Will Iran be victorious?

MHz

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So if Irnians like to be victorious, they should devote themselves to God alone, and leave the enthusiasm about Ali and his sons and leave the idolatrous customs related to this enthusiasm like the continuous mourning over Hussein and his sons and if they do this, none can overcome them by God's will; or else they will be defeated.


This isn't a battle between the various Holy Books. The battle should be agaianst the one who will finance wars but refuse to make sure the poor are as few in number as possible.
They currently have $500T on the books as 'cash'. Kill 8 million of them and watch how quickly peace come to a pagan world (in that all who are born will die, hopefully from old age). Threaten to kill one of them or kill all their family if they mess up and suddenly things smoooth right out. Neb's kid did the same thing after he got Daniel from the lion's den. It is effective, it is not under the two Laws of the NT. Kill the 'wrong-doer' and their whole family'. Gaza cannot ber justified as long as the holocaust is held as a symbol of what not to do to civilians.

The enemy, or at least the one common one, is death. The enemy of the Banksters is too many people to take care of just their needs.

Jer:31:15:
Thus saith the LORD;
A voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation,
and bitter weeping; Rahel weeping for her children refused to be comforted for her children,
because they were not.
Jer:31:16:
Thus saith the LORD;
Refrain thy voice from weeping,
and thine eyes from tears:
for thy work shall be rewarded,
saith the LORD;
and they shall come again from the land of the enemy.
Jer:31:17:
And there is hope in thine end, saith the LORD,
that thy children shall come again to their own border.

Even with 2/3 of the living Gentiles going to the grave at the time of the return they are still brought into the Kingdom of Heaven at the Great White Throne and they are the one building tings ins that last part of Isaiah 65. The Church isn't going to promote that, Jews certainly aren't going to promote that and 2 out of 3 say Muslims aren't going to promote that either.

The Mid-East is a shell game for the Rothschild type of people in the world. It's about time the world grew up if they expect anything to change to any great degree.

In my life probably more than you would care to hear about.. Currently, probably more than you would care to hear about.

If we have to start somewhere can it be with the court system and why it take more than 20 years to sue a old business partner as soon a 'shady Lawyer' is named. All of a sudden it becomes a 'unmentionable subject'in Court and especially outside of Court.
 

eanassir

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e,

I'm agnostic and skeptical of claims of divine intervention. Can you give an recent example where God intervened on behalf of true believers?

earth_as_one,
Many of Palestinians are atheists and many others are associaters: associating the companions of the Prophet and glorifying the Prophet himself; that is why they will not be victorious at the present moment against their enemy.

When the Palestinans leave their atheism and enthusiasm, God's victory will comefor them; or else all your authentic documents, reports and right evidences will not avail you anything. :thumbup:
 

eanassir

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e,

I'm agnostic and skeptical of claims of divine intervention. Can you give an recent example where God intervened on behalf of true believers?

There are many recent examples of God's help: although Muslims now are not exclusively devoted to God alone, but most of them are ignorant and associate their imams, sheikhs and others together with God.

Examples:
The failure of Napoleon's campaign against Aqqa (Acre)
People and governor of Aqqa (Acre) prayed God to save them from this tyrant: the disbeliever, and a storm came and drowned all his military ships and his campaign against Aqqa (Acre) failed completely.

The extermination of the English army against Sudan in the 19th century. None escaped alive.

The triumph of Ottoman army in Kut in Iraq: the Ottoman army besieged Kut until the English suffered much and surrendered.

The revolution of all people of Iraq in 1920 against the English.

The success of the Arab and Iraq armies in liberating much of Palestine at 1948 before the intervention of the English to save their allies: the Zionists.

And there are many other examples if you search about and investigate.

Therefore, if you see the Arab defeated, know then they are not exclusively devoted to God and God is not with them; but if they return to God alone without associate, then His help to them cannot be impeded and they will be victorious.

<ÕÝÍÉ ÌÏíÏÉ 1
>
 
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Machjo

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If it's a game of backgammon, beware. I had many Persian friends who loved the game. Don't let the Iranian play by the rules of backgammon, or we'll be crushed.
 

eanassir

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So were gods involved when Iraq attacked Iran?

God - be glorified - punishes the idolaters and associaters who associate their idols and other gods besides God Almighty the Creator.

