American traitor and coward writes communist book

darkbeaver

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Jan 26, 2006
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RE: American traitor and

Why do you feel threatened by a book review? I offer what the writer has discovered as a base for discussion. If you doubt it's correctness or fail to understand the writers concern for his country this is not of my doing. The man Phillips has very solid credentials. It will do you no good to belittle me. America has some very serious problems it won't hurt to discuss them but it will hurt to pretend they don't exist.
 

darkbeaver

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Jan 26, 2006
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RE: American traitor and

JimMoyer said
"This observation in both Darwin, the Old Testament and
in Buddhism makes me think maybe the universe isn't all about us."

Now you're talking sense, I think you're correct in your suspicion.
 

jimmoyer

jimmoyer
Apr 3, 2005
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Darkbeaver, your man is making a cartoon case.

Please refer to my previous post on that point.

Of course there are those who defy evolution
and of course there are those like me who find
the combat on this matter more useful to get a
student's interest.

In fact, the Christian guy who led the boycott of
the movie, The Last Temptation of Christ, in 1988
admits he was wrong.

In fact to make up for it, he is encouraging fellow
believers to watch The Da Vinci Code movie, and even
encouraging them to rent a DVD of the Temptation of
Christ, knowing some of it is very antithetical to
their beliefs, yet wiser this time around, for it will
stimulate interest, discovery, learning, and passion.
 

darkbeaver

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Jan 26, 2006
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Re: RE: American traitor and coward writes communist book

jimmoyer said:
Darkbeaver, your man is making a cartoon case.

Please refer to my previous post on that point.

Of course there are those who defy evolution
and of course there are those like me who find
the combat on this matter more useful to get a
student's interest.

In fact, the Christian guy who led the boycott of
the movie, The Last Temptation of Christ, in 1988
admits he was wrong.

In fact to make up for it, he is encouraging fellow
believers to watch The Da Vinci Code movie, and even
encouraging them to rent a DVD of the Temptation of
Christ, knowing some of it is very antithetical to
their beliefs, yet wiser this time around, for it will
stimulate interest, discovery, learning, and passion.

You have spent the last two months instructing about the dangers of radical fundamental religious beliefs, and you were right to do so, if you cannot discuss it's emergance in the west with respect to christians, I find this hypocritical, the problem is not confined to one religion it is universal and alive and well in America and just as dangerous, witness the war that you are engaged in remember the crusade your man declared soon after 9/11.
You keep belittling Kevin Philips, he uses facts not supposition not fiction just fact and figures, his concerns are your concerns, if you don't want to honestly address the pressing problems in America then you are sure to go the way of every other empire, Mr Philips outlines in detail what drove the others under, the exact same conditions obtain today in our western world, of which I am a part. The slide has already begun, the world is changing right in front of your eyes and mine and we see two different things, you seem to want to cling to the familiar but that is impossible.Empires do not last, they have all fallen, for the same reasons, those reasons are at work in America today, the work is far advanced and there is not much chance of reversal. It is already out of Americas control.
 

I think not

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darkbeaver said:
Jesus Christ (oops) ITN this guy was practcally concieved and delivered in the whitehouse eh, how far right do you have to be to think he's from the fringe eh? I think you might have to be from some other fringe eh. If you don't like American Theocrascy then how about American Freemockcracy eh. And technically American Therocracy is not an oxymoron eh, your're beginning lie to us ITN.

LittleRunningGag said:
I would suggest that you talk to some of the atheists in your country. They would dissagree with you. Those that I talk to have really felt threatened by the current government.

When the author uses an extreme word such as theocracy, in effect "being ruled by God", I have no choice but to call it an oxymoron. I realize evangelicals play a role with Bush, but you all forget the courts, the legislature and our checks and balances. You can read all you want about theocracies till your blue in the face, look elsewhere for it other than South.

When the fringe left (and right) needs to describe a situation with extreme characteristics, who do you think will ever listen to any of you? Nobody. You look like fools even contemplating the idea of theocracy in the US.
 

jimmoyer

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Apr 3, 2005
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I see your sincere point, Darkbeaver.

As I said earlier, no doubt there are those defying
evolution.

