Ontario Liberals plan to hike taxes on high incomes, tobacco and aviation fuel

[captain morgan]

It would seem there are more people that think blankly cutting taxes solves a problem rather than those that think raising them does.

There are times when it will do more good.... If you want to attract and keep large employers, they need (and actively shop) for places that won't perpetually use them as an ATM

There are too few of us who have an honest discussion about what to raise, keep, or lower because the loudest voices are the ones that just shout cut cut cut without any consideration of the consequence.

Too much ideology to have that discussion. Further, the tax base needs to accommodate the basics of a community, not every pet project deemed necessary by the vocal lobby groups.

This comes down to priorities an simple economics - If you can't pay for it, there needs to be an honest discussion if you need it (Infrastructure notwithstanding)

Tell me how many times you hear anyone say tax tax tax.

When was the last time that gvt actually listened to the 'tax cut' crowd AND did something that had meaning?

 

[BruSan]

Leftists like Ford?

It would seem there are more people that think blankly cutting taxes solves a problem rather than those that think raising them does.

There are too few of us who have an honest discussion about what to raise, keep, or lower because the loudest voices are the ones that just shout cut cut cut without any consideration of the consequence.

Tell me how many times you hear anyone say tax tax tax.

We agree here. How does one go about inducing people to responsibly save for their retirement? A frank and open discussion revolving around some form of incentive that includes us either shouldering some costs or paying out welfare later when all of these irresponsible people hit the wall of mandatory retirement age.


We encourage these azzhats by flocking to the one promising the moon without explaining where all this moola is going to come from.


Surely even the thickest of frontal lobes realizes the Fram Filter man made a lot of sense decades ago.


A government showing some hutzpa and discussing with the electorate what programs need cutting to focus on those that are priorities to the majority in an effort to restrict inevitable tax increases to the minimum, would go light years towards encouraging some logic from voters.

 

[mentalfloss]

BREAKING!!!

NDP are going to vote against Liberal budget.

Election incoming.

 

[captain morgan]

BREAKING!!!

NDP are going to vote against Liberal budget.

Election incoming.

Smart move by the NDP... Going right for the throat

 

[mentalfloss]

I don't think it's a smart move (for them) as this will likely result in a PC majority.

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

Where does this fit in with the discussion of assuming only 'leftists' raise taxes?

Probably the same way Ford fits in with the provincial Lieberals.

 

[captain morgan]

I don't think it's a smart move (for them) as this will likely result in a PC majority.

That all depends on the policies and the caliber of the representatives (yeah, don't laugh).

The banner under which these individuals fly is meaningless, it's the policies and degree (if any) of sincerity that they have

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

I don't think it's a smart move (for them) as this will likely result in a PC majority.

Better than what we have now.

 

[BruSan]

Better than what we have now.

Yeah the NDP have now stated that they cannot support the Lib's for all the reasons that have been visible to everyone else for over two years but took them two full years to decide today to use as their reason for non-support of a budget. Great logic there; Dippers.


They've just handed Hudak the reins. He's going to appear with his "I told you so and I've been the only one telling you so and now you agree with me," NDP was already ripped by the press with questions like "why did it take you so long to come to this conclusion when Hudak has been out there ripping the Lib's over these things forever"?


Horvath did not come off as forthright at all but interspersed her offering with repetitive pablum worthy of a fourth grader when pressed with a : "why now and not then"?.

 

[mentalfloss]

I would have thought that this budget hit all the right NDP notes but apparently it was not the case.

They must feel that Hudak is such a masterful blunder that they can avoid him getting a majority.

Are the NDP dumb enough to think they can get a minority???

And if the Libs get another minority then they will look even dumber.

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

I would have thought that this budget hit all the right NDP notes but apparently it was not the case.

They must feel that Hudak is such a masterful blunder that they can avoid him from getting a majority.

Are the NDP dumb enough to think they can get a minority???

Playing devil's advocate, looking at the how this would have played if they accepted the budget, people's perceptions would have been tainted that both Wyn and the NDP as one and the same. All the incompetance and corruption equally shared. Hudak would have tried to re-enfoce this (he will likely still try).

I think the NDP chose between a rock and a hard place. Remains to be seen which is which.

 

[mentalfloss]

Except in the long run, it is the budget that suited the parties that made up a majority of the electorate. It would have reinforced cooperation and democracy at the same time.

Let's be honest.

At this stage, the Libs and NDP almost everywhere in the country are really quite similar.

 

[lone wolf]

Better than what we have now.

It might be if they had good leadership. Hudak isn't it. His body language tattles on him

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

Except in the long run, it is the budget that suited the parties that made up a majority of the electorate. It would have reinforced cooperation and democracy at the same time.

Let's be honest.

At this stage, the Libs and NDP almost everywhere in the country are really quite similar.

It's hard to tell with the Libs, They tend to move around searching for the ideology that suits them for the moment. Sometimes they are like the NDP other times they are more like the Tories. You just never know what you will get when you elect them. They usually change the moment the ballots are counted too.

I find the NDP to be more consistent although even they are different. The Saskatchewan NDP governments actually balanced the budgets and were much more true to the original Tommy Douglas philosophy that if you owed money to people you couldn't implement the social programs you wanted since you would be at the mercy of your creditors. That fiscal restraint has not been present in other NDP governments or platforms I have seen.

 

[lone wolf]

Any good lefty knows that raising taxes will improve any economy.

Again you're talking out your hat. I've come to expect that of you.

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

It might be if they had good leadership. Hudak isn't it. His body language tattles on him

I wish they (the PCs) had taken the opportunity to clean house after the last election defeat. He took a winnable election and turned it into another Lieberal win. I think this time that task is even impossible for him (I hope).

 

[lone wolf]

I think Vic Fideli has what it takes. Hudak should walk the plank. He's a Harris left-over who chaired the exact same Ministry as Rick Bartolucci does now in Harris' attack on Ontario Northland.

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

It would appear Wyn isn't even gonna wait for her budget to be defeated. Pretty clear now she wants an election now and all this has been a charade in order to get it. I guess she indends to try to steal NDP support with this budget.

 

[BornRuff]

It would appear Wyn isn't even gonna wait for her budget to be defeated. Pretty clear now she wants an election now and all this has been a charade in order to get it. I guess she indends to try to steal NDP support with this budget.

What do you mean by that? Do you think that they could have done more to court NDP support?

I think that the Ontario Pension Plan idea is going to be pretty toxic for them in an election. The idea makes some sense, but forcing people to pay more money is never an easy sell, especially when it goes towards something that people don't really know or understand yet.

 

[IdRatherBeSkiing]

What do you mean by that? Do you think that they could have done more to court NDP support?

I think that the Ontario Pension Plan idea is going to be pretty toxic for them in an election. The idea makes some sense, but forcing people to pay more money is never an easy sell, especially when it goes towards something that people don't really know or understand yet.

I just read news item that she is speaking to lt gov now to disolve legislature and call election.

I like the idea of making one and having employers match but to make it mandatory is stupid. Also it reaks of only being there to save government money later on.