Jerry Falwell dead

Pangloss

Council Member
Mar 16, 2007
1,535
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Calgary, Alberta
Let me see if I have this straight, you're comparing peoples objection to what they consider an immoral lifestyle to dictators who murdered millions of innocent civilians? This is a typical response by the homosexual community to anyone who objects to their lifestyle? They throw out words like "hate" and "intolerant" etc. etc. and they expect us to bow to and celebrate their particular lifestyle. I'm not Politically Correct and I do not need to be told how I should believe and what morals I should be living up to.

No, and if you read my post with any honesty you would not accuse me of that. Try again.

You are also burying your head in the sand of intolerance to think Fallwells hate speech towards the GLBT community, as well as to drug addicts, illegal immigrants and so many others has not encouraged real-world violence, discrimination and segregation. He said atheists have no morals and should not only be barred from public office, but not teach children either.

I love this line of yours, you should frame it: "I'm not Politically Correct and I do not need to be told how I should believe and what morals I should be living up to."

Priceless bit of religious right hypocrisy!

What the heck do you think Fallwell was doing? He said that our tolerance of the GLBT lifestyle made 9/11happen! What is that but hate speech?

Fallwell preached fear of god and hatred of the different or disputatious.

Pangloss.
 

Jsan

Nominee Member
Apr 6, 2007
78
1
8
"What the heck do you think Fallwell was doing? He said that our tolerance of the GLBT lifestyle made 9/11happen! What is that but hate speech?"


There is no use getting into a debate about morals because as a humanist, your morals are based on your own convictions, what you would consider moral or immoral would be quite different than what another humanist would consider moral or immoral.
As far as Falwell blaming 9/11 on the gay lifestyle, abortions, etc. his point was that as a country, when you not only accept immorality but begin to celebrate it, God removes his hand of blessing and protection off a society that formally put him first and lived by his principals. The bible is filled with many examples of this.
 

Pangloss

Council Member
Mar 16, 2007
1,535
41
48
Calgary, Alberta
"What the heck do you think Fallwell was doing? He said that our tolerance of the GLBT lifestyle made 9/11happen! What is that but hate speech?"


There is no use getting into a debate about morals because as a humanist, your morals are based on your own convictions, what you would consider moral or immoral would be quite different than what another humanist would consider moral or immoral.
As far as Falwell blaming 9/11 on the gay lifestyle, abortions, etc. his point was that as a country, when you not only accept immorality but begin to celebrate it, God removes his hand of blessing and protection off a society that formally put him first and lived by his principals. The bible is filled with many examples of this.

Your blinding ignorance of humanism and ethics speaks volumes about you, and your understanding of anyone who does not self-identify as of your community, whatever that is.

The ironic thing is, humanists are the only ones willing to truly debate morality and ethics - heck, we were the ones who gave the topics a name!

You get yours from a book that claims homosexuality and shellfish an equal abomination! Awesome! Stone anyone who sews a garment with two kinds of thread lately? What about sideburn-trimmers?

Hey, you can always burn an ox.

Eager for a debate anytime - wanna start with the 10 commandments?

Iceland is almost totally non-religious, certainly Sweden loves the GLBT community - why isn't god punishing them?

What about Brunei? They're rich, peaceful, educated, happy, healthy, beautiful - and muslim.

Apologist for a wrong-headed bigot, that's what you are.

