Re: RE: Best sandwich ever!
"Yes, yes. No need to be a smartass commie. I had no idea you were in China. I was not paying attention to the names and flags crap. Do calm yourself."
Oh, I never realised the definition of "commie" was "one who lives in China". You never cease to amaze me with your great wisdom.
"I rather enjoyed that little ditty about Hong Kong and the opium trade. Never forget it was never forced upon you."
Huh? Is that not waht both Opium wars were about? The evil Chinese confiscation and destruction of Opium (kind of like what police do in Canada and the US in their war on drugs) is what started the first war. The second war was also caused by another incident of Chinese cracking down on British Opium imports. The Chinese lost both times and had to Give Hong Kong to the British in compensation for their evil deed of trying to protect the Chinese form British opium imports. Heck, even British newspapers of the time were ashamed and critical of what the British were doing in China.
Why? People in China were making too much money. Warlords and the like I believe. We had full permission of the Emperor/Empress.
Without adoubt. but without British backing, the government would eventually have been able to crush them. Unfortunately, after the first opium war, the Chinese had to sign an agreement opening all trade to British opium without restricitons. The second opium war was caused by a Chinese breach of the agreement around guangdong where opium addiction was spreading like wildfire at the time. So yes the emperor agreed, but against China's choice; the British had served the Chinese a humiliating defeat.
I think you need to do a little more research on the facts of the opium wars. The fact that the British were militarily victorious both times does not mean they had won any moral victory. Morally what the British did was shameful. Heck, even some british were ashamed of their victory.
Do you not find it strange that for a century little Hong Kong was wealthier than gigantic China?
First off, you should say "the rest of China". Secondly, remember that China got ransacked twice by the British. Then the US, Germany Russia and Japan came in to get a piece of the action. Then Japan came again to set up Manchuria. Finally, the Chinese being ABSOLUTELY SICK AND TIRED of foreign intervention thought, correctly or not, that they had found their saviour in the Communist party, whose main point of propaganda at the time was to free China from foreign intervention. As if that wasn't enough, when the Guomindang still had a chance of winning, the US came in to provide them with weapons, clothing and so on. The CCP immediately seized upon that for propaganda purposes, portraying the Guomindang as sell-outs bought by US interests. From that point forward, even the Guomindang started providing a steady supply of turncoats to the communists so much that propaganda program was so effective. Strange, US help ended up being the sword that killed the Guomindang for good. Had the US known the sentiment of the time, it would have given the help to the CCP instead and then let everyone know about it should the CCP accept it.
So after all that ransacking followed by division with taiwan, the cold war, fallout with Russia and India, worldwide economic sanctions, ending up with a final spasm with the Cultural Revolution, China was left in a complete mess. I'm sure China needed awhile to recover from rampant opium addiction nationwide too.
As for Hong Kong, it escaped unscathed from the US sanctions, the fallout with the USSR and India, etc. So yes, Hong Kong was lucky, and developped under the sweat of the Hong Kong people without harassement from the British or US, etc. free to open their markets to the world. The people on the mainland had no such opportunity as they suffered through US and world sanctions which finally pushed it over the edge, the straw which broke the camel's back if you will after over a centurly or ransacking, and culminated in teh Cultural Revolution which destryed whatever was left of an already tottering society squashed under sanctions. And it collapsed and finally had to rebuild itself from scratch. I'm sure Hong Kong would have gone through the same thing had its economy been blockaded by the British and US.
Could this have anything to do with British rule? Why yes I think it does.
Of course it does! The British never sanctionned Hong Kong!
Deng Xiaoping was bloody embarassed by this fact so he decided to adopt the British economic system.
Yes, Deng Xiaoping wanted to move towards a capitalistic system without a doubt, and the timing was right. The US was looking for new markets a the time, and so Noxon came into the scene. Finally, China was slowly to see the sacntins which so crippled it coming to an end, as the process continues today, so that it can enjoy the same freedom Hong Kong had always had.
Two decades or so later China has the world's fastest growing economy.
Of course! If someone should hold your head under waterfor awhile, you'll be gasping deeply for air too when you finally come up. China has been suppressed, one way or another, since the Opium Wars. This is the first time in over a century that it has finally had a chance to come up for air. And before you blame the communists, don't forget that the communists are a british and US creation. Had it not been for the Opium wars, the Chinese would never have thirsted for communism in the first place. And had the US never intervened to help the Guomindang, the people might not have turned their backs on it so quickly (that last point is less certain, but US help certainly hammered in the last nail of hope).
This could have nothing to do with their having adopted a British system now could it?
Smith, in his Wealth of Nations, wrote about capitalism. How can all the british take the credit for one man's work? go out and write your own book, will you.
Now why would you adopt a clearly 'imperialist' system?
Capitalism is not necessarily imperialist. Imposed Opium trade is!
I rest my case.
What case?
Thank you for your rapt attention. *waves to the commie spies reading this post back in China, then flips them the bird and laughs at their country's dependence upon our natural resources with which we could shut down China's entire economy* Ta chum!
Like it or not, China is now Iran's biggest oil purchaser. And Russia is selling lots of it too. Needless to say in future China will turn more to Arabia than it will to the US with its depleted resources. But I suppose China will do well to maintain good relations with Canada too I suppose.