One kind of punishment that He afflicts the associaters is to make them confounded and discensions will take place then wars to let them taste the suffering from each other.

God – be glorified – said in the Quran 6: 65
قُلْ هُوَ الْقَادِرُ عَلَى أَن يَبْعَثَ عَلَيْكُمْ عَذَابًا مِّن فَوْقِكُمْ أَوْ مِن تَحْتِ أَرْجُلِكُمْ أَوْ يَلْبِسَكُمْ شِيَعاً وَيُذِيقَ بَعْضَكُم بَأْسَ بَعْضٍ انظُرْ كَيْفَ نُصَرِّفُ الآيَاتِ لَعَلَّهُمْ يَفْقَهُونَ
The explanation:

(Say [Mohammed to the idolaters]: He [God Almighty] is All-Able to send forth upon you, [associaters,] chastisement

>> from above you [like storms, hurricanes and plagues]

>> or from under your feet [like earthquakes, volcanoes and floods],

>> or to confuse you in sects and to make you suffer of the violence of one another [conflicts and wars will take place.]

Behold [ Mohammed] how We turn about the revelations; haply that they may understand.)
-----------------------------------------

Now, both Iraq and Iran people have much enthusiasm about the family of Prophet Mohammed - salam be to him.

So they glorify his sons and sanctify them and make the servitude shared between
God the Creator and between the imams: the descendents of Ali and Mohammed's daughter.

And because of their enthusiasm, they fell into some idolatry and polytheism, and they deserved God's punishment. The reason for this misguidance is because of their wrong-doing: they wrong each other and they disobeyed the apostle of God while he invited them to devote themselves to God alone.

See about such association with God and polytheism here:

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If it's a game of backgammon, beware. I had many Persian friends who loved the game. Don't let the Iranian play by the rules of backgammon, or we'll be crushed.


It is very serious, Machjo.

The Arab and Muslims are weak and defeated in spite of having the Quran: the word of God; such defeat and deterioration is because of their enthusiasm about their imams and sheikhs and so they are not exclusively devoted to God alone, but they share with Him such righteous men in the worship.

The Arab and Muslims now are like the Children of Israel in the past: inspite of having the Torah of God with them, they were defeated and enslaved because they fell in the idolatry and associated Baal and Astartoth and their religious men with God the Creator.

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Joshua was a righteous man, devoted to God alone; he fought the idolaters and was victorious because God was with him against the idolaters.

While now the situation is reversed: God has not commanded Zionists to occupy Palestine: the Palestinian people now are not idolaters: they believe in God alone and in all His apostles: Moses, Jesus and Mohammed.

And now it is the Zionists that are disbelievers: work against the command of God and transgress on Muslims and the Palestinians in particular.

Their Rebellion against Their Prophet
 
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Dexter Sinister

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What exactly is the struggle you're asking about Iran being victorious at? All I've seen from you so far in this thread is the idea that Muslims should go back to 7th century forms of religious observance and if they do that God will smile upon them and all will be well. I think that's nonsense. It's Taliban thinking, God has turned his face away from us because we've fallen away from the correct forms of observance, and if we fix that God will fix everything else. You'd do better to give up religious belief entirely and take responsibility for yourself, anything else is a delusion.
 

ironsides

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e,

I'm agnostic and skeptical of claims of divine intervention. Can you give an recent example where God intervened on behalf of true believers?

Lets not forget hurricane that struck, helping put out the fires and scattering the British Army as they were trying to burn down the city of Washington (War of 1812). Was it Gods hand forcing the scoundrels back to their ships? Was it divine intervention or dumb luck?
 

eanassir

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eanassir

What exactly do you mean by "victorious?"

What game or war is it they're fighting?

What are the victory conditions?

The Arab countries and the Imperialists and Zionists

All the Arab and Islamic countries now suffer much because of many factors:
internal factors: inside their society and community,
in addition to external factors coming from their enemy: the imperialism and zionism.

These imperialists and zionists aim at occupying the Arab and Muslim countries one after another.

I spoke about a similar subject and you were not here then.

See therefore that following the fall of the Ottomans, the European states occupied the Arab and Islamic countries like this: each state crossed the sea and captured the Arab country facing it on the other side of the Mediterranean Sea:

Italy --> occupied Libya.
France --> occupied Tunisia, Algeria, Moroco and part of Mauritania; in addition to Syria and Lebanon.
England --> occupied Palestine which it offered to the Zionists to establish their Hebrew state on it to the disadvantage of the Palestinian people. In addition, England or GB occupied Iraq, Jordan and the gulf countries.