Pangloss
 

CHUCKMAN

New Member
Jan 20, 2006
41
3
8
The Devil has Died / Falwell's Legacy

FALWELL'S LEGACY
John Chuckman
That great bulk, Jerry Falwell, has eaten his last family-size bucket of Kentucky Fried Chicken.
Yes, Jerry has ordered his last tent-sized silk suit, taken his last bag of cash from lonely old ladies, and ordered his last truckload of cheap, merchandising Bibles with his picture stamped on the cover. Gone on to his reward, as they say.
He donated his organs, the only gesture of kindness recorded in his adult life, but they were all rejected, except for the spleen, reportedly large enough to serve three.
The following piece, written some years ago still aptly summarizes his legacy.
October 18, 2002
JABBA APOLOGIZES
John Chuckman
The Reverend Jerry Falwell has apologized again. It is his third-favorite occupation.
His first, as we all know, is using national television to promote the kind of intolerance and ignorance long associated with sweltery, fly-blown corners of America's South. It's a profitable business by the looks of Falwell's cascading jowls and tailored, tent-size suits. He generally doesn't apologize for these activities, whether it is his retailing of video-tapes sensationalizing the pitiful suicide of a member of President Clinton's staff, or his spending countless hours blubbering from the pulpit against the lives of people who happen to be gay.
He once alerted the nation to dangerous hidden tendencies he discovered in a British television show for children, a harmless piece of fluff called Teletubbies. Falwell gravely warned America that one of the tubbies was promoting homosexuality.
Being a hate-entrepreneur or appealing to the worst instincts of nitwits is not an unusual occupation in America. There are many people who make handsome livings much the way Falwell does, and they are not isolated in the dark corners of American society. Some of them have considerable influence. Success in accumulating money and making a name for yourself, however achieved, counts far more than decency or intelligence in America. Just ask the man who now occupies the White House.
Falwell's second-favorite occupation is making idiotic statements blaming others for disasters. In this he displays a common American trait, blaming others for what goes wrong. But Falwell takes the practice to a lunatic level, the best example being his statement, just days after 9/11, that America's liberal and gay citizens were responsible for God's allowing such destruction.
His third occupation is apologizing. Going way back to 1985, Falwell apologized to Jewish Americans for regularly using the expression "Christian America." He said he wouldn't use it in future, but nasty old habits are tough to break, and, in fact, he did use it again.
In 1999, he again apologized to Jews for what probably qualifies as his most bizarre and inexplicable utterance, "Antichrist was probably alive and that he was in the form of a male Jew." His apology expressed regret for having said these disturbing words but did not disavow belief in them.
Odd that on a recent tour in the United States, Mr. Netanyahu - Israel's answer to Richard Nixon with a generous dash of John Gotti tossed in - was photographed consulting with Mr. Falwell. There appears to be no shame to the alliances of intolerant politicos. But, as I said, money and celebrity count for immense influence in America, and it doesn't much matter what you did to get them.
About a week after 9/11, Falwell apologized for his having said, days before, that the nation's liberal and gay citizens were somehow responsible for very angry men from the other side of the planet high-jacking airliners and blowing up buildings in America. He made his original claim on the television program of another fundamentalist know-nothing, Pat Robertson, who readily responded with "I totally concur." Perhaps Robertson used "concur" rather than "agree" to emphasize the high tone of this scholarly exchange.
Now, Falwell has apologized for remarks on still another television show. Perhaps anxious to demonstrate his leadership capacity for making tasteless, ignorant statements at a time of international crisis, Falwell originally said he had read enough to believe that the prophet Muhammad was "a terrorist," "a violent man," and "a man of war."
One just has to wonder what it is that Falwell read. Perhaps it was one of the "comic strips" put out by some of his fellow American fundamentalists portraying Muslims as dark, evil characters opposing the nation's Christian values and Manifest Destiny. Precisely such material does circulate today in America. It is difficult to imagine Falwell ever having read a serious book, or at least having done so with any reasonable understanding. After all, this is a man on guard against Tinky Winky the teletubby.
I don't know whether anyone else has noticed recently, but Falwell is looking more and more like Jabba the Hutt, that gross outlaw slug from the Star Wars movies, although his voice and manner remind one rather of the late, professional cowboy-hick, Pat Butrum.
The growing resemblance strikes me as somehow oddly fitting, a kind of In the Heat of the Night-version of the Picture of Dorian Gray. Only here, the nasty figure himself grows more repulsive and bloated every week. But I feel sure that when the smarmy Falwell looks in a mirror, he knows just who to blame
 

gc

Electoral Member
May 9, 2006
931
20
18
As far as Falwell blaming 9/11 on the gay lifestyle, abortions, etc. his point was that as a country, when you not only accept immorality but begin to celebrate it, God removes his hand of blessing and protection off a society that formally put him first and lived by his principals. The bible is filled with many examples of this.

