Aboriginal water...

CDNBear

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Sep 24, 2006
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I would have if what we were having was a debate. I fail to see why you can't grasp that what we are doing isn't debating. You are not a good debater. You are entertaining. I really wonder sometimes, how often I have to say this before it sinks in. You try and debate like this is a televised debate. Perhaps that is your biggest problem.
Why do you invest so much emotion in this, if it's just for entertainment purposes?
 

CDNBear

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I'm sure you see it that way, but racial slurs, generalized bigotry, throwing you proclaimed standards to the wind, expending great amounts of effort, all forms of emotional outcry. It all says you have an emotional attachment to the issue. If you didn't, you'd simply post the proof, embarrass me and be done with it.
 

cranky

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Cannuck

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Iyou'd simply post the proof, embarrass me and be done with it.

It is impossible for me to prove, on a web forum, what I personally believe. One would think that a good debater would understand such a simple concept. Just more evidence I guess, that you aren't near the debater you thought you were.
 

CDNBear

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It is impossible for me to prove, on a web forum, what I personally believe. One would think that a good debater would understand such a simple concept. Just more evidence I guess, that you aren't near the debater you thought you were.
And you need that to be true to validate yourself? There's that emotional connection again.

Having some training, since I started working with at risk youth. You seem to expend an unhealthy amount of energy trying to convince others, that you're here for entertainment, but get so upset when the, for lack of a better term, game pieces, best you.

I think you lie to yourself more than you lie to anyone else.

How else could you justify having such exacting and superior standards, only to through them to the wind when you feel threatened.
 

Cannuck

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And you need that to be true to validate yourself?

I'm sure you believe that. If it were true, however, it would be the same across the board. Since my approach is not the same with Karrie, Ron, Tonnington, Ten Penny and many others, your belief is not backed up by the evidence (I understand evidence is very important to you).

As for "exacting and superior standards", I don't have them. That's why I'm here chit chatting with you (well, that and the golf course isn't open yet)
 

CDNBear

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I'm sure you believe that. If it were true, however, it would be the same across the board. Since my approach is not the same with Karrie, Ron, Tonnington, Ten Penny and many others, your belief is not backed up by the evidence (I understand evidence is very important to you).

As for "exacting and superior standards", I don't have them. That's why I'm here chit chatting with you (well, that and the golf course isn't open yet)
Yes, there does seem to be a disturbing pattern to your focused energy and emotion. That, coupled with the emotional outcry of lies you conjure, to disparage all First nations. Surely does paint a disturbing picture of what you really are.
 

cranky

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It is impossible for me to prove, on a web forum, what I personally believe. One would think that a good debater would understand such a simple concept. Just more evidence I guess, that you aren't near the debater you thought you were.

proof on a forum is simple. keep your claims reasonable and believable, and when they aren't then you keep them supported by a ton of claims that are reasonable and believable. are you up for the challenge?
 

CDNBear

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proof on a forum is simple. keep your claims reasonable and believable, and when they aren't then you keep them supported by a ton of claims that are reasonable and believable. are you up for the challenge?
No offence cranky. But...

1, Look who you're asking.
2, He believes what he says is reasonable and believable.

He's just going to say the same things over and over. Like he said before "round and round".

That's all he has. Despite his constant protestations, and "I get along with this person and that", he simply can't attack this issue with a clear and reasoned approach. hence the world of make believe he uses to try and shout others down.

Remember though, it's all just an act.
 
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CDNBear

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Sep 24, 2006
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Yeah. I can't get past the flames to find the root of the thread.
I think that was Cannucks intent. He has a serious issue with Natives and the First Nations.

The topic is water quality on some reservations. The who, what, where and why's.

It has been claimed, with no evidence, that in the case of Kashechewa, the First Nations were trained, but to lazy to do the job, with parts on hand. I've asked repeatedly for some form of evidence to back that up, but all we have seen is word games and fallacy. Mixed with more bigoted commentary.

In 2008, there were over 1700 boil-water advisories across Canada, a third being in BC, and only 97 on reserves throughout Canada.

Although I do not rule out human error, much of the issue is caused by natural occurrences, poor planning, over taxed systems, a lack of training, and resource gaps.
 

petros

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Nov 21, 2008
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Well that makes much more sense.