Now, USA has occupied Afganistan, Iraq and of course it plans to occupy Iran also;

because they have now done the same program they had done against Iraq before: the economic restrictions and punishment ...etc and they accuse Iran as did they accuse Iraq before of the Nuclear weapon.

The Role of the American Imperialism


eanassir

What exactly do you mean by "victorious?"

What game or war is it they're fighting?

What are the victory conditions?


What the West is doing now against Iran

Iran is a powerful Islamic state; and even if I disagree with some customs and acts they do and they work to be enthusiastic concerning the imams and the family of the Prophet.

Iran is a powerful Muslim country in comparison to the rest of the Muslim countries.

Such condition does not suit the imperialists and zionists: they want all Muslim countries to be weak so they can enslave them and exploit their resources.

Zionists on the other hand, does not like such situation: they don't want any Islamic country to be powerful; they have programs to occupy all Palestine in addition to the land from the Nile to the Euphrates and they covet to destroy the Aqsa Mosque at Jerusalem and establish their claimed temple in stead of it.

The plot and design against Iran
Therefore, the imperialists and zionists do the following:
1- to isolate Iran from the other states of the world.
2- to make economic difficulties before the Iranian.
3- to make discensions and conflicts inside the country of Iran in order to weaken it.
4- to create many problems to the government in the name of women rights, and human rights ...etc.
5- to make conflicts and to encourage the opposing parties and organizations against the unity and strength of Iran.
6- In addition to many things that they did before to Iraq before occupying it.
7- The imperialists encourage the enmity and hatred against Iran by the neighboring Arab countries in the name of the Shia and Sunna pretext.
 
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Cliffy

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It seems to me that Islam was spread by Muslim imperialism, was it not? Islam spread out from Arabia into the rest of the world by conquest and people who refused to convert were slaughtered - all the way to the Philippines. I don't think you can be self righteous about fighting American imperialism when you religion is just as guilty of imperialism. The American god, the Zionist god and your god are the same god. Fighting over it is just plain stupid.
 

eanassir

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eanassir

What exactly do you mean by "victorious?"

What game or war is it they're fighting?

What are the victory conditions?

How the Iranians will be victorious

So now it can be that whatever they do: these imperialists and zionists against Iran, they will not be able to overcome it, and the Iranian will be victorious and dignified.

Or it may be their design and plan against Iran will succeed as do they hope, and they will then occupy it and break down its army first of all (as did they do to the Iraq army before.)

And to destroy all its industry and economy; so that the Iranian cannot then impede their plan to support the Arab and the Palestinians, and the Zionists can then destroy the holy mosque the Aqsa mosque at Jerusalem as they think. And as had they done before to Iraq. And to congratulate each other then as did they after occupying Iraq.

The apparent factors of victory: the power of weapon, wealth and international relation and support.

The genuine factors of victory:
The Iranians should be with God alone without associate,
and to abandon their customs of the enthusiasm about the imams and the family of the Prophet;
and then to hold fast with the Quran --> then none can overcome them, but the conditions and circumstances will be to their advantage and to the disadvantage of their enemy.

Comment

====================================================

What the Iranians have to do in order to be victorious

1- to put their trust in God alone without associate.
2-To abandon the enthusiasm about the imams and the family of the Prophet; such enthusiasm leads to the "shirk" or associating these righteous imams with God Almighty.
3- To devote themselves to God alone:
-- ask their needs from God not from the imams.
-- seek the help of God not the help of the imams.
-- expend the alms for God's sake not for the sake of the imams.
-- swear by God alone not by the imams and others.
-- glorify God alone but not to glorify the imams or even the Prophet himself.
-- to build the mosques of God to worship Him alone, and to abandon the graves and shrines which is not commanded in the Quran.

Or else they will not be victorious.

Building the Graves Is a Sin, and Sanctifying Them Is a Kind of Associating Them with God




You mean "Saddam Hussain" and his two Sons "Uday" & "Qusay" ????

People (like many people?) are mourning these characters?


The enthusiasm about Imam Hussein son of Ali

Many of Muslims nowadays have become associaters: they associate the family of Prophet Mohammed and his companions: they associate them with God Almighty in the worship and concepts.

