Do The Conservatives Deserve Another Chance?

[JLM]

Nah, all of what you said could be contracted out or done through charities.

Heck, we could even contract out some police and use volenteers for firefighting instead of having some over paid union slob sitting in a fire house watching his flat screen waiting for the bell to ring.

We've got to reduce our debt and taxes right?

No one is spared.

If seniors can't afford their heating bills then they should sell their homes.

So is there anything that can't be contracted out or done by charities? Hell there is even dental service in Vernon donated by a dentist(s) so the street people can have their teeth attended to. (And there probably isn't much wrong with that) I'm certainly not a champion of Unions and have never personally needed one, but I was a Union member for about 25 years because the democratic bretheren gave me no choice, not to mention extracting dues out of me - and YES I suppose I did a get a "benefit" or two- possibly paid for by me and others like me a dozen times over.

 

[Machjo]

A brief look at Harper's 'economic stimulus'

$138 billion to the banks(more like 500 billion by the end of 2011). Through CMHC the government so far has bought $138 billion worth of high risk / high ratio mortgages from the banks in order to 'free up more credit' for the people who already have crippling debt loads.

15% corporate tax rate. Give the corporations more profit because this will allow the general population to spend more money...NOT!

Tax Free Day for corporations. There is a plan in the works, at the behest of major corps and banks to allow them to repatriate all their hidden offshore profits into Canada tax free. Most conservitive estimates put the tax revenue loss at around $95 billion.

As someone who has studied economics I have to call bull****. the way to stimulate any economy is from the bottom up. If you give the consumers more disposable income and they will spend it thus generating more demand for products and services which in turn allows for job creation to keep up with the increased demand and generates more tax revenue due to increased amount of transactions.

It's not rocket science, it is economics 101.

Oh don't talk about the bailouts. Harper was the most palatable on that front in that he seemed the most opposed to them of all the party leaders at least. I'm disappointed he caved in on that front. But even with that, I acknowledge that democracy is the will of the majority and the majority of the House and Canadians seemed to support it so not much we could do about it.

But then on military spending, Harper spent like a drunken sailor at a brothel.

 

[Durry]

But then on military spending, Harper spent like a drunken sailor at a brothel.

Well the Libs left the mitary in shambles, it had to be corrected. My guess is, if Harper had not improved the military, we would have lost a lot more Canadians than we did.

 

[JLM]

Oh don't talk about the bailouts. Harper was the most palatable on that front in that he seemed the most opposed to them of all the party leaders at least. I'm disappointed he caved in on that front. But even with that, I acknowledge that democracy is the will of the majority and the majority of the House and Canadians seemed to support it so not much we could do about it.

But then on military spending, Harper spent like a drunken sailor at a brothel.

Not so fast- if we are not safe, what's the use of any social programs? You don't think for a second that 9/11 was the end of the bastards from the Middle East? :smile:

And they are just one of any number of examples.

 

[PoliticalNick]

Well the Libs left the mitary in shambles, it had to be corrected. My guess is, if Harper had not improved the military, we would have lost a lot more Canadians than we did.

And if we had stayed home instead of following American fear mongers and oil barons around the world spreading democracy through force and violence while raping the natural resources of soveriegn countries we wouldn't have lost any or spent billions of $.

Not so fast- if we are not safe, what's the use of any social programs? You don't think for a second that 9/11 was the end of the bastards from the Middle East? :smile:

And they are just one of any number of examples.

Not safe from the middle east? To take a page from other people's books around here where's the proof that the ME is coming to invade us?

 

[Unforgiven]

The cost of food rent and clothing has gone up, Gas and heating oil is through the roof. HST on everything isn't making life the lest bit easier. Many people lost their jobs and many more didn't get a raise because of the recession, so why do banks and oil companies need tax breaks with profits of over a billion dollars a quarter? Why do we need really top notch jets to defend people in Libya while people here get to walk to the food bank, sit even longer now in the hall way of a hospital waiting for a doctor to be freed up to treat them?

Why do we need a 1.3 billion dollar party for Harper and the G20 leaders that gives an excuse to come to Toronto and riot, then visit the worse authoritarian bungle upon the heads of peaceful and legitimate protesters voicing their opinion legally only so that the bogus charges can be dropped or thrown out of court?

What good has that done the country?

 

[Omicron]

The federal Conservatives of Canada are running for re-election and they are asking for another chance to lead this great country of ours.

If Canadians were to look at their record as a government, did the Conservatives keep their promises or break them?

Nope.

They crossed the line when they did the Contempt of Parliament, pure and simple.

You can debate the relative merits of subjective ideologies all you want, but Contempt of Parliament is one degree of separation from treason to the ship of state, and that's an absolute no-no.

Back in the day, that would have been license for the Monarch to march into the House and seize back the reigns of power on grounds the people had proven themselves unworthy of the task.

 

[Machjo]

Not so fast- if we are not safe, what's the use of any social programs? You don't think for a second that 9/11 was the end of the bastards from the Middle East? :smile:

And they are just one of any number of examples.

That is a police matter. If you want to prevent a person from hijacking a plane, you introduce appropriate security at the airport, not send more soldiers abroad. I honestly don't see the connection between sending soldiers abroad and keeping a terrorist off of a plane.

I'm not against war per se if there is a valid reason, but I also don't see why we could not use some imagination and perhaps promote the formation of some kind of international police force. That way multiple countries could all pitch in financially to support one military force so as to eliminate duplication of tasks.

 

[Unforgiven]

Well the Libs left the mitary in shambles, it had to be corrected. My guess is, if Harper had not improved the military, we would have lost a lot more Canadians than we did.