Water quality is indeed a huge problem for all of us. No it's not immediate human error responsible. The ground water is horrid to begin with and rating systems aren't bacteria specific but use a generic test for coliforms of all types. Even if they were rated under 30ppm for total coliforms, e coli can make up the bulk of that rating and cause big troubles.

The majority of small town or municipal water supply treatment systems are out dated and can't keep with high demand or spikes in contaminants.

Water quality is an issue that govt after govt after govt have continued to drop the ball on.

There is currently money available in the Action Plan for water treatment and for what they are giving out to do RO conversions is 10X the amount actually needed to update a town treatment facility.

I wouldn't mind getting in on the "Action"....
 

CDNBear

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Sep 24, 2006
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Well that makes much more sense.

Water quality is indeed a huge problem for all of us. No it's not immediate human error responsible. The ground water is horrid to begin with and rating systems aren't bacteria specific but use a generic test for coliforms of all types. Even if they were rated under 30ppm for total coliforms, e coli can make up the bulk of that rating and cause big troubles.

The majority of small town or municipal water supply treatment systems are out dated and can't keep with high demand or spikes in contaminants.

Water quality is an issue that govt after govt after govt have continued to drop the ball on.

There is currently money available in the Action Plan for water treatment and for what they are giving out to do RO conversions is 10X the amount actually needed to update a town treatment facility.

I wouldn't mind getting in on the "Action"....
It would make sense, to get in on the action, and in some communities, they are doing just that.

One of the problems I've noted, is the fact that during the education grant process, many Councils, have a tendency to lean or push, applicants in directions they are either not in sync with, or are not necessarily in the best interest of acute issues in the community.

Take my youngest for instance. He's being groomed to be a mentor with at risk Native youth. He's 15, but has been offered a grant to further his education in any field pertaining to social work. It doesn't necessarily matter that he is good with his hands and loves robotics, and cooking. Two fields he showed such interest in, that we decided to pay $100/month, from our own pockets, to send him to a school, outside our catchment area.

Sure, he's good with people, and has been an accidental (Since he only entered the program, because I have guardianship of a youth that was enrolled in the program) guiding influence with the youth in the program that brought him to the attention of the elders in the wifes community. As one of the elders remarked to me, "That boy could make friends with the Devil", lol.

This is by no means an isolated case, and I can understand the ideology behind guiding youth into programs that can benefit the community at large. But I have seen a trend in focusing on social fields, as apposed to technical fields. Both are worth while, but an emphasis needs to be placed on both.
 

Cannuck

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Feb 2, 2006
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I think that was Cannucks intent. He has a serious issue with Natives and the First Nations.

Nope. I have a serious issue with inequality before the law. You have chosen to attack me personally because of my concerns. That is because you understand that your position is indefensible unless you agree with inequality before the law. I understand this and accept it fully. Attack away.....
 

petros

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Nov 21, 2008
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Inequality in water rights? Where? How? A rez is a municipality and has no more access to infrastructure funding than any other municipality.

This is by no means an isolated case, and I can understand the ideology behind guiding youth into programs that can benefit the community at large. But I have seen a trend in focusing on social fields, as apposed to technical fields. Both are worth while, but an emphasis needs to be placed on both.
In these parts the push is on to get the youth into trades and hospitality which is great but without guidance within their peers, motivation and deciding on a path can be troubling for many.

Finding and developing youth leaders isn't exactly easy but I don't think he'd be too impressed with how they'd ask him to manipulate others with subterfuge that govt programs are based on.
 

CDNBear

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Sep 24, 2006
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Nope. I have a serious issue with inequality before the law. You have chosen to attack me personally because of my concerns. That is because you understand that your position is indefensible unless you agree with inequality before the law. I understand this and accept it fully. Attack away.....
That's just another lie.

You've already stated, you're here for your amusement, and made your bigotry a clear part of your emotional position.

In these parts the push is on to get the youth into trades and hospitality which is great but without guidance within their peers, motivation and deciding on a path can be troubling for many.
This is true.

Finding and developing youth leaders isn't exactly easy but I don't think he'd be too impressed with how they'd ask him to manipulate others with subterfuge that govt programs are based on.
That's why I try and temper what he's being tought. I agree with the premise of the program, not with the entirety of the positions communicated.

My biggest disagreement is with the chapter on "Living within a colonial system". This part simply validates the absurdity that is "Whitey is out to get me".