So they loved the imam Hussein so much and they exeggarated in this love until they became enthusiastic about Hussein and his martyrdom.

In fact, imam Hussein himself enjoined on his sister and his family that they should observe the recommendation of Prophet Mohammed that they should not tear their clothes and slap their heads and faces from grieve and sadness; because such a thing will be like objecting to God's decree.

So we love this noble imam, but we should love God more; and the work of the Muslim should be exclusive to God alone not to Hussein or anyone else.

Therefore, the mosque should be dedicated to God alone not to Hussein, and it is forbidden to build the "Husseiniah".

Feeding the food should be to God alone not to Hussein as do some people in Iraq and Iran do.

And even the much mentioning of Hussein is forbidden: it is God that should be mentioned day and night.
Mentioning of God

All of the 20th Century could have been a lame attempt by man to play God. As usual we fall fall short of a perfect score.

For myself, the last 100 years are a conquest for land an riches, end time prophecies are not so subtle and start to finish in years is less than a handful.

MHz,

God - be glorified - has the ownership and soverignty now and everynow.

But most people are unaware of God's signs and every day miracles.

As in the Quran 10: 92
وَإِنَّ كَثِيرًا مِّنَ النَّاسِ عَنْ آيَاتِنَا لَغَافِلُونَ
The explanation:
(But much many of mankind are heedless of Our signs.)

I got half way through the Bible then skipped to the end to find out the devil did it.

I did the same with the Quran and skipped to the end and learned that the Dajjal did it.

Can somebody write a new book that blames man for once please?


Hence, it is the devil that suggests to you, and the Dajjal is the one that tell people many lies about God's word in the Quran and the Heavenly Books.
 

eanassir

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What exactly is the struggle you're asking about Iran being victorious at? All I've seen from you so far in this thread is the idea that Muslims should go back to 7th century forms of religious observance and if they do that God will smile upon them and all will be well. I think that's nonsense. It's Taliban thinking, God has turned his face away from us because we've fallen away from the correct forms of observance, and if we fix that God will fix everything else. You'd do better to give up religious belief entirely and take responsibility for yourself, anything else is a delusion.


منهج التوحيد طريق الفلاح
Monotheism Is the Way of Success

Dexter, you are qualified in science; that is evident and I respect this.

But your way of thinking is not scientific; it is non-sense.
And it is only the repeating of some ideas so frequently: "7th century forms of religious observance" ... "Taliban thinking" ...etc.

The indication of your non-scientific way of thinking is that you pretend not knowing what is there about Iran and the rest of the Islamic countries ...

Don't you know, DS, that the Muslim countries have become the target for Jewish and Christian states ...

I say this to you clearly: such Jews and Christians as we call them the Zionism and Imperialism ... who are they?

And you come here and say such words pretending not knowing the truth while it is very evident.

Yes, it is: Iran will be victorious when Iranians will resort to God Almighty alone, and abandon their atheism and the enthusiasm about the imams,

but they will fail if they keep up on their exaggeration about the family of the Prophet and the imams: the descendents of Ali and his sons

just like how Christians were in conflicts and wars as they exaggerated in loving Jesus until they considered him the son of God instead of the son of man;

and as Jews had worshipped the idols and Baalim and Astaroth before; so they were destroyed utterly, and scattered all over the earth countries.

The dignity of Iran and its triumph and the victory for all Muslims and for all the world and humanity when they believe in God alone without associate, and in the Glorious Quran: the marvelous word of God which make people prosperous in this World and in the afterlife.

Monotheism Is the Way of Success
منهج التوحيد طريق الفلاح

This isn't a battle between the various Holy Books. The battle should be agaianst the one who will finance wars but refuse to make sure the poor are as few in number as possible.


God Is Wrathful with Associaters
الله يغضب على المشركين

MHz, you are correct: it is not a battle between the various Holy Books; but between some followers attributed to such Books, and in fact they are devils, and not followers of the holy Books.

The devotion to God alone is the decisive factor of God's good-pleasure.

God Is Wrathful with Associaters
الله يغضب على المشركين
 
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eanassir

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Love God more than you love His servants

I don't know Prsian; some Iraninas know Arabic and some know English in addition to their Persian; so I call them here by English and Arabic.

The enthusiasm about imams:
Leave the enthusiasm about the family of the Prophet (Ahlul bait): they are only human beings like yourselves, but they followed the monotheism and devoted themselves to God alone ...