Also no doubt a Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell
gets the world press with some of their stupid
statements.

No doubt.

But if you live in IT, live down here, it is not the
scary fearsome parade made so much of like a cartoon
emblematic of the MAJORITY in this country.

If you re-read who I said MOST of these people are
they just shake their heads at these cartoons posing
as the truth.

And some poll of Slovenia and Bosnia that more per
capita believe in evolution there ?

Man, that's like a phone poll of all the voters
when a headline proclaimed DEWEY BEATS TRUMAN.

Later they looked at it, and saw the only bozos who
owned phones were REPUBLICANS.

Slovenia and Bosnia ???

I'm a YUGOphile and those countries are quite fascinating
but with the infrastructure still pretty bad in Bosnia
you wonder about the details there, eh?

Slovenia is still battling Gypsies, just like the Czechs
and Slovakians. Whole other culture, detailed and
complicated.

The guy you quote has a bit of the hyperbole
and I'm sorry I don't find him deep, nor analytical.

Check out real pollsters for once.

There are some real ones.

By the way these same fundamentalist Christians your
author worries over in hyperbolic prose has seen their
Jesus pissed on by another statue in art museums,
and cartoons ridiculing Baptists and they don't like it
but they aren't burning cars and buildings.

Instead they're raising their kids. They're spending
time and money on helping others.

We really are creatures of the news.

And yes I'm not fair about this, but I will wager you
a bet that most Americans are far more educated
about their own hypocrisy than any Middle East nation.
 

jimmoyer

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Apr 3, 2005
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Books and Ideas: The Identity Crisis of Kevin Phillips

By Walter Olson

America is headed for an all-out kicking match between its Gucci-clad haves and its shoeless have-nots. Or so we may be hearing in coming months, since class conflict is the theme of The Politics of Rich and Poor: Wealth and the American Electorate in the Reagan Aftermath (Random House, $19.95), a new book by one of the nation's most unstoppable opinionizers.

Author Kevin Phillips is to quote dispensers what Pez is to candy dispensers. Asking Nexis for his recent clips triggers the equivalent of a pinball TILT, warning that more than 500 are forthcoming. Phillips is one of the political commentators who dominate the talk-show circuit and, significantly, one of the few routinely labeled as a conservative.

He came to note in 1969 when, as a Richard Nixon adviser, he wrote The Emerging Republican Majority, a clever analysis of voting patterns around the country. As prophecy the book was shaky -- the fabled Sunbelt lasted longer as a catch-phrase than as a cohesive voting bloc -- but the author marshaled his maps and statistics with insight and striking detail and won an all-purpose public role as campaign oddsmaker, national mood intuiter, and roving commentator on substantive policy.

Gradually Phillips grew more pessimistic about the prospects of conservative success. His view was that Nixon had ushered in a rightward political trend in 1968 that was due any day to peter out, allowing a cyclical return to liberal-left dominance. What happened instead was that Ronald Reagan got elected. In the years that followed, Phillips relentlessly forecast practical failure and public rejection of conservative leaders and their policies.

The more successes Reagan scored, the harsher grew his tone. "No serious observer ever thought that an actor from Hollywood would make it into the first tier along with George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Abraham Lincoln, and perhaps Franklin D. Roosevelt," Phillips wrote in 1987. "What now seems far-fetched is earlier speculation that he might join the six or eight of the second tier. He won't." Nor had the Noted Conservative much use for such figures as Margaret Thatcher, Robert Bork, or George Bush.

It got hard to tell where the mood forecaster left off and the change-of-mood exhorter began. In his monthly column for the Los Angeles Times, Phillips began beating the drum for an industrial policy and big tax hikes for upper earners, and accused free-trade supporters of being unpatriotic. Recently he proposed that well over $100 billion a year be shunted from defense into new government domestic spending. The differences between his creed of "populism" and the views of some leftish Democrats are not always easy to discern.

