How can we get rid of our sinfulness?

[sanctus]

I see where your going with this, and yes, I agree with you, if one does believe and participate in their
religion and the teachings of their church, one should definitely appeciate and believe and practice
those teachings. BUT I'm sure there are people in that position who are "doubters" and always ask
questions and challenge. Where do they belong, and how do they muddle along in that position. Do
they just keep going to some sort of "classes" and learn, so that they can conform or? Do they just
become a "pain" in the "whatever" of the church, or are told to "get lost" and go somewhere else.

There are always periods of doubt in everyone's faith life. Times when the dark nights of the soul are the only reality and the only means of existing. There are also those who are never content, always seeking and questioning. And there is a time and place even for those! Sometimes though, I cannot help but wonder if it is through our own inability to truly surrender to God that we become discontent?
That is, we fail to realize the level of our faith depends on our ability to surrender self. I have problems with this myself at times.

Where do these types fit in, you ask? They fit in as voices crying for attention and perhaps indicating to us what we should all be considering. A faith that does not challenge is not a vibrant faith.

 

[sanctus]

Glad you asked.

Every individual regardless of belief structure has in innate ability to relate to something greater than them selves. (An unseen entity)

Peace>>>AJ

God calls us long before we realize His presence. His truth is always the same, and his level of compassion is infinite.

 

[sanctus]

I for one don't think that "case" has been made. An alternate perspective might be that one of the longest celebrated religious paradigms in existence (RC) keeps reappearing in the threads of forums and discussion boards because (aside from the need to proselytize) it has become aware that it's own history of hypocrisy lies and prejudice are its own worst enemy. Where are the Moslems and the Buddhists or the Taoists here at Canadian Content?

The hypocrisy within the Church exists even now, no denying it. But it is not the Church, per se, but rather certain members of the Church. We have existed for 2,000 years. That alone provides many periods of events that sometimes are not reflective of what is best in the faith. there are periods in Church history that i am not particulalry proud of. That being said, I still think of the millions upon millions of good works done by members of this body, both in the past and now. So many dedicated and humble people working patiently to help the cries of humanity in so many different ministries around the world.

I don't believe in this god that's the focus of the good Sanctus's rhetoric nor do I accept that the "idea" of compassion tolerance and foregiveness presented by the believer can be granted more than a miniscule ort of authority...based on the history of mankind and the dynamics of destruction perpetuated under the guise of "belief" in an omnipotent creator being....

It is this history we fight against as a faith group, this trend towards evil that we see and attempt to change. Many of our membership live lives of tolerance and compassion, and seek to bring this awareness to the world around us. Christ, who we believe propels our every action and thought, instructs us to be people of peace even in a world of hatred and evil.

As a Taoist I believe it's everyone's unique right and responsibility to come to terms with their humanity and the interrelatedness of all living creatures by whatever metric they choose...by embracing or adopting whatever spiritual ideation convinces them as individuals as a life-promulgating "positive" influence in their lives...

Never mind the physical history of the Church, instead, would you not agree that the teachings of Christ are not far removed from what you just wrote? Indeed, one of the missed elements of the teachings of our faith is the ideology that we are part of this world and of our God, and thus it is all our responsibility.

I don't attempt to convince anyone that they should kneel down before the writing of Lao Tzu or repeat the 'scriptures' of the Tao Te Ching, I invite people who are interested to examine those things but I also don't threaten the non-Taoist the non-Christian (or Non-Catholic) of everlasting torment in the hell of my minds creation as extrapolated from the words of ancient Chinese thinkers...

That may be, but remember that as Christians we believe that Joshua bar-Jonah(Jesus) is God, one part of the Trinity, and we are under instruction by Him to spread the Gospel through out the world. Just as the Taoist follows certain teachings that illuminate that faith for its members, so too do Christians. The reality is, and I admit it 100%, is that the Christian faith is not an inclusive one, it never has been.

 

[sanctus]

No you love that person and the attributes that person has that attracted you to that person, there is no Jesus in that equation.

That and most of the arguement here, is conjecture based on indoctrination and nothing more.

But that is where we rely on our faith Bear. Everybody suffers, if that is the correct way to look at it, from their indoctrination into whatever faith group they aspire to. For us, this belief in Jesus causes us to see His presence in most things around us.

