to Canada ,we can share a bottle of good Scotch , have a hell of an argument and you can tell me about your "spiritual journey "

 

[Curiosity]

China

Here comes "brain cramp" again lol.

You posit the most interesting questions for us to chew over and I enjoy the exercise even though it uses up most of my focus before my real day in the world starts.

I compliment you sincerely and thank you for the time you spend energizing us into thinking about things most of us ignore or avoid.

I also love to see the answers you pull from Hermanntrude who has such a fine mind for these conundrums and paradoxes.

Your question here regarding "knowing oneself" is an ongoing exercise in living as we are in flux throughout our lives, learning, avoiding, growing, perfecting defenses and offenses, all in the name of
getting the most from ourselves which gives us pleasure or comfort while avoiding that which creates fear.

Not a lofty goal of course, but an honest one.

For me the question of knowing oneself is not the answer, but what one does with that knowledge if one is courageous enough to accurately and honestly look inward.

 

[Curiosity]

DexterSinister

Do not downplay your own intellectual gifts - or feel defensive - no doubt you are on par with your sister even though you prefer to be humble.

 

[jimmoyer]

On the subject of KNOW THYSELF, I find that the older you get you begin to notice some
repeating patterns, some repeating themes. Each person has this.

 

[MikeyDB]

I have to wonder how old our friend China might be.....

Not that yough per se is a deficit but it takes a life time of observation and introspection to form even the most rudimentary conceptual structures that appear to be topics of interest to China.

Or it could simply be that he/she has observed the over-all calliber of dialogue and intercourse here at Canadian Content and has captured the essence of cerebral complexity available through the regular contributors...(that includes me too of course)

One can hope I suppose that once China know herself/himself and acknowledges some purpose he/she finds satisfactoy at least if not "fulfilling", he/she can dispense with the grade-school personna and fully integrate with adulthood....

 

[china]

Curiosity :For me the question of knowing oneself is not the answer, but what one does with that knowledge if one is courageous enough to accurately and honestly look inward.---------------------------------

What answer ? What knowledge?......just "curious" .

 

[fuzzylogix]

To know yourself, you must also be prepared to accept yourself.
If you cannot accept yourself, faults and zits and blips and all, then you will never know yourself because your mind will alter perception to protect yourself.

 

[hermanntrude]

agreed. I think anyone who treats their face with a bazillion products to prevent them getting wrinkles and "facial flaws" and all the other dumb names the cosmetics companies give to barely-visible marks on people's faces are in for a bloody shock one day when they realise they're OLD and UGLY and getting worse.

It's better to be someone with faults who knows them well than someone who has the fault of believing themselves to be faultless.

 

[china]

fuzzylogic:To know yourself, you must also be prepared to accept yourself.
If you cannot accept yourself, faults and zits and blips and all, then you will never know yourself because your mind will alter perception to protect yourself-----------------------------------------------------------------

If you truly know yourself then.."You Are who you are,with or without any faults zits ,blips and all".
Whatever you have or don't have is you and that's who you are ,not who you want to be or Become,not who you were yesterday,not who you want to be tomorrow.Everything changes , from moment to moment ,if you know yourself ,then You are who you are from moment to moment.You are who you are ,you are What Is ,what is ,is Truth ,and the Truth has no need to defend It,s Self.

 

[Curiosity]

Curiosity :For me the question of knowing oneself is not the answer, but what one does with that knowledge if one is courageous enough to accurately and honestly look inward.---------------------------------

What answer ? What knowledge?......just "curious" .

China.... "Self-knowledge" to me is....

Recognizing the gifts and faults one has. Being prepared to expand the gifts so they are resilient and adaptable to change, and admission of faults while seeking ways to diminish them if one is unable to
overcome them totally.

I am speaking only of character and within given attributes of intellect and physical capabilities and limitations. Unrealistic expection or faulty competition with others is a human frailty and to fully
know oneself, one can only compare from within.

The ultimate goal to be would be satisfaction, acceptance, and always the desire to seek ways of connecting and helping others without expection of gain. My life "preferred" must not be a selfish solo flight.

Finally recognizing these necessaries may have to conform to unknown factors over time... as I see
life being lived on a moving path whose direction we may not be able to control completely, but nurturing always the warmth of confidence, integrity, optimism and self care.

Knowledge of self within one's environment or milieu is truly useful when it is extended beyond the self.

 

[china]

Hi Curiosity , Thanks for the fast answer to my questions.I can see that you obviously know where you are at , I think that what you say is what it's all about ,China

 

[MikeyDB]

fuzzylogic:To know yourself, you must also be prepared to accept yourself.
If you cannot accept yourself, faults and zits and blips and all, then you will never know yourself because your mind will alter perception to protect yourself-----------------------------------------------------------------

If you truly know yourself then.."You Are who you are,with or without any faults zits ,blips and all".
Whatever you have or don't have is you and that's who you are ,not who you want to be or Become,not who you were yesterday,not who you want to be tomorrow.Everything changes , from moment to moment ,if you know yourself ,then You are who you are from moment to moment.You are who you are ,you are What Is ,what is ,is Truth ,and the Truth has no need to defend It,s Self.

"When I was a child I spoke as a child I understood as a child I thought as a child; but when I became a man I put away childish things." I Cor. xiii. 11.

Where is that magic point in time when the dynamic of existence stands still and in that moment you "know" who you are? "You" or "I" aren't static absolute fixed and immobile in our development both physically and psychologically, never have been and never will be.

Knowing one's self is in fact process itself.

What one is wise to embrace as awareness is that dynamism and flux that our existence requires each of us to respond to and interract with....

LIke knowledge, life is process.