Love
- Thread starter china
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the opposite of fear IS love..so the freedom from fear is being in the presence of love or being love rather then fear..everything we do in this life is based on fear or love.
relationship is a man made term. love is not made by man/human/whatever of this material world. love extends beyond this material world. love can be incorporated into a relationship..not the other way around. love always comes first...
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true love is outside a manmade definition -
i agree..love IS.. the IS is to just BE..
there is nothing wrong incorporating LOVE into our lives and into our wants - we are love..why not bring it into our relationships..its just a matter of realising the difference that love isent CREATED from man made desire..
i half agree with you, but you are elevating love to an unnatural position.
Love is a description for processes that occur at the core of the animal.
love is really nothing. man makes it to be something. man acts as it is this wonderful uniting force above all. It is not. Our uniting is driven by our social nature which enhances survival. That is all it is. (we form trust relationships through this instinctual drive).
the biggest aspect to this elevation is this ideology of a separation of "love" from things.
Love is a description for processes that occur at the core of the animal.
love is really nothing. man makes it to be something. man acts as it is this wonderful uniting force above all. It is not. Our uniting is driven by our social nature which enhances survival. That is all it is. (we form trust relationships through this instinctual drive).
the biggest aspect to this elevation is this ideology of a separation of "love" from things.
I have friends I Love but no way in hell Id trust them one bit. Love is like breathing air its a given.
i agree that man makes love out to be something that it is not, confusing what it really is..man is defining love as a material expression...
however i don tagree that it is nothing..love is everything..
if by
you are refering to the core as the soul, then i agree..our soul is love..pure energy..god..
personally i feel no word or definition could totally sum up soul or true being of life, but love is the closest thing that comes to it..its just hard to see when its meaning is watered down by the constant misuse of the egos need for attention....thanks hallmark...
Feronia :
I haven't finished reading yet but I wanted to say this, Love is a verb not a noun. China, for the first time I'll agree with one thing you said. "Love IS!".
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Well ,Now I see why you don,t agree with the things that I say here in forum. You concentrate more on the "word" ,its grammatical structure and not on the full message . Word is not the 'thing' ,YOU HAVE TO GO "BEYOND" THE WORD to grasp its meaning. Love is not a noun or a verb ; Love IS.
Thankyou for the compliment any ways,China
I haven't finished reading yet but I wanted to say this, Love is a verb not a noun. China, for the first time I'll agree with one thing you said. "Love IS!".
____________________________________________________________________________________
Well ,Now I see why you don,t agree with the things that I say here in forum. You concentrate more on the "word" ,its grammatical structure and not on the full message . Word is not the 'thing' ,YOU HAVE TO GO "BEYOND" THE WORD to grasp its meaning. Love is not a noun or a verb ; Love IS.
Thankyou for the compliment any ways,China
ONEENO :
the opposite of fear IS love..so the freedom from fear is being in the presence of love or being love rather then fear..everything we do in this life is based on fear or love.
relationship is a man made term. love is not made by man/human/whatever of this material world. love extends beyond this material world. love can be incorporated into a relationship..not the other way around. love always comes first
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LOVE IS ,Love is an entity and entity has no opposits . The opposits contain themselfs.There is no fear in Love .Love is not a product of knowledge or thought , therfore you can,t know love.Oviously what you think is Love ,it is not . You can't find love so don't even look for it . Love will find you when you are ready .Then all you can do is give it away ,you can't control it and if you will try to hold on to it ,it will just flee away.
When there is the "I",Love is not
Whene the"I"is absent , Love IS
the opposite of fear IS love..so the freedom from fear is being in the presence of love or being love rather then fear..everything we do in this life is based on fear or love.
relationship is a man made term. love is not made by man/human/whatever of this material world. love extends beyond this material world. love can be incorporated into a relationship..not the other way around. love always comes first
_________________________________________________________________________________
LOVE IS ,Love is an entity and entity has no opposits . The opposits contain themselfs.There is no fear in Love .Love is not a product of knowledge or thought , therfore you can,t know love.Oviously what you think is Love ,it is not . You can't find love so don't even look for it . Love will find you when you are ready .Then all you can do is give it away ,you can't control it and if you will try to hold on to it ,it will just flee away.
When there is the "I",Love is not
Whene the"I"is absent , Love IS
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I agree that love is not a product of knowledge or thought..as i said, "love is not made by man/human/whatever of this material world" which knowledge and thought are a a by-product of.
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as i said in a later post,
and
love cant truly be defined, i agree, but we also need to make an attempt to do so because that is how our minds handle it in this reality.
