Alberta moves to export water!

[CDNBear]

we've given alot.

And taken a whole lot more...

 

[lonenewfwolf]

And taken a whole lot more...

that wouldn't be our collective opinion. lots of intangibles in the mix, but if you start adding up the exports per capita of our province compared to the rest of ya, and then add in historic contributions over the past 500 years, i'd say this place has done its share of the work that has gone into making this country a great place to live and be free.

 

[B00Mer]

I thought Alberta was in a water shortage???

The wanted to build the largest mall in North America in Balzac, Alberta but couldn't find a large enough water source.. Calgary or Ardrie didn't want to supply ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CrossIron_Mills

 

[cyberclark]

Lakes being drained, eh?.. No doubt that your argument incorporates elements of fear-based logic in order to get some attention. So, you'd be OK if one were to package .99999 cubic metres of water into flimsy packaging and mass transport it across the border? How about train-loads of 500ml bottles that cross daily?








Where did the 2 billion go?

On the point of the wealth that "could have been"... Had AB not transferred billions annually to Quebec through the feds, that fund would be many times bigger, however, that's an aside. Have you noticed the infrastructure development throughout the entire province in the last 10 years?

Those roads and hospitals don't build themselves.







The private system?.. Really.. can you prove this?

As for the schools, the Calgary institution is Mount Royal University... Clearly you are not familiar with these advances as you rely on off-handed comments that are without a basis in fact.







Look harder and while you're at it, look at the industry developed funds that deal with these associated issues.









Again, you rely on partisan rhetoric and spin to exaggerate a point... Anyone that moves forward and advances must be on the take with the gvt.. That's nothing but rubbish and conspiracy theory.

Fact is, AB is the most business friendly jurisdiction in the country and it shows.... No provincial (long-term) debt, a GDP that is floating the rest of the nation and a provincial tax structure that attracts the H.O.'s of national entities... There is a reason why other provinces have been emulating the AB model cyberclark, it's because it is effective, it works and it is the antithesis of teh Taft mentality.






Where can I get my million bucks cyberclark?... I'm working with a group that is posied to drill over 100 shallow and mid wells.. $100 million will from the gvt will liminate the need to raise money or go public, hell, maybe we ought to drill 500 wells and make a 100 million in profit, eh?

I'm guessing that you won't be able to tell me where to get the million per well right?... No link either, eh?









Wrong. A tax incentive is not a subsidy, tax-based breaks apply:

1. only after the money is spent
2. are assessed against revenues/profits
3. are in no way an actual cash infusion

Revenues are made up through increased spending, employment and activity - all of which are taxable components... The gvt makes more money in the long and short run by having more transactions occurring throughout the equation.

Taft's pathetic little plan would hammer the people/companies spending/investing which would result in fewer expenditures that would reduce the number of transactions in the system which would minimize the potential taxes collected... Ofcourse, liberal logic will respond by raising the taxes on the remaining players in order to maintain the tax base. Of course, that will restrict transactions further and perpetuate the downward spiral.





BC and Sask are no where near those original royalty rates for a reason cyberclark and the reason is that they pussy-footed around for decades holding-out for a deal.. That deal never came and now they are decades behind in their provincial infrastructure that supports the industry.

they've seen the light and are getting smart.

Nice to visit with a guy from the industry. Conventional drilling royalty is down to 5% Canadian In Alberta. That is not even a break even number, it means we are paying the producers for taking the oil out of the province! This is locked in for 5 years! Where in your wildest imagination do you consider this to be adequate?

Your are spouting the same BS as the Government does. All Albertan's are entitled to is land sales and income tax. This is patently wrong!

bottled water is not bulk water, and therefore not a commodity. it is a good. read nafta. no go on the water sale boys, get over it.



not if you're talking about newfoundland and labrador. we got lots of 'em, and we plan on keepin' em.


brrr. dude. that gives me chills. too bad for them the jig is almost up. people are awakening to the mess we're in.


easy there hot shot. newfoundland has given more to this country than workers in fort mac. we let em take our fish for ontario factory workers, iror ore for quebec to process and our hydro for quebec to subsidize its aerospace industry etc.

its give and take. and we've given alot.