So do like them and devote yourselves to God alone without associate, and do not exaggerate in loving them; because such loving of the imams of (Ahlul bait) will lead to glorifying them which wll lead to --> associating them with God Almighty (like how Christians exaggerated in loving Jesus.)

Let your love to God be more than loving Mohammed and his family (the Ahlul bait). As God said in the Quran 2: 165

وَمِنَ النَّاسِ مَن يَتَّخِذُ مِن دُونِ اللّهِ أَندَاداً يُحِبُّونَهُمْ كَحُبِّ اللّهِ وَالَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ أَشَدُّ حُبًّا لِّلّهِ

The explanation:
(Yet [some] of people choose [to worship], other than God, rivals [to God]; they love [these rivals] as God should be loved. – But those who believe love God more ardently.)

The enthusiasm about Hussein - salam be to him:
Therefore, we love Hussein but we should not mourn and cry on him every day and every year; because this remembrance and glorification should be exclusive to God alone.

And we love Mohammed and his companions (the Sahaba) but we should know they are only human beings and cannot harm or profit us, and we love God more than we love all others.

The swearing is only by God:
And we should swear by God alone not by the Sahaba or the imams; because the swearing is only allowed by God alone. So never say: By Hussein, I swear so and so; but say: I swear by God ...

Expending alms for God's sake not for the sake of Hussein:
Man should expend the money to the poor and needy for the sake of God not for the sake of Hussein or Ali or the rest of imams. So when you give the alms: say: I give this poor man for God's sake and for His good pleasure; but don't say: I give to this poor for the sake of Hussein or Ali.

The mosque is dedicated to God alone:
Muslims also have to build the mosques not the shrines and graves; because the mosque is the house of God, while the shrine is the grave of the servant whether he be imam or otherwise. Therefore, building of the Husseiniah is prohibited because it is dedicated to the name and service of Hussein son of Ali.

God - be glorified - said in the Quran 72:18

وَأَنَّ الْمَسَاجِدَ لِلَّهِ فَلَا تَدْعُوا مَعَ اللَّهِ أَحَدًا


The explanation:
(The mosques [: the places of worship] are for God [alone], so pray not to anyone along with God.)


The Shrines of imams
The Tombs of Saints
قبور الأولياء
 
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YukonJack

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If the race is to Hell, to the bosom of Satan and Mohammed, Iran WILL BE victorious.

WHY?

Because any society/country that is ready to stone a person to death is barbaric and the only place for them is where their idol the so-called prophet already is.
 
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eanassir

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If the race is to Hell, to the bosom of Satan and Mohammed, Iran WILL BE victorious.

WHY?

Because any society/country that is ready to stone a person to death is barbaric and the only place for them is where their idol the so-called prophet already is.


You mix things and confuse the matter.
Certainly, you don't pertain to God or to any of His revealed words: the Torah, the Gospel and the Quran.
 

eanassir

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I don't know the exact truth about this woman or others.

But the retaliation and punishment according to God's law, which some considers to be so cruel is not as you imagine.

Example: the killer is to be killed: such punishment has been considered non-humanly and cruel so they substituted it with a long time imprisonment.

Then what's the result: the crime of murdering prevailed. Because the murderer will not mind to be in prison with food and drink and social activities: in stead of being killed or excuted for his murder.

This is in the Quran 2: 179

وَلَكُمْ فِي الْقِصَاصِ حَيَاةٌ يَاْ أُولِيْ الأَلْبَابِ لَعَلَّكُمْ تَتَّقُونَ

The explanation:
(And with [imposing of] the retaliation there is [saving of] life for you, O men of discerning hearts, that you may ward off [the murder.])

Such punishment cases will be very few in fact; because people will refrain from killing each other.

Similarly, the killing of the adulterous (when he is married) will prevent most of the adultery; because such adultery is committed in fact because of the lust, while the fear from such killing will prevent people from committing such crime. And such punishment has been done with very few cases.

On the other hand, there is some cruel practice by some Muslims contrary to the original law in the Quran: which requires the testimony of 4 just witnesses or the confession of the adulterer. And it may be that some poor will be the victims, while the rich or the chiefs escape such punishment which is contrary to God's law.