Well certainly not ready for Afghanistan but that came as a surprise. Of course paying penalties for canceling purchases doesn't help the military budget. Having no defined direction we want our military to move in, we run that risk of back and forth.

We don't have the ability or the capacity to be the US and act as the world's police man. We do have the ability to defend our borders and enforce our rights to all areas of Canada if we would just stop going back and forth for a couple decades so we would build our forces up for that job.

We can perform other duties like managing refugees, support roles and aid to countries that suffer under hardship while those countries like France, Germany, Britain, and the US go where they feel they need to in order to bring peace to the world. That is what we're good at and what we can sustain in the long run.

So let's stop pretending we're something we're not and instead play a smart game.

 

[Durry]

And if we had stayed home instead of following American fear mongers and oil barons around the world spreading democracy through force and violence while raping the natural resources of soveriegn countries we wouldn't have lost any or spent s?

Raping what natural resources in afgan, cocain?
What oil, in afgan.
We were doing our part as part of the UN.

We can perform other duties like managing refugees, support roles and aid to countries that suffer under hardship while those countries like France, Germany, Britain, and the US go where they feel they need to in order to bring peace to the world. That is what we're good at and what we can sustain in the long run.

So let's stop pretending we're something we're not and instead play a smart game.

As long as we are part of the UN, we must carry our share of the load.

 

[Unforgiven]

As long as we are part of the UN, we must carry our share of the load.

We can choose what we want to do and that can be good enough for the UN or not.

 

[PoliticalNick]

Raping what natural resources in afgan, cocain?
What oil, in afgan.
We were doing our part as part of the UN.


As long as we are part of the UN, we must carry our share of the load.

What was it 1-2 days after installing Karzai as president he signed a deal to build 3 pipelines through Afghan, built not by Afganis but by Halliburton and controlled by the US.

And just for fun... under the Taliban opium production had fallen to less than 10 tons/yr, since the invasion it is now about 95 tons/yr. Gotta keep the American public drugged and asleep while you take away their rights and steal their money you know.

I am more than happy to pull out of the UN and their global government ideals.

 

[Avro]

So is there anything that can't be contracted out or done by charities? Hell there is even dental service in Vernon donated by a dentist(s) so the street people can have their teeth attended to. (And there probably isn't much wrong with that) I'm certainly not a champion of Unions and have never personally needed one, but I was a Union member for about 25 years because the democratic bretheren gave me no choice, not to mention extracting dues out of me - and YES I suppose I did a get a "benefit" or two- possibly paid for by me and others like me a dozen times over.

Nope, even the military can be, Americans have done it.

Take an axe to the entire public service, open up all public contracts to open tender and ban unions once and for all.

That will save us billions.

 

[Unforgiven]

What was it 1-2 days after installing Karzai as president he signed a deal to build 3 pipelines through Afghan, built not by Afganis but by Halliburton and controlled by the US.

Yeah this thing is, that pipeline had to be built. The region will be better for having that pipeline and so will the other countries that don't have to rely on Russia to move the product to market.

And just for fun... under the Taliban opium production had fallen to less than 10 tons/yr, since the invasion it is now about 95 tons/yr. Gotta keep the American public drugged and asleep while you take away their rights and steal their money you know.

Nah it's proven that those who do Heroin are going to do it and though who don't aren't about to start. It's a very small percentage of the American public.

I am more than happy to pull out of the UN and their global government ideals.

For sure it would be the UN's loss. But we are a reasonable and negotiating culture, pulling away from the table is only a temporary tactic to negotiation. Thus, we could never leave altogether. I understand the sentiment though.

 

[Durry]

I am more than happy to pull out of the UN and their global government ideals.

That's a choice Canadians have.
I'm one who is not in favor of this idea.

 

[Unforgiven]

Nope, even the military can be, Americans have done it.

Take an axe to the entire public service, open up all public contracts to open tender and ban unions once and for all.

That will save us billions.

Yeah but then as profit margins take hold, service and quality control start the inevitable slide and we end up paying for half price sh!t. Sh1t is still sh1t even when it's on sale.

 

[JLM]

And if we had stayed home instead of following American fear mongers and oil barons around the world spreading democracy through force and violence while raping the natural resources of soveriegn countries we wouldn't have lost any or spent billions of $.



Not safe from the middle east? To take a page from other people's books around here where's the proof that the ME is coming to invade us?[/QUOTE]

Why would you need proof? Do you need proof that your house is going to burn down before installing smoke detectors or buying fire insurance?

 

[Avro]

Yeah but then as profit margins take hold, service and quality control start the inevitable slide and we end up paying for half price sh!t. Sh1t is still sh1t even when it's on sale.

We're geting sh*t for full price now.

Good thing about opening it up is if you don't like what you are getting you replace them.

Try to get rid of a union slob....almost impossible.

 

[Unforgiven]

We're geting sh*t for full price now.

Good thing about opening it up is if you don't like what you are getting you replace them.

Try to get rid of a union slob....almost impossible.

Because we treat it like a political football. Replacing people too fast creates a worse problem. While you need to have professional development, you have to allow for some slack. For too much what my job going to do for me and not enough what can I do for my job going on, but there is a remedy for that, it's just not the stick.

 

[JLM]

We're geting sh*t for full price now.

Good thing about opening it up is if you don't like what you are getting you replace them.

Try to get rid of a union slob....almost impossible.

That is both ignorant and offensive. Many jobs are only open to people who will pay the ransom and join the Union. Sometimes a person has been happily working for an outfit for 20 years, when it gets unionized. What is he supposed to do, quit, give up secure employment and seniority? If you want to see the slobs look at the Union executive, not the poor wage slave.