Well lonewolf it is you who are confused or at least trying to screw up the thoughts on the blogs. Any liquid container which is greater than 1 cubic meter is said to be in bulk and bulk rules and regulations apply. Bottled water is not part of the conversations as far as protecting our supplies goes. And, for 2 cents worth Nanton Water does a great job!

Lakes are not generally used to draw water from (except in Alberta's oil industry where out of sight is out of mind) This is because most lakes do not have a feed supply that is measurable. Water drafts in most jurisdictions comes from Rivers. And while I am on this subject the draft trucks that take the water from the lakes also haul other stuff for disposal and/or use.

They usually flush their tanks out into the lakes before they load their precious water.

Out of sight; out of mind.

 

[captain morgan]

Nice to visit with a guy from the industry. Conventional drilling royalty is down to 5% Canadian In Alberta.

5% of what?

That is not even a break even number, it means we are paying the producers for taking the oil out of the province! This is locked in for 5 years! Where in your wildest imagination do you consider this to be adequate?

.. So, 0% would be better?

Would you expect that by increasing royalty rates that more groups would race to the game?

Your are spouting the same BS as the Government does. All Albertan's are entitled to is land sales and income tax. This is patently wrong!

And, you're spewing the identical nonsense that got Taft booted from public life.

 

[B00Mer]

soon, in the news we will here Alberta seperates fron Canada and becomes the 51st state... lol

I am sure the USA and the Tea Party would love this... lol

 

[captain morgan]

Lakes are not generally used to draw water from (except in Alberta's oil industry where out of sight is out of mind)

Must be those "invisible lakes" that I heard about on Discovery Channel.

They usually flush their tanks out into the lakes before they load their precious water.

Out of sight; out of mind.

How do they actual find the invisible lake in which to reload?

 

[petros]

I just looked out the window and I say SELL SELL SELL.

 

[damngrumpy]

This is much more important than Alberta's interest, it is in fact Canada's interest.
We should under no circumstance allow bulk water sales to any country it should
be the domain of Canadians. We on this planet will soon be facing enormous costs
for three main commodities, at present bulk water is not part of the free trade
agreements and we must keep it that way. Water, Food and Oil are going to be
the real money value of the planet and we must ensure that we have plenty, it is not
for sale, trade, or gifts. Canada is sitting on top of the world when it comes to these
products.
We should ensure we have an eternal supply of water, as long as we own the rights
to our own nation. Second We must maintain control over all farmland in fact we
should and need to pass laws that ensures all farmland is owned and controlled by
Canadian farmers for feeding Canadians first. Third we should make sure that we have
an adequate supply of oil from known reserves that will last for the next two centuries.
These products are ours and we should keep them for future generations.
I am not saying we should not export either oil, if we have enough, or food it is a renewable
resource, but we should control all farmland for our national interests. As for water it is
the source of life, it is ours and I see no reason to turn it over to private interests to sell
our rightful ownerships of water as a society.
Is that nationalistic damn right, is it somewhat selfish, damn right and I think we should
speak up for Canadian interests first

 

[cyberclark]

This is much more important than Alberta's interest, it is in fact Canada's interest.
We should under no circumstance allow bulk water sales to any country it should
be the domain of Canadians. We on this planet will soon be facing enormous costs
for three main commodities, at present bulk water is not part of the free trade
agreements and we must keep it that way. Water, Food and Oil are going to be
the real money value of the planet and we must ensure that we have plenty, it is not
for sale, trade, or gifts. Canada is sitting on top of the world when it comes to these
products.
We should ensure we have an eternal supply of water, as long as we own the rights
to our own nation. Second We must maintain control over all farmland in fact we
should and need to pass laws that ensures all farmland is owned and controlled by
Canadian farmers for feeding Canadians first. Third we should make sure that we have
an adequate supply of oil from known reserves that will last for the next two centuries.
These products are ours and we should keep them for future generations.
I am not saying we should not export either oil, if we have enough, or food it is a renewable
resource, but we should control all farmland for our national interests. As for water it is
the source of life, it is ours and I see no reason to turn it over to private interests to sell
our rightful ownerships of water as a society.
Is that nationalistic damn right, is it somewhat selfish, damn right and I think we should
speak up for Canadian interests first