Moreover, the non-married adulterer will be lashed 100 lashes, and not stoned as in the Quran 24: 2

الزَّانِيَةُ وَالزَّانِي فَاجْلِدُوا كُلَّ وَاحِدٍ مِّنْهُمَا مِئَةَ جَلْدَةٍ وَلَا تَأْخُذْكُم بِهِمَا رَأْفَةٌ فِي دِينِ اللَّهِ إِن كُنتُمْ تُؤْمِنُونَ بِاللَّهِ وَالْيَوْمِ الْآخِرِ وَلْيَشْهَدْ عَذَابَهُمَا طَائِفَةٌ مِّنَ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ

The explanation:
(The adulteress and the adulterer, scourge [O believers] each one of them with a hundred stripes.
And let not pity for them move you against the judgment of God, if you believe in God and the Last Day.
And let a party of the believers witness their chastisement.)

However, such punishment of killing the killer and stoning the adulterer (if he is married) and the adulteress (if she is married) is written in the Law of the Torah included in the Old Testament.

In addition, such punishment for that woman, where is the man (the adulterer) who should be punished in the same way ?

=========================================================

The glorification of the Remarked Stones in Qadam Gah

Here I don't defend every practice in Iran, but actually I criticize their enthusiasm concerning the imams and ahlul bait (the family of the Prophet).

Instead the people of Iran are educated and have to discard the traditions that are not prescribed in the Quran like the glorification of the shrines and graves of the imams and righteous men, and like the expenditure and feeding people for the sake of the imams, and like the exaggerated mourning and loving of such imams.

If they refrain from such practices, they will be powerful by God's power, and if they keep up at such enthusiasm, they will fail.

See about the glorification of remarked stones by some Iranians here (like what the Children of Israel did in the past):
mentioned in the Book of Leviticus, chapter 26: 1; God – be glorified – said:

"I am the Lord your God. You shall make for yourselves no idols 19 , neither shall you raise up an engraved image 20 or a pillar 21 , neither shall you place any figured stone 22 in your land, to bow down to it: for I am the Lord your God."

About the monotheism in the Bible

In Arabic:

بعض ما جاء في التوراة(في التوحيد)
فقد جاء في سفر لاويين (سفر الأحبار) في الفصل السادس والعشرين ، قال الله تعالى (لا تصنعوا لكم أوثاناً 1ولا منحوتات 2 ولا نصُباً 3 تقيموا لكم وحجراً مزخرفاً 4 لا تصنعوا في أرضكم لتسجدوا له لأنّي أنا الربّ إلاهكم .)
[1 الوثن: بناء مرتفع مستدير يُنسَب لأحد الآلهة المزعومة أو لأحد القدّيسين كالمقام المتّخذ في زماننا مثل مقام الخضر ومقام الصادق وغير ذلك .
2 المنحوتات : هي تماثيل المخلوقين كما تستعمله النصارى من تمثال مريم والمسيح والصليب وغير ذلك .
3 النصُب : هي أحجار ظاهرة تُنصَب في الجدار أو فوقه رمزاً لأحد الآلهة المزعومة أو لأحد الملوك أو لغيرهم ، ومثال ذلك حجر في إيران في "قدم كاه" يزورونه ويقبّلونه .
4 ما أكثر الأحجار المزخرفة في مراقد الأئمة والمشايخ ، وما أكثر من يقبّلها ويقدّسها ويتبرّك بِها في زماننا هذا .]
 

eanassir

Time Out
Jul 26, 2007
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The devotion to God alone

If one loves an imam or saint too much --> this will lead him to glorify this righteous man --> so that his mind will be occupied by remembering this imam like remembering God or more -->this will lead to associating this imam with God in the worship and servitude.

E.g. if man loves imam Ali too much and exaggerates in his love to imam Ali, he will holify and glorify him, and he will mention him day and night, during his wakefulness and during sleep --> this is in fact the worshipping of imam Ali.

Moreover, such "mushrik" or associater will work his work for the sake of imam Ali, not for the sake of God: like giving the alms to the poor, he will say: For the sake of imam Ali and for loving of imam Ali, I give the alms to the poor;

and the poor himself will ask alms in the name of imam Ali, not in the name of God Himself.

In addition, some people do not distinct between imam Ali and God, and will say to you if you advise them to make their work exclusive to God alone, they will say: What's the difference that we say to God's sake or to Ali's sake!?

The same is true about other imams like imam Hussein or Kazhim.