Really?

No they only have the answers as dictated and indoctrinated within the educational system of the Clergy and the Church.

The absolute dismissal of all else is blind self opression.

Perhaps, but in matters of the Christian faith, which I think was the gentleman's point, we certainly can rely on the educated members of the Church to provide the correct answers for its membership.

 

[look3467]

God calls us long before we realize His presence. His truth is always the same, and his level of compassion is infinite.

That is a correct and an absolute statment. Regardless of what mankind will say!

By being absolute, leaves room for nothing else, in His Kingdom.

That is something we all can appreciate, that God changes not.

Peace>>>AJ

 

[L Gilbert]

Wow! rofl 33 pages of how to avoid sinning. Hilarious
Look - either exercise some self-discipline or come right out and sin.

 

[L Gilbert]

God calls us long before we realize His presence. His truth is always the same, and his level of compassion is infinite.

..... along with his level of jealousy, rage, bloodthirst, etc. according to your book.

 

[look3467]

Wow! rofl 33 pages of how to avoid sinning. Hilarious
Look - either exercise some self-discipline or come right out and sin.

That is the big question Gilbert that mankind struggles to answer. But without God's enlightenment, there are no correct answers.

God is the catylst by which the soul is renewed. This world offers nothing but decay and destruction.

Sin, yes I sin daily: for I die daily and renewed another day in the graces of the Lord Jesus as His blood washes me clean.

Isa 1:18 Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.

I bank on it!

Peace>>>AJ

 

[L Gilbert]

That is the big question Gilbert that mankind struggles to answer. But without God's enlightenment, there are no correct answers.

Except for those of us without gods and other superstitions.

God is the catylst by which the soul is renewed. This world offers nothing but decay and destruction.

I think the world could be better, but for the most part, I like the place and I don't need myths for that.

Sin, yes I sin daily: for I die daily and renewed another day in the graces of the Lord Jesus as His blood washes me clean.

Just out of curiosity, which sins do you commit this frequently?

I bank on it!

I dislike banks.

Peace>>>AJ

Same at you.

 

[look3467]

Except for those of us without gods and other superstitions.

I think the world could be better, but for the most part, I like the place and I don't need myths for that.

Just out of curiosity, which sins do you commit this frequently?



I dislike banks.

Same at you.

Gilbert, now your being funny.

Yes, the world could always be better, but that won't happen unless a Godly attitudes are exercised.

For those who don't believe in God, the only source for inner-peace, inner-contentment, inner-comfort are at the pearl of good old earth and mankind's kindness.

My body sins because it needs the resources(Lusts) of this world to survive but my soul is perfect in the Eyes of Jesus.

The first step is that sin must be exposed against God's standards, and only the Catalyst (Spirit of God) can expose them.

Rev 1:18 I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Hence: Adam and Eve found themselves naked? Sin exposed them.

Once we admit that we are sinners, we then understand that we need God's help to regain what we lost.
Enter Jesus: the Savior of mankind.



Peace>>>AJ

 

[L Gilbert]

Gilbert, now your being funny.

I'm rarely totally serious.

Yes, the world could always be better, but that won't happen unless a Godly attitudes are exercised.

For those who don't believe in God, the only source for inner-peace, inner-contentment, inner-comfort are at the pearl of good old earth and mankind's kindness.

Actually, just the plain old universe is enough for me. If you wanna call the universe "god" it's fine with me.

My body sins because it needs the resources(Lusts) of this world to survive but my soul is perfect in the Eyes of Jesus.

Human body needs water, food, warmth in order to survive period. If you only get what you need, you aren't sinning.

The first step is that sin must be exposed against God's standards, and only the Catalyst (Spirit of God) can expose them.



Hence: Adam and Eve found themselves naked? Sin exposed them.

Once we admit that we are sinners, we then understand that we need God's help to regain what we lost.
Enter Jesus: the Savior of mankind.



Peace>>>AJ

I admit I sin: sloth is my sin. I'm the only one that can make me feel like getting off my backside and doing something. I'm pretty successful at it, too. I don't sloth very much or very often. I realize that as I am in control of me that if I sloth, then I am the one who reaps its rewards (big belly and wimpy muscles). No need to share.