CHINA:
to me this is defining love as a thing..an outside force..
love is what we are..not something to come to us. we are made of love. we cant find what we already are..we just have to realize it...you say love is an entity..i agree, but we are that entity or part of that entity - but by making us something seperate from love, that gives love an opposite... something that love is not..and that couldent be, because love is everything...
i half agree that love comes to us when we are ready for it, but not in the sense of an outside force revealing itself to it..love comes to us or rather, we realize that we are love, when we let down our guard and are BEING, by-passing the restricting material view we have created for ourselves in this life.
i still think there is too much confusion in teh definition and view of love as too many people are connecting it with an emotion. love can have a positive/euphoric emotion but it is also more then that..
and being we are slaves to our senses (at least until we learn better), most people dont move past the emotion part of love when they reach it..
not the soul, as soul is (to me) just another human construct. I do not accept any concept of a soul. We are biological entities driven by chemical reactions. Love in that sense is nothing other than the trust relationships we perceive as a result of chemical reactions based on our evolutionary path (social animals).
So our thoughts and actions are influenced by our egos, emotions and instincts. Here's the thing - we have consciousness, we can choose our actions, we can decide between right and wrong.
It is important for us to strengthen our consciousness. A strong consciousness allows us to love more freely, and therefore allows us to be human.
When our egos run the show we suffer more because our ability to love is diminished and we are not being true to ourselves. You could say that we suffer a sort of spiritual illness.
I think many of the world's problems are a result of weak or underdeveloped consciousness in humans. A strong consciousness allows us to resist the temptations of greed, envy, anger, prejudice, ignorance and other enemies that we all face regardless of race or religion.
It is important for us to strengthen our consciousness. A strong consciousness allows us to love more freely, and therefore allows us to be human.
When our egos run the show we suffer more because our ability to love is diminished and we are not being true to ourselves. You could say that we suffer a sort of spiritual illness.
I think many of the world's problems are a result of weak or underdeveloped consciousness in humans. A strong consciousness allows us to resist the temptations of greed, envy, anger, prejudice, ignorance and other enemies that we all face regardless of race or religion.
our thoughts are influenced by our past, and external stumuli.
how much choice we have is fairly limited. It is an illusion that we make choices.
right and wrong don't exist as absolutes, but are relative to the perspective of the group/individual.
humanity is found in the most animalistic actions/reactions.
love is found in those most animalistic actions/reactions.
the development of a different awareness is to eventually transcend humanity.
the animal is on the cusp of such an awareness,
but these things take time (eons).
there is nothing special about consciousness in and of itself.
love is neither enhanced nor diminished by the ego. (but the egoless state is for another topic)
the resistance of temptation? the denial of what one is?
temptation is only present if you make it present.
it is all about what constructs you wish to accept or reject (which, as i referenced above, is not something you have much control over).
Illusion? That sounds rather hopeless, why bother getting out of bed in the morning?
As for the rest of your post I have no idea what you are talking about, you may be right... but is your point of view doing anybody any good?
it is not hopeless, grover.
Deconstructing the myths does quite a bit of "good".
It allows us to find what is "real".
(for another thread, but if I continued describing this jouney it would reveal there is no "you", which is similar to your desire to downplay the ego, just an order of magnitude greater)
Deconstructing the myths does quite a bit of "good".
It allows us to find what is "real".
(for another thread, but if I continued describing this jouney it would reveal there is no "you", which is similar to your desire to downplay the ego, just an order of magnitude greater)
CaracalKid
Downplay the Ego would put you out of touch with reality - is that where you believe "love" to be?
Somehow I have always believed love is tangled up in the Id.....
http://allpsych.com/psychology101/ego.html
Chapter 3: Personality Development
The role of the unconscious is only one part of the model. Freud also believed that everything we are aware of is stored in our conscious. Our conscious makes up a very small part of who we are. In other words, at any given time, we are only aware of a very small part of what makes up our personality; most of what we are is buried and inaccessible.
Because the unconscious is so large, and because we are only aware of the very small conscious at any given time, this theory has been likened to an iceberg, where the vast majority is buried beneath the water's surface. The water, by the way, would represent everything that we are not aware of, have not experienced, and that has not been integrated into our personalities, referred to as the nonconscious.
Downplay the Ego would put you out of touch with reality - is that where you believe "love" to be?
Somehow I have always believed love is tangled up in the Id.....
http://allpsych.com/psychology101/ego.html
Chapter 3: Personality Development
Section 1: Introduction to Development, Personality, and Stage Theories
Section 2: Motor and Cognitive Development
Section 3: Erikson’s Stages of Psychosocial Development
Section 4: Freud’s Stages of Psychosexual Development
Section 5: Freud's Structural and Topographical Model
Section 6: Freud's Ego Defense Mechanisms
Section 7: Kohlberg’s Stages of Moral Development
Section 2: Motor and Cognitive Development
Section 3: Erikson’s Stages of Psychosocial Development
Section 4: Freud’s Stages of Psychosexual Development
Section 5: Freud's Structural and Topographical Model
Section 6: Freud's Ego Defense Mechanisms
Section 7: Kohlberg’s Stages of Moral Development
Freud's Structural and Topographical Models of Personality
Sigmund Freud's Theory is quite complex and although his writings on psychosexual development set the groundwork for how our personalities developed, it was only one of five parts to his overall theory of personality. He also believed that different driving forces develop during these stages which play an important role in how we interact with the world.