Alberta has now privatized all the water in the Province. What they are doing is obscene!
They give oil companies water allotments far greater than what they require. Then, they tell the communities who find they are short of water to buy the allotment from the oil companies. Millions of dollars at play here the most recent being Okotoks, AB.

Meanwhile, communities are in the mix big time. Edmonton has the highest price water in the world (National Geographic April 2010).
Communities like Devon and Red Deer have upped their water prices. The former, by 25% because they could. They explain they are middle of the pack in pricing. A similar increase just took place in Red Deer, AB and they put forward the same reasoning.

When they place the price of their water against Edmonton they certainly look like they are middle of the pack but, the Conservatives are trying to push the water higher to support higher export prices under NAFTA.

More important, if that is possible, Alberta is setting up Bulk Water Exports from our ground water. This, while elsewhere in the world people are fighting to protect their ground water from export.

In my blog, I have put up several allotments and will put more up when I get to it.

Here are some links for a start. In the top left corner you can enter a search and turn up water electricity what ever else they have ripped off by subject posts.


Alberta--The Details: Water for Sale: Southern Alberta.

Alberta--The Details: Alberta commercialized water; hold outs for more bucks!

Alberta--The Details: Canada Bulk Water Export: NDP strongly opposed.

Alberta--The Details: Canada Bulk Water Exports to US and abroad is imminent!

Alberta--The Details: Alberta Conservativs Pushing US style system.

And, the one which is most important is this: Alberta--The Details: Canada is under seige from within!

The latter shows an organization of Western and Northern Governments who are in a position now to separate from Canada. If not that they will certainly do away with CPP (Morton is the hold out in resiting enlarging it) OAS and Canadian Health Care is on the line.

As no time in history, Canadians have to pull together and get the Conservatives, Federal and Provincial out of office. That, is the only cure for what ails us now!

 

[damngrumpy]

In many cases like here in BC Okanagan Lake is a Federal Waterway and comes under the
Federal Governments Jurisdiction. It is the Department of Fisheries and Oceans that controls
water on a national level. In the area of trade internationally the federal government still has the
control over the export of water. Privatization is one thing exporting it is something else.
We must ensure that water remains a Canadian Domain in Canada period.
Government must control water as it becomes the life force for us all and we do not want to be
in the position of sharing it through some trade deal when our own children and grandchildren
could end up without an adequate supply of water, or and secure supply of homegrown food.
or for that matter an reliable energy supply. In many cases I am an economic nationalist in that
I want access to Canadian resources in the hands of Canadians. It can be government or
private owned but it must come under the legislative protection of a strong federal government
when it come to Canadian access.

 

[Avro]

Glad to see Alberta acting like...well....Alberta.

 

[cyberclark]

In many cases like here in BC Okanagan Lake is a Federal Waterway and comes under the
Federal Governments Jurisdiction. It is the Department of Fisheries and Oceans that controls
water on a national level. In the area of trade internationally the federal government still has the
control over the export of water. Privatization is one thing exporting it is something else.
We must ensure that water remains a Canadian Domain in Canada period.
Government must control water as it becomes the life force for us all and we do not want to be
in the position of sharing it through some trade deal when our own children and grandchildren
could end up without an adequate supply of water, or and secure supply of homegrown food.
or for that matter an reliable energy supply. In many cases I am an economic nationalist in that
I want access to Canadian resources in the hands of Canadians. It can be government or
private owned but it must come under the legislative protection of a strong federal government
when it come to Canadian access.

