Enlightment or what.

[china]

All so called religious people have something in common.They are all looking for something which they variously call nirvana, liberation, enlightenment, self-realization, eternity or God. Their goal is defined and held before them in various teachings, and each of these teachings, these systems, has its set of sacred books, its disciplines, its teachers, its morality, its philosophy, its promises and threats - a straight and narrow path excluding the rest of the world and promising at its end some heaven or other. Most of these seekers move from one system to another, substituting the latest teaching for the one they have recently dropped. They move from one emotional orgy to another, not thinking that the same process is at work in all this seeking. Some of them remain in one system with one group and refuse to budge.All this seems to me very unhealthy. These people sacrifice ordinary living for some imaginary goal and a most unpleasant feeling emanates from this kind of milieu: fanaticism, hysteria, violence and stupidity. One is surprised to find among them certain ones who otherwise seem quite sane. All this is called religion. The whole thing stinks to high heaven. This is the incense of piety. I have observed it everywhere. This search for enlightenment causes great havoc, and people are sacrificed in its wake. Now I would like to ask you, is there in fact any such thing as enlightenment, and if so, what is it?
Your thoughts as always.

 

[Curiosity]

Welcome back China - to your conundrums and excellent things to think on!!!

I have only a short time but I think the main problem with people is we tend to look for comfort...
perhaps for reasons we refuse to acknowledge, not wanting to find the awful stuff we carry around...
therefore we seek comfort in belonging to a similar group who accept us in one strong bond - never
digging deep into why we "believe" what we state we do.

That to me would be the primary reason - it is why original tribes were formed - for safety - for delegation of duties and for belonging. Often these tribes brought their children up with the same
ideologies because little ones don't question - and parental knowledge is the first learning and difficult to remove once instilled.

Gotta scoot.... have a nice day China..wherever you are!

 

[Dreadful Nonsense]

well attaing enlightenment/ entering nirvana are two completly different concepts and studies..People tend to lump them together...

to lump all these into one sentence and even hint at labeling them the same concept of study is just wrong

They are all looking for something which they variously call nirvana, liberation, enlightenment, self-realization, eternity or God

the OP is like some sort of maoist religion is poison rant.....

As for enlightenment

It's expierence of we are all connected and intertwine that reality with love and compassion...Not just the idea but the actual expierence whilst touching eternity.....

 

[Tonington]

All this is called religion. The whole thing stinks to high heaven.

Great pun.

 

[karrie]

Now I would like to ask you, is there in fact any such thing as enlightenment, and if so, what is it?
Your thoughts as always.

To me, enlightenment is the recognition of the basic human urge to seek depth in this world that we can not see at face value. To see that we seek to know gods, quarks, black holes, and souls. We seek to unravel mysterious forces that our minds can only sense around. Things we can't fully truly comprehend. Enlightenment is seeing these endeavors and realizing "This is humanity. This is what makes us strive forward, what shapes our societies and makes us the beings we are." This is what causes China to spend his days pondering on what makes other people ponder, what makes them tick, what makes them think. The inner workings of their brains, an unfathomable foreign ground he can not tread upon.... yet wants to explore, wants to learn about. The same as wanting to know a god, wanting to find a new life form, wanting to prove if ghosts exist, wanting to show that all there is in life is atoms. enlightenment comes when you recognize that the answers you seek make you a part of the human struggle forward, and truly no different from the scientist, the Buddhist, the Catholic, or the paranormal researcher.

 

[china]

Thanks for all the above posts.


I think that if it is an escape from everyday living, everyday living being the extraordinary movement of relationship, then this so-called realization, this so-called enlightenment, or whatever name you like to give it, is illusion and hypocrisy. Anything that denies love and the understanding of life and action is bound to create a great deal of mischief. It distorts the mind, and life is made a horrible affair. So if we take that to be axiomatic then perhaps we may proceed to find out if enlightenment - whatever that may mean - can be found in the very act of living. After all, living is more important than any idea, ideal goal or principle. It is because we don't know what living is that we invent these visionary, unrealistic concepts which offer escape. The real question is, can one find enlightenment in living, in the everyday activities of life, or is it only for the few.Enlightenment means to be a light unto oneself, but a light which is not self-projected or imagined, which is not some personal idiosyncrasy. After all, this has always been the teaching of true religion, though not of organized belief and fear.Religion is not separate from life; on the contrary it is life itself. It is this division between religion and life which has bred all the misery. So the basic question is whether it is possible in daily life, to live in a state which, we call "enlightenment"?
Your thoughts as always.