Structural Model (id, ego, superego)
According to Freud, we are born with our Id. The id is an important part of our personality because as newborns, it allows us to get our basic needs met. Freud believed that the id is based on our pleasure principle. In other words, the id wants whatever feels good at the time, with no consideration for the reality of the situation. When a child is hungry, the id wants food, and therefore the child cries. When the child needs to be changed, the id cries. When the child is uncomfortable, in pain, too hot, too cold, or just wants attention, the id speaks up until his or her needs are met.
The id doesn't care about reality, about the needs of anyone else, only its own satisfaction. If you think about it, babies are not real considerate of their parents' wishes. They have no care for time, whether their parents are sleeping, relaxing, eating dinner, or bathing. When the id wants something, nothing else is important.
Within the next three years, as the child interacts more and more with the world, the second part of the personality begins to develop. Freud called this part the Ego. The ego is based on the reality principle. The ego understands that other people have needs and desires and that sometimes being impulsive or selfish can hurt us in the long run. Its the ego's job to meet the needs of the id, while taking into consideration the reality of the situation.
By the age of five, or the end of the phallic stage of development, the Superego develops. The Superego is the moral part of us and develops due to the moral and ethical restraints placed on us by our caregivers. Many equate the superego with the conscience as it dictates our belief of right and wrong.
In a healthy person, according to Freud, the ego is the strongest so that it can satisfy the needs of the id, not upset the superego, and still take into consideration the reality of every situation. Not an easy job by any means, but if the id gets too strong, impulses and self gratification take over the person's life. If the superego becomes to strong, the person would be driven by rigid morals, would be judgmental and unbending in his or her interactions with the world. You'll learn how the ego maintains control as you continue to read.
Topographical Model
Freud believed that the majority of what we experience in our lives, the underlying emotions, beliefs, feelings, and impulses are not available to us at a conscious level. He believed that most of what drives us is buried in our unconscious. If you remember the Oedipus and Electra Complex, they were both pushed down into the unconscious, out of our awareness due to the extreme anxiety they caused. While buried there, however, they continue to impact us dramatically according to Freud.
The final part is the preconscious or subconscious. This is the part of us that we can access if prompted, but is not in our active conscious. Its right below the surface, but still buried somewhat unless we search for it. Information such as our telephone number, some childhood memories, or the name of your best childhood friend is stored in the preconscious.
Because the unconscious is so large, and because we are only aware of the very small conscious at any given time, this theory has been likened to an iceberg, where the vast majority is buried beneath the water's surface. The water, by the way, would represent everything that we are not aware of, have not experienced, and that has not been integrated into our personalities, referred to as the nonconscious.
curiosity,
I was saying the absense of "self" is similar to grover's discussion on ego.
I say love is instictual (and thus at a subconscious level).
But now that you have brought Freud into this (by the way, I am not a Freudian but do respect his work) the concept of there not being a "you" extends directly into what is reality (or more importantly what it is not). It is a systems, physics, and physchological inqiry into existance. It really is a topic for another thread entirely.
I was saying the absense of "self" is similar to grover's discussion on ego.
I say love is instictual (and thus at a subconscious level).
But now that you have brought Freud into this (by the way, I am not a Freudian but do respect his work) the concept of there not being a "you" extends directly into what is reality (or more importantly what it is not). It is a systems, physics, and physchological inqiry into existance. It really is a topic for another thread entirely.
CaracalKid
Interesting - we should have another thread CK....
Absence of love or as you write absence of self (you)......can mean a number of things:
Impaired thought or mental disease: (for love is a natural emotion to most healthy minds) or...
Love thoughts replaced by: hate, anger, fear, , etc. etc.
Re Freud - I have always thought the guy was a bit over the edge - but at least he was organized in his
thinking and teaching - easier to follow than some.
Interesting - we should have another thread CK....
Absence of love or as you write absence of self (you)......can mean a number of things:
Impaired thought or mental disease: (for love is a natural emotion to most healthy minds) or...
Love thoughts replaced by: hate, anger, fear, , etc. etc.
Re Freud - I have always thought the guy was a bit over the edge - but at least he was organized in his
thinking and teaching - easier to follow than some.
Well keep up the good work then. Maybe you could figure out a way to convince the bank that my debt is not real but just an illusion.
Cheers
Well keep up the good work then. Maybe you could figure out a way to convince the bank that my debt is not real but just an illusion.
indeed.
I challenge you to prove you are real (exist)!
I posit you can not.
Indeed, something philosophers have been wrestling with for a long time...
Proof that I exist - you should see all the empty beer bottles in my back shed. Beers don't drink themselves!