MHZ - You are good with having verses in the forefront of your brain. Me, not so much. Bad Memory. Romans CHapter 3: No one is Righteous. They have all gone astray. (All are sinners). Romans also in Chapter 3:21 But now apart from the law the righteousness of God has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. 22 This righteousness is given through faith in[h] Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference between Jew and Gentile, 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. 25 God presented Christ as a sacrifice of atonement, through the shedding of his blood—to be received by faith. He did this to demonstrate his righteousness, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished— 26 he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.
Faith Alone or and something...
- Thread starter cj44
- Start date
That was my first impression after reading the NT as a single document and it not being something that was a 'demand'. Once I did some re'raeding I could add to the knowledge given in these few verses. What Paul was mentioning was the first 'model' of what the return will be like as far as 'setting things right' with a people that were under a previous command and following it was proving to be impossible despite the best of efforts. The 'food' in this instance is the Bible, each verse being 1 mouthful or something along that line. Milk is the beginning of understanding and meat is accepting something as true and being able to add a few more references to any reference in the book. I have no idea is a better answer that some sort of fabrication. If it takes some digging to find the relevent verse then that is what you have to do if you want to fix that lack of knowledge.
Proverb:8:32:
Now therefore hearken unto me,
O ye children:
for blessed are they that keep my ways.
Proverb:8:33:
Hear instruction,
and be wise,
and refuse it not.
Proverb:8:34:
Blessed is the man that heareth me,
watching daily at my gates,
waiting at the posts of my doors.
Proverb:8:35:
For whoso findeth me findeth life,
and shall obtain favour of the LORD.
Proverb:8:36:
But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul:
all they that hate me love death.
1Co:11:28:
But let a man examine himself,
and so let him eat of that bread,
and drink of that cup.
1Co:11:29:
For he that eateth and drinketh unworthily,
eateth and drinketh damnation to himself,
not discerning the Lord's body.
1Co:11:30:
For this cause many are weak and sickly among you,
and many sleep.
1Co:11:31:
For if we would judge ourselves,
we should not be judged.
1Co:11:32:
But when we are judged,
we are chastened of the Lord,
that we should not be condemned with the world.
1Co:11:33:
Wherefore,
my brethren,
when ye come together to eat,
tarry one for another.
1Co:11:34:
And if any man hunger,
let him eat at home;
that ye come not together unto condemnation.
And the rest will I set in order when I come.
Just that last reference would be worth a long examination because it is only part of a longer passage. The extreme of that would be going over all the references in Jeremiah that reference Babylon and classify if the reference to Neb's Babylon or Satan's Babylon. That would be a huge task. The only difference I saw was not all the verses about Neb's Babylon were total destruction verses, not so with Satan's Babylon.
As far as I understand, (which may be very little indeed), World Relgions each have their own view of afterlife/salvation/eternity/God.
T-BONES: No. Sophistry is dead. Only Christ will avail me before the seat of judgement. Those that confess their sins are bourne by Christ are righteous, certainly not the work of sophistry. From this - knowledge of one's sin against God & Christ's work on the cross - flow good works.
T-BONES: No. Sophistry is dead. Only Christ will avail me before the seat of judgement. Those that confess their sins are bourne by Christ are righteous, certainly not the work of sophistry. From this - knowledge of one's sin against God & Christ's work on the cross - flow good works.
I'm pretty sure you can prepare yourself quite a bit as far as that goes and it won't matter one bit because everybody will experience this at the beginning, bar none, the only real question is when.
Heb:12:5:
And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children,
My son,
despise not thou the chastening of the Lord,
nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
Heb:12:6:
For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth,
and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
Heb:12:7:
If ye endure chastening,
God dealeth with you as with sons;
for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
Heb:12:8:
But if ye be without chastisement,
whereof all are partakers,
then are ye bastards, and not sons.
Heb:12:9:
Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us,
and we gave them reverence:
shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits,
and live?
Heb:12:10:
For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure;
but he for our profit,
that we might be partakers of his holiness.
Heb:12:11:
Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous,
but grievous:
nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.
Heb:12:12:
Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down,
and the feeble knees;
Heb:12:13:
And make straight paths for your feet,
lest that which is lame be turned out of the way;
but let it rather be healed.
Heb:12:14:
Follow peace with all men,
and holiness,
without which no man shall see the Lord:
And for 'the rest' there is a different path. No one in the Bible is in more danger of being sent to the lake than the unrepented on the day the 7th trumps sounds.', ..... yet somehow they are included as being the ones in the last reference and they are with God, eternally. The rest of that chapter is about the 'wife' Isaiah 65 is the chapter about the ones that were made 'desolate' on the day Christ took their lives because they were sinners.
Isa:54:1:
Sing,
O barren,
thou that didst not bear;
break forth into singing,
and cry aloud,
thou that didst not travail with child:
for more are the children of the desolate than the children of the married wife,
saith the LORD.
Isa:65:23:
They shall not labour in vain,
nor bring forth for trouble;
for they are the seed of the blessed of the LORD,
and their offspring with them.
Isa:65:24:
And it shall come to pass,
that before they call,
I will answer;
and while they are yet speaking,
I will hear.