His current book represents a sort of wet-winged emergence from the ideological chrysalis. He insists that the way for Democrats to beat Republicans is to get the public mad at big business and the wealthy, and he devotes most of his 221 pages to stoking that resentment with every rhetorical means at his disposal. He even flays Democrat Michael Dukakis for stressing problem solving and economic growth instead of that more divisive theme during the 1988 campaign.
 

darkbeaver

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Jan 26, 2006
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RE: American traitor and

corporate profits in the US
Part of the Empire disease.
manufacturing sector 10% and falling
financial services 44% and rising

Financial services cannot sustain an empire, Rome tried it,Holland tried it, Spain tried it, England tried it and the USA is into it heavier than any of them ever where.No healty manufacturing base= no country.

Historically, the financialization of society has always been a symbol that a nation,s economic position has entered a phase of deterioration.

William Wolman and Anne Colamosca, The Judas Economy, 1997
 

cortez

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Feb 22, 2006
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Re: RE: American traitor and

darkbeaver said:
corporate profits in the US
Part of the Empire disease.
manufacturing sector 10% and falling
financial services 44% and rising

Financial services cannot sustain an empire, Rome tried it,Holland tried it, Spain tried it, England tried it and the USA is into it heavier than any of them ever where.No healty manufacturing base= no country.

Historically, the financialization of society has always been a symbol that a nation,s economic position has entered a phase of deterioration.

William Wolman and Anne Colamosca, The Judas Economy, 1997

good one
that looks like interesting book youve quoted
we all learn much from the beaver in all his darkness and greatness
 

I think not

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Re: RE: American traitor and

darkbeaver said:
manufacturing sector 10% and falling
financial services 44% and rising

Financial services cannot sustain an empire, Rome tried it,Holland tried it, Spain tried it, England tried it and the USA is into it heavier than any of them ever where.No healty manufacturing base= no country.

You believe everything you are told from the looney left eh Beav?

 

I think not

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Re: RE: American traitor and

darkbeaver said:
Unreliable source ITN.

You're the first beaver I know of that acts like an ostrich, with its head in the sand. Keep believing what you believe, I'll be drinking pina coladas while you are screaming the same thing 20 years from now.
 

cortez

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Feb 22, 2006
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Re: RE: American traitor and

I think not said:
darkbeaver said:
manufacturing sector 10% and falling
financial services 44% and rising

Financial services cannot sustain an empire, Rome tried it,Holland tried it, Spain tried it, England tried it and the USA is into it heavier than any of them ever where.No healty manufacturing base= no country.

You believe everything you are told from the looney left eh Beav?


youd have to campare that to other nations
even during the decline of spain holland britain etc--- there was
absolute growth-- but relative decrease to the rising powers of the time---

im not sure that beavers argument regarding manufacturing base comes uniquely from the left---- itsnt this a broad spectrum concern......
 

darkbeaver

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Jan 26, 2006
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RE: American traitor and

Even Britian, as it happens has avoided the reckless deindustrialization allowed in the United States. Although British manufacturing exports lack the comparative heft they registered in 1870 or 1890, economic historians underscore that in 1990 merchandise exports represented 21 persent of British GDP, whereas in the United States they amounted to only 8 percent. Between 2000 and 2003
, the share of US GDP represented by manufactured exports dropped from 7 percent to 6 percent and it is chilling to contemplate what the ratios might be in 2010 or 2020.

from American Theocracy
 

I think not

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Re: RE: American traitor and

darkbeaver said:
Even Britian, as it happens has avoided the reckless deindustrialization allowed in the United States. Although British manufacturing exports lack the comparative heft they registered in 1870 or 1890, economic historians underscore that in 1990 merchandise exports represented 21 persent of British GDP, whereas in the United States they amounted to only 8 percent. Between 2000 and 2003
, the share of US GDP represented by manufactured exports dropped from 7 percent to 6 percent and it is chilling to contemplate what the ratios might be in 2010 or 2020.

from American Theocracy

Cite the source since you have the book.
 

sanch

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Apr 8, 2005
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Kevin Phillips has not been in the republican camp for 25 years. Not sure when the Kristols moved from the far left to the far right but there may have been a swap for Phillips.

We are in a new phase of capitalism which Phillips identified early on as paper capitalism. David Harvey refers to it as fictional capitalism. It is probably a transitional phase similar to merchant capital where agrarian production waned as investment shifted to exploration and development of a new economic empire. We are entering a new period. A good read on some case examples is Friedman’s The World is Flat.