I wouldn't be too sure the Feds still control export of water.
The recent changes in legislation that the Conservatives touted as distancing the Fed from Exporting water is true enough; what they did is turn the powers of bulk water export over to the provinces. Noticeably exempt and still under Federal Control is the Navigatabile Waters which takes a strike of the Federal Pen to change in less time than it takes to write this comment.
From June 16-2010:British Columbia Premier Gordon Campbell joined his counterparts from Saskatchewan, Manitoba,Northwest Territories, Yukon and Nunavut for the two-day conference at the Pan Pacific Hotel.

Followed by:

Lawrence Cannon – Min of Foreign Affairs – Transboundary Waters Protection Act – May 13, 2010
“The new act strengthens existing protections by bringing waters within federal jurisdiction under a more comprehensive prohibition against bulk water removals. Rivers and streams that cross international borders will now receive the same protection already in place for waters, such as the Great Lakes, that straddle them.


The Act gives the federal government new powers of inspection and enforcement and introduces tough new penalties for violations, including fines of up to $6 million for corporate violations. The bill offers unprecedented federal protection against bulk water exports while respecting provincial constitutional jurisdiction.”

What the above does is put Canada's water in one pail so to speak; any of which is available for export when the rules of NAFTA are changed!


Minister Cannon Tables the Transboundary Waters Protection Act to Protect Canadian Waters

Bill C-26 – Summary of the bill can be found here.

The Transboundary Waters Protection Act


On a preview I just caught of Harper's interview on CBC tonight, he is saying he is about to change this country to that the Liberals will never recognize it.

If people elect these SOBs again, that is exactly what will happen.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Selling bottled water is okay, but bulk water is a big no no. In the future, water, energy and food are key and we have to keep as many rights as possible regarding these three essential elements for our economic future.

 

[petros]

Either water goes south or people come north...or they could start by ban swimming pools or move the **** out of the desert.

 

[GreenFish66]

It would seem Our Leaders would sell us all up the river for little more than a money filled hand shake...

Our " So Called" Leaders seem to be little more than Accounting Puppets for the U.S...

They Will have us Dig Rivers , Build Pipe lines from North to the South America , Rape, Pillage, Strip our resources clean ..Until this Beautiful Country is no more than a Slimmey Sink Hole/A Barren Waste land ..Sell It All Under the banner of Job Creation...It is Sad ...And Unsustainable..Canadian Political Leaders need to grow some "BALLS N' BRAINS N' Better Business Sense..!

 

[cyberclark]

It would seem Our Leaders would sell us all up the river for little more than a money filled hand shake...

Our " So Called" Leaders seem to be little more than Accounting Puppets for the U.S...

They Will have us Dig Rivers , Build Pipe lines from North to the South America , Rape, Pillage, Strip our resources clean ..Until this Beautiful Country is no more than a Slimmey Sink Hole/A Barren Waste land ..Sell It All Under the banner of Job Creation...It is Sad ...And Unsustainable..Canadian Political Leaders need to grow some "BALLS N' BRAINS N' Better Business Sense..!

The Alberta Government and the BC Government are working hand in hand on water exports. The major project is moving 2/3s of the Peace River South to the US border. This project is immense and was fully engineered in the 80s. It is good to go! Here is how BC and Alberta team on this:
Alberta builds the pipeline and BC builds a new dam on the Peace. BC tells the population it is for electricity but the amount of electricity they will take from this dam is very small.

The operation: A sump is formed between the existing dam and the new dam. This sum will be the head of the new pipeline. It will have to delivery water year around so, a man made lake (sump) is needed to supply the line.

I am working on a new post, the cause and effect of the Conservatives moves on Canada It will be an interesting read with major detail for those who will take the time. It should be ready to go up within 2 days. When I post I will put a link here.

 

[GreenFish66]

Yes ..Very interesting CyberClark

 

[cyberclark]

Here is my critique of our politics as promised; we are in some very major trouble