While it is mentioned in the Quran 76: 8-9
وَيُطْعِمُونَ الطَّعَامَ عَلَى حُبِّهِ مِسْكِينًا وَيَتِيمًا وَأَسِيرًا . إِنَّمَا نُطْعِمُكُمْ لِوَجْهِ اللَّهِ لَا نُرِيدُ مِنكُمْ جَزَاء وَلَا شُكُورًا

The explanation:
(And they feed, for the love of [God], the needy, the orphan and the captive, –
[Saying:] 'We feed you only for the sake of God; we desire no recompense from you, nor any gratitude.)

See, then, that God - be exalted – said: عَلَى حُبِّهِ i.e. (for the love of [God] ) means: for God's love; but He did not say: And they feed, for the love of the prophets, sheikhs, imams or saints.

See also that He – be exalted – said: إِنَّمَا نُطْعِمُكُمْ لِوَجْهِ اللَّهِ i.e. ([Saying:] 'We feed you only for the sake of God), but He did not say: 'We feed you only for the sake of sheikhs, imams and saints.

Moreover, God - be exalted - said in the Quran 2: 265
وَمَثَلُ الَّذِينَ يُنفِقُونَ أَمْوَالَهُمُ ابْتِغَاء مَرْضَاتِ اللّهِ وَتَثْبِيتًا مِّنْ أَنفُسِهِمْ
The explanation:
(And the likeness of those who spend their wealth seeking God's good pleasure, and in a way to confirm each other …)

In addition to that, God - be exalted - said in the Quran 2:262
الَّذِينَ يُنفِقُونَ أَمْوَالَهُمْ فِي سَبِيلِ اللّهِ ثُمَّ لاَ يُتْبِعُونَ مَا أَنفَقُواُ مَنًّا وَلاَ أَذًى لَّهُمْ أَجْرُهُمْ عِندَ رَبِّهِمْ

The explanation:
(Those who spend their wealth for the cause of God, then do not follow up, what they spend, by taunting with it and by annoyance; [such] will have their recompense with their Lord [in the ethereal paradises])

And it is narrated that Jaafar Assadiq said: "No almsgiving neither the freeing of any slave but should be for God's sake alone" – as in the books: Wasael Ashiaa, and Alkafi.


<http://www.quran-ayat.com/man/3.htm#Expending_and_offering_in_Gods_way_>

<http://www.quran-ayat.com/saa/index.htm#الولاية_لله_والشفاعة_بيده_>
 

Dexter Sinister

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Oct 1, 2004
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Eanassir, what is the penalty prescribed for apostasy in Islam? It's death, isn't it? You express doubt, you die. What is the penalty for criticizing Islam? Judging by the fatwah issued against Salmon Rushdie for The Satanic Verses, and the reaction to the Danish cartoons about the Prophet, it's the same. You criticize, you question, you die. What is the penalty for adultery? Death again, isn't it? By stoning. There's a case ongoing in Iran right now about stoning an adulteress to death, while the man involved is uncriticized and unpenalized, and not even identified. How can you believe you're a civilized man when you belong to a faith that does things like that and you and your fellow travelers don't rise up in righteous indignation against them?
 

eanassir

Time Out
Jul 26, 2007
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Dexter, what is the penalty of apostatising from God's religion according to Moses and the rest of the prophets?

Of course Jesus did not rule; he came to be their king, but they refused him and he had no opportunity to rule and be the ruler.

What is the penalty for the apostasy: the penalty in this World and the next afterlife?

What is the penalty of turning away from the communism according to the communist rulers?

What is the danger of the apostasy? It will make confusion in the new community.

Example:
Some Jews contemporary to Prophet Mohammed designed a trick to believe early in the day, then to apostatise later on that day, and say: we contemplated and revised our situation to find that we have committed a big mistake by becoming Muslims, because we have now discovered the religion of Islam is wrong; so now we do apostatise and return back to our religion: the Judaism.

As in the Quran 3: 72

وَقَالَت طَّآئِفَةٌ مِّنْ أَهْلِ الْكِتَابِ آمِنُواْ بِالَّذِيَ أُنزِلَ عَلَى الَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ وَجْهَ النَّهَارِ وَاكْفُرُواْ آخِرَهُ لَعَلَّهُمْ يَرْجِعُونَ

The explanation:
(A party of the people of the Bible [lit. Scripture: they were Jews] said:

"Believe – early in the day – in [the Quran] that has been sent down to the believers, then – later in the day – unbelieve;

that they may turn back [from the Islam to your religion.]")
-----------------------------------------------------

And what Moses did according to God's instructions when he found his people apostatised and fallen in the idolatry: he killed the idolaters: such killing will be their pardon in the afterlife: they will not be punished in Fire.