Isn't there a commonality in world religions as far as a flood happening? The example I would use would be the task Jeremiah was given in Jer:25 where the news is that the world will come under a judgment that will be against them all, rather than one nation become more powerful than all the rest.
Take Ezekiel's wheel that is a 'wheel within a wheel' and place it horizontal in flight and it is the classic flying saucer shape, now Jeremiah doesn't have to walk or swim or anything but be amazed at the view. BTW it would be only him that knew the true size of the globe and it is 'odd' that the last reference to wo comes under judgment included just 1/4 of the surface of the earth, that happens to be an approximation of the inhabitable parts of the earth.
If we can set opinion aside for a moment (and humor me as I set forth an opinion), Freedom of Religion - each is free to believe as he or she wants. I would not expect say for example a Hindu to adhere to my faith. Being a Christian, by definition, means holding to Biblical teaching/doctrine. Just as being a Hindu, by definition, means holding to Hinduism's sacred texts. As far as "if Christians still believe only through Christ..." - yes, mainstream Christians believe Christ alone shall save - this view is held amongst most mainstream denominations. There are offshoots & cults that vary from this belief. I don't go out on a limb and jumble all religions into one. Are people not free to believe as they choose? Well, we know the unfortunate answer to that question.
TBONES:
Are you irritated with what you believe to be a mishandling of Scripture in this thread or are you disgusted by religion, or christians, or other?
TBONES:
Are you irritated with what you believe to be a mishandling of Scripture in this thread or are you disgusted by religion, or christians, or other?
Ain't irritated at all. Just pointing out that there's as much authority for "faith and works" as there is for "faith alone." And quoting Jesus, not Paul. I always thought Jesus was kinda the gold standard for Christians.
Don't care. Why you do what you do is a matter of supreme indifference to me. It's what you do that counts.
Got a personal beef with some Christians, but they're mostly dead. Like I said above, I judge folks by what they do, not by what fantasy, if any, they use to give their lives order and purpose.
People are free to believe as they believe, yes. I didn't know if that was still a necessity in order to avoid eternal damnation since I don't know many people that believe that way any more. Thanks cj44.
Sounds painful. Christ is only relevant to being a Gentile and being alive at the first opportunity. Before the NT is was just the 12 Tribes and some Gentiles as servants, the changes are always taken as good news by the original 12 Tribes. The time both groups become immortal see them having different roles for that 1,000 years, after that they enter New Jerusalem as a single group in that they do the same thing for the whole of eternity. Ther is a definite list for the 1,000 years and it is quite small compared to the rest of mankind. That just means the 'shepherds' don't ever outnumber the 'flock' rather than everybody being a shepherd and nobody left to be the flock. Failt is belief without proof I would go that far but I would balk at a person saying he has faith on Sundays and is an intentional sinner the other 6 days of the week.
He is,` that is why He gathered Saul rather than it being any Apostle or the Beloved Disciple. It then expects then reader to follow directions and read the rest as Paul is the Moses of the OT and the slaves are the Gentiles of the NT.
M'r:9:7:
And there was a cloud that overshadowed them:
and a voice came out of the cloud,
saying,
This is my beloved Son:
hear him.
The ones thar redine the original are disappointed, when push comes to shove one is war ahrad of the pack.
Isa:42:9:
Behold,
the former things are come to pass,
and new things do I declare:
before they spring forth I tell you of them.
Isa:55:11:
So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth:
it shall not return unto me void,
but it shall accomplish that which I please,
and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
Jer:4:28:
For this shall the earth mourn,
and the heavens above be black:
because I have spoken it,
I have purposed it,
and will not repent,
neither will I turn back from it.
Joe:2:2:
A day of darkness and of gloominess,
a day of clouds and of thick darkness,
as the morning spread upon the mountains:
a great people and a strong;
there hath not been ever the like,
neither shall be any more after it,
even to the years of many generations.
How many pages before you begin to have enough knowledge to qualify as having faith? I would put it as very few and knowledge is given even while in the grave?
1Pe:4:17:
For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God:
and if it first begin at us,
what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
lol, the jawjacker disease got me. You aren't free to believe what you want. If all the text about the end times was 10,000 words and your picture id finished after 100 words then it will not be the same as the larger picture, fact is it will take a lot of tome to cover the other 9,999 words but that is required if that is the number God put into the material.
Last edited:
well that's what i thought...if you are Christian, you have to believe in Christ as the son of God, which x-nays Jehovah Witnesses since they don't believe that... Mormons have their own twist on things, I don't think technically they are Christian and I don't know what else but it isn't simple to get into heaven apparently...according to most religions.
To show you how far I have taken (good or bad) it I would rearrange it so the first ajnd last 3 chapters are lesson #1, who is God ajnd why are we are wher we are as far as the beginning and end is concerned. The rest of the whole Bible can be applied to the text of Ge:3:15 and the two determinations made in that verse. When Jesus said it is finished while on the cross that was the conclusion to all things related to the bruise to the heel, anything not fulfilled from the OT prophecies belong to the words that are relevent to the bruise to Satan's head. The beginning was the mid verses of Acts:10 and the final verse is when Christ says 'Its is done.' as He pours out the last of the 7 vials.
Can you imagine how long I wouldn't have lasted in the Middle Ages? lol, ... gulp.