 

[look3467]

I admit I sin: sloth is my sin. I'm the only one that can make me feel like getting off my backside and doing something. I'm pretty successful at it, too. I don't sloth very much or very often. I realize that as I am in control of me that if I sloth, then I am the one who reaps its rewards (big belly and wimpy muscles). No need to share.>>Dennis

That’s one we all share, especially, at an older age. But regardless, there hope for everyone.

Peace>>>AJ

 

[L Gilbert]

And besides, why would I want to burden someone else with the knowledge of my being lazy? That's just rude and downright inconsiderate.

 

[look3467]

And besides, why would I want to burden someone else with the knowledge of my being lazy? That's just rude and downright inconsiderate.

Agreed!

Peace>>>AJ

 

[L Gilbert]

???
But that includes Yahweh and Yeshua. If they existed, why would I wanna burden them, especially when I can deal with the problem myself?

 

[look3467]

???
But that includes Yahweh and Yeshua. If they existed, why would I wanna burden them, especially when I can deal with the problem myself?

The creator is never burdened by His creation.
To be able to understand that and what all God is, we must read His book, not only read it but study it.
Mankind becomes a burden unto itself, for that is within its realm, its nature.
Mankind needs a second nature, and that nature is not of this world.
Can you tell me what that second nature consists of?

Peace>>>AJ

 

[L Gilbert]

Good, because I'm not burdened by any "creator".
Why would I need to study the book? I have Sanc on the net and Father Henry here to study it for me.
What second nature? It's my nature to be helpful, friendly, grumpy sometimes, lazy sometimes, etc. why would I need two natures when I have enough elements in this one?

 

[look3467]

Good, because I'm not burdened by any "creator".
Why would I need to study the book? I have Sanc on the net and Father Henry here to study it for me.
What second nature? It's my nature to be helpful, friendly, grumpy sometimes, lazy sometimes, etc. why would I need two natures when I have enough elements in this one?

There you go, wouldn’t you want to answer yea or nay by the same source they and I use?
Your source is of this world; our source is not of this world.

Unless you are able to see what the second nature consists of, how could you argue against it?
All arguments are carnally based. For if we are of the same spirit, there are no arguments.

I believe in the same God that Sanctus believes in, yet we are from different points of view.
He chooses the church to honor God, and I choose to honor Him without being a member to any organization.
But we both honor Him from the heart, which is the second nature in us.

Peace>>>AJ

 

[talloola]

'''''''Of course, one can become very knowledgeable in whatever he/she is interested in, a person could study
the scriptures till his hair turned green and his ears fell off, and he could come away not believing much
of anything, that is perfectly understandable, nothing can be proven, and the next person could to just
the opposite. The scriptures don't fit into learned fact.''''''''

i see what you mean, but its kinda different for catholic church i think because they have a theology that is so old and formed by so much study and history.

So, what would your point be, the catholic religion "apparantly" is the most informed religion in history,
and if anyone wanted to believe, and study their scriptures, they should be the most accurate.


i think that is what sanctus is getting at anyway, because i know that the priests train and study for a very long time even compared to protestant ministers or whatever

Well then, in that case, they should be the most educated and informed in their field, if one wanted to
learn, who would be better.
I don't know what my previous statements have to do with anything you have said.

 

[look3467]

''''''Of course, one can become very knowledgeable in whatever he/she is interested in, a person could study
the scriptures till his hair turned green and his ears fell off, and he could come away not believing much
of anything, that is perfectly understandable, nothing can be proven, and the next person could to just
the opposite. The scriptures don't fit into learned fact.''''''''>>>talloola

It’s amazing that you should say that and not be able to see it. Having eyes to see, but cannot see. Having ears to hear but cannot hear.

Unless we are enabled by the Holy Spirit, we are as blind men and women.

See here, Peter revealed something to Jesus of which Jesus responded:

Mat 16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

Now, Peter could see with His spiritual eyes what the Father has revealed (Enabled) to him.

Mar 4:11 And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:

Those without, are the ones outside the kingdom, for they can neither see or hear what God says in the parables.

Luk 10:21 In that hour Jesus rejoiced in spirit, and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes: even so, Father; for so it seemed good in thy sight.

There is no shame in not seeing or hearing, but there is shame in not trying.

It’s there for the asking:

Rev 22:17 And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

Peace>>>AJ