God said in the Quran 2: 54

وَإِذْ قَالَ مُوسَى لِقَوْمِهِ يَا قَوْمِ إِنَّكُمْ ظَلَمْتُمْ أَنفُسَكُمْ بِاتِّخَاذِكُمُ الْعِجْلَ فَتُوبُواْ إِلَى بَارِئِكُمْ فَاقْتُلُواْ أَنفُسَكُمْ ذَلِكُمْ خَيْرٌ لَّكُمْ عِندَ بَارِئِكُمْ فَتَابَ عَلَيْكُمْ إِنَّهُ هُوَ التَّوَّابُ الرَّحِيمُ

The explanation:
(And [remember:] Moses said to his people [who worshipped the calf]:

"O my people, you have indeed wronged yourselves by your taking the calf [as a god for worship]:

so turn (in repentance) to [the Lord] your Savior, and kill [the calf-worshippers amongst] yourselves;

that will be best for you with your Savior."

Then He turned towards you (in forgiveness): for He is Most-Turning, Most Merciful.)
---------------------------------------------

From another aspect, imagine the new community of monotheists and devoted to God alone, while they struggle to purify themselves from sins and wrong-doing, then some party of idolaters live among them: what will the result other than corruption?

So the retaliation in the World will be the pardon of the sinner in the afterlife;

A narrated story:
therefore a woman came to Prophet Mohammed and said to him as is it narrated: God's apostle, purify me: I have committed adultery! [She meant: punish me to be purified from the sin of the adultery]
The Prophet said: She may be mad.
She said: No, I am sane.
He said: Go and come to me another time later on.
The woman came later on and insisted.
He said: Go and come later on.
She came and was pregnant.
He said: Go and give birth to your child.
She came after child birth bearing her child.
He said: God and give him suckling.
She came later on with her child walking.
So he commanded her stoning, and some of the blood came at some of the attendent who reviled her, but the apostle was angry; and said to him: She repented the repentance that if all of others share it will be accepted; this is only a narration.

The witnesses in the case of the adultery should be 4 just witnesses whose witness is accepted by Muslims; if anyone say about a woman that she committed adultery, and he does not produce the 4 witnesses, then he will be lashed 80 lashes and any witness will not be accepted from him afterwards.

I asked Abu Abd-Allah: if I see some man and woman committing adultery; is it better I say this or conceal it?
He said: Cover and do not expose them.

And when Jesus said: if anyone of you is without sin, let him stone her.
What does this mean? It means: all of them or most of them are sinners, but most of them criticize her; and most of them are hypocrites.

And it does not mean to encourage the adultery, while Jesus was strict in this and was the example of chastity and righteousness so he said: If anyone looks to a woman other than his wife with lust; then in fact he will have committed the adultery within his heart.

See my previous reply for the importance of the retaliation and punishment according to God's law in the Glorious Quran; as in the Quran 4: 26-28
يُرِيدُ اللّهُ لِيُبَيِّنَ لَكُمْ وَيَهْدِيَكُمْ سُنَنَ الَّذِينَ مِن قَبْلِكُمْ وَيَتُوبَ عَلَيْكُمْ وَاللّهُ عَلِيمٌ حَكِيمٌ .وَاللّهُ يُرِيدُ أَن يَتُوبَ عَلَيْكُمْ وَيُرِيدُ الَّذِينَ يَتَّبِعُونَ الشَّهَوَاتِ أَن تَمِيلُواْ مَيْلاً عَظِيمًا . يُرِيدُ اللّهُ أَن يُخَفِّفَ عَنكُمْ وَخُلِقَ الإِنسَانُ ضَعِيفًا

The explanation:

(God likes to explain to you, and to acquaint you about the rites of those [Children of Israel] before you, and to turn towards you; God is All-Knowing, Most Wise.
God wills to turn towards you, but those following their lusts try to let you deviate with so much deviation.

God wills to alleviate [the statement] for you; for surely man has been created weak.)


 
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