Government kills independent science body

[captain morgan]

Well this certainly explains why we go around in circles most threads.

The reason why we go around in circles is based on the highly speculative nature of your principle position... It gets shot full of holes and all you are left with is the sensationalist headlines posted from 'studies'.

I wouldn't assume that this disease is something that is extremely prevalent right now.

That's why there are studies to determine if it is in it's infancy stages.

The mfg sector in Canada and the US have been on the decline for 35 years... Hardly an infant, wouldn't you say?

6. Conclusion
Common perception about the oil sand extraction from Alberta often underlines the opposition
between economic benefits and environment costs. This view nevertheless neglects the fact
that the economics of the tar sands has its own dark side. The dark side is the Dutch disease
associated to increase in oil revenues and proceeds from the extraction of other primary products.
One possible outcome is that the losers are regionally located in Southern Ontario and Quebec,
which in turn might increase regional frictions and fragmentation in a country that is highly
decentralized.
​

I don't see how this has any relevance in why the mfg sector in the West is in a growth mode and the observation that it is shrinking in Ontario.

Mfg in Ontario already has the infrastructure and the distribution/logistical considerations in place. Looks to me like this is a case of companies remaining in a dying industry and not taking the leap to retool and service the growth sectors.

 

[petros]

 

[mentalfloss]

Stuff already said.

Read the report.

 

[petros]

The reason why we go around in circles is based on the highly speculative nature of your principle position... It gets shot full of holes and all you are left with is the sensationalist headlines posted from 'studies'.



The mfg sector in Canada and the US have been on the decline for 35 years... Hardly an infant, wouldn't you say?



I don't see how this has any relevance in why the mfg sector in the West is in a growth mode and the observation that it is shrinking in Ontario.

Mfg in Ontario already has the infrastructure and the distribution/logistical considerations in place. Looks to me like this is a case of companies remaining in a dying industry and not taking the leap to retool and service the growth sectors.

35 years you say. 15 years before investment in oil sands. How the hell did that happen?

http://www.irpp.org/pubs/IRPPstudy/IRPP_Study_no30.pdf
Read the report.

I did. Not single word of "oil sands", just a strong dollar.

 

[Tonington]

I sure did but for some strange reason nobody can explain the decline of manufacturing when oil was $50bbl and output in Canadian oil far lower 10 years ago.

How did that happen?

See, now it's just plain obvious that you didn't read the paper. They discussed other factors, and it must have slipped your mind that the authors never claimed resource prices could explain 100% of manufacturing job losses, which your question is implicitly assuming. Lame strawman, even for you.

 

[petros]

See, now it's just plain obvious that you didn't read the paper. They discussed other factors, and it must have slipped your mind that the authors never claimed resource prices could explain 100% of manufacturing job losses, which your question is implicitly assuming. Lame strawman, even for you.

Where does it mention oil sands?

In the same time frame what happened to the price of gold, nickel and copper?

 

[captain morgan]

Now that was a pretty divisive statement, wasn't it?

Just keeping up in the spirit of Mulcair

35 years you say. 15 years before investment in oil sands. How the hell did that happen?

It's almost as if it were black magic

 

[petros]

It's almost as if it were black magic

You'd think so. Maybe ON should buy a voo-doo doll depicting western canada.

 

[mentalfloss]

Where does it mention oil sands?

In the same time frame what happened to the price of gold, nickel and copper?

Did you read Tonnington's clip from the report?

Oh wait, of course you didn't.

Just like you didn't read the report.

 

[captain morgan]

Did you read Tonnington's clip from the report?

Oh wait, of course you didn't.

Just like you didn't read the report.

Does reading a flawed, highly speculative report based entirely on theoretical constructs magically transform it into fact?

 

[mentalfloss]

Does reading a flawed, highly speculative report based entirely on theoretical constructs magically transform it into fact?

Does the fact that a Harper appointed committee admitting there elements of dutch disease make you feel uncomfortable?

 

[Tonington]

Where does it mention oil sands?

Go back through the thread, I already pasted it for you once.

Would it help if I explain to you the difference between the report and it's abstract, and how you can find the report without paying the $31 fee to Elsevier for the .pdf?

 

[mentalfloss]

Go back through the thread, I already pasted it for you once.

Would it help if I explain to you the difference between the report and it's abstract, and how you can find the report without paying the $31 fee to Elsevier for the .pdf?

I linked it already for them, but they're ignoring it.

Here it is again.

 

[Tonington]

I linked it already for them, but they're ignoring it.

Here it is again.

Actually, that isn't the paper that was published in Resource and Energy Economics.

 

[captain morgan]

Does the fact that a Harper appointed committee admitting there elements of dutch disease make you feel uncomfortable?

Not in the least - dutch disease (if it in fact actually exists) has been a real boon in Western Canada

 

[mentalfloss]

Actually, that isn't the paper that was published in Resource and Energy Economics.

Ah. I thought we were talking about the newer, more conservative friendly report which also mentions the oilsands and dutch disease.

Not in the least - dutch disease (if it in fact actually exists) has been a real boon in Western Canada

So you're admitting that you like dividing Canada? rofl

 

[petros]

I linked it already for them, but they're ignoring it.

Here it is again.

Did you read this part or are just ignoring it?


Canada's strong dollar has hurt 25 per cent of total factory output and that cyclical factors and global competition are mostly to blame for the decline in factory production in Canada over the last decade

No oil sands? WTF?

 

[mentalfloss]

Did you read this part or are just ignoring it?


Canada's strong dollar has hurt 25 per cent of total factory output and that cyclical factors and global competition are mostly to blame for the decline in factory production in Canada over the last decade

No oil sands? WTF?

Hello? McFly?

Where do you think our resource boom will come from?

According to the Dutch disease theory, part of the revenues from the boom is spent on nontradable goods (mainly services), leading to an appreciation of the real exchange rate. This in turn draws resources out of tradable-goods sectors (primarily manufacturing) and into the nontradable sector, to the extent that this tradable sector is exposed to international competition.

On balance, the evidence indicates that Canada suffers from a mild case of the Dutch disease, which warrants a commensurate policy response

 

[captain morgan]

So you're admitting that you like dividing Canada? rofl

Wrong again Flossy. I am recognizing that Mulcair is positioning himself as such and that the so-called dutch disease you have hung your hat on is a hollow argument that magically applies to mfgrs East on Manitoba but exempts the mfgrs in Western Canada








BTW - I'm a little curious, those service related entities that heartlessly steal discretionary income from Ontario's mfg sector; do they somehow not buy products that (conceivably) are made in Ontario?

 

[mentalfloss]

Obviously the biggest manufacturing sectors get hit hardest.

I don't agree with Mulcair that the number #1 reason for the manufacturing decline is dutch disease, btw.