I wonder if Jerry would get mad if I said he had it coming to him for supporting the war in Iraq...
 

look3467

Council Member
Dec 13, 2006
1,952
15
38
Northern California
What stupid sophistry! What idiot ravings! Look, according to your logic: Hitler hated the Jews and the Jews hated Hitler - equal disdain, rock-for-brain, so, who's right?

My goodness, Look, but you tripped on this one.

Pangloss

Missed my point entirely there Pangloss. My point was that both sides have equal opportunity to hate each other.
The one that doesn't hate is usually the one that suffers at the hands of the hater.
The question is, who is the better man?

Peace>>>:love9:
 

Pangloss

Council Member
Mar 16, 2007
1,535
41
48
Calgary, Alberta
Missed my point entirely there Pangloss. My point was that both sides have equal opportunity to hate each other.
The one that doesn't hate is usually the one that suffers at the hands of the hater.
The question is, who is the better man?

Peace>>>:love9:

No, I understood entirely what you wrote: the logic train was neither complicated nor murky. Perhaps you did not write what you meant.

And to answer this (entirely different) question: by your own reasoning, everybody that was hated by Fallwell was better than Fallwell.

While I myself would not entirely endorse that (he hated so many, after all, he must have hated at least some of the right ones), it is a better place to start than by endorsing this power and publicity seeking mammon-lover, this humanity hater, this. . .thug.

Pangloss
 

snfu73

disturber of the peace
Did Mr. Falwell REALLY mean well?? I dunno...I don't feel that he necessarily did. It's so hard...it's a good point...but...

I think the difference between the people that were against Falwell and Falwell himself is that those against were critisizing him for his hatred, his brimstone and fire rhetoric, his homophobia, bigotry and arrogance...these are decent reasons to oppose someone. Falwell, on the other hand, lashed out with little logic or actual proof. He just saw his view as morally superior.
 

look3467

Council Member
Dec 13, 2006
1,952
15
38
Northern California
Did Mr. Falwell REALLY mean well?? I dunno...I don't feel that he necessarily did. It's so hard...it's a good point...but...

I think the difference between the people that were against Falwell and Falwell himself is that those against were critisizing him for his hatred, his brimstone and fire rhetoric, his homophobia, bigotry and arrogance...these are decent reasons to oppose someone. Falwell, on the other hand, lashed out with little logic or actual proof. He just saw his view as morally superior.

Ok, let me see if I can paint a picture here of what it is about the direction that some folks take (Like Falwell) and others like him.

Lets take a mechanic whose been using a particular wrench to loose or tighten a bolt for a long time because that’s all he knew to use.
But one day, a salesman of tools comes and shows him a better and easier tool to use for the same work .
Assuming that he rejected all other suggestions for the only tool he knew to work for him, finally, at some point learns from the salesman of a better tool.

Similarly, religion is like the mechanic who knows only to use what tools works for him, and rejects all others.

So, his religion meets with opposition because he denies everybody else’s religion or belief as false and his; the right one.

Religion is like a child growing up towards maturity, but not before it goes through trials and tribulations along the way.

He had his personal faults like we all do, but, yet he was able to help allot of folk be better people.
Had he found the better tool earlier in life, he might have been more tolerant towards other folks.

I see those who oppose God the same way. They have in their mind a view that seems right to them, because they have no other view better to latch unto.

So in like manner,Falwell becomes the evil man.

But I say that a mature individual in the things of God sees all mankind through the eyes of Jesus as souls bought and paid for; therefore, all brothers and sisters.

I don’t condemn Falwell, Gays and or unbelievers.

Peace>>>AJ:love9: