McCain's Joe The Plumber


Kreskin
#1
This has turned into a real joke. Someone making $28 per hour working 24 hours a day 365 days a year still wouldn't make $250,000. No plumber makes $250,000 per year net income. Most wealthy people don't report $250,000 per year in income. As well, Joe The Plumber isn't really a plumber and he doesn't make anywhere near that kind of money nor will he ever, no matter what the tax policy is.

This P.T. McCain hoping to round up the suckers.
 
scratch
#2
Quote: Originally Posted by KreskinView Post

This has turned into a real joke. Someone making $28 per hour working 24 hours a day 365 days a year still wouldn't make $250,000. No plumber makes $250,000 per year net income. Most wealthy people don't report $250,000 per year in income. As well, Joe The Plumber isn't really a plumber and he doesn't make anywhere near that kind of money nor will he ever, no matter what the tax policy is.

This P.T. McCain hoping to round up the suckers.


I think it goes something like this:

Desperation is, as desperation does.

He's only got $47 million left so he has to be foolish, for the lack of a better word.
While Obama just had a new deposit of $150 million from September.

Bye.bye....John.
 
Praxius
Free Thinker
#3
No to mention, but everything I seen about this Joe the Plumber was involving him talking to Obama..... not McCain..... McCain wasn't anywhere around when this guy got on camera..... but there McCain is..... trying to use Joe the Plumber as his mascot, talking about him all the time he can, blah blah blah..... As far as I know, the guy never even met McCain face to face to even ask him questions, but there McCain is, trying to milk this guy for all he can... for his own political agendas.

For some guy that was on TV for like 3 minutes, McCain has spent the majority of the rest of his campaign around this dork.

And the reports and video I seen of him asking Obama about the taxes, etc... I find it interesting that they show him presenting his question, then they mute the rest where Obama actually responds, never knowing how he answered..... But that's all that McCain seems to need.

Of course he also thought he needed a bunch of other things, such as an ignorant gov. from Alaska to fill in his female quota from the Democrats when Clinton didn't make it.

That has been working out well now hasn't it?
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#4
Obama's people should hire him.... "Hi! I'm Joe ... and I'm voting for Obama."
 
Kreskin
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

Obama's people should hire him.... "Hi! I'm Joe ... and I'm voting for Obama."

I think this guy is under the illusion that he can make $250,000 if he ever gets a plumbing license.
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by KreskinView Post

I think this guy is under the illusion that he can make $250,000 if he ever gets a plumbing license.

A lousy sense of reality is the failing of a lot of folks. If he can ... sign me up! Methinks somebody read an extra zero on the pay scale....
 
Walter
#7
Jonah Goldberg:
The media vs. Joe the Plumber

Joe the Plumber asked a sensible question. Why is he being attacked and belittled?Jonah Goldberg
October 21, 2008
At a John McCain rally in Virginia on Saturday, Tito Munoz had come to face the enemy: the news media, which had declared war on Joe Wurzelbacher.

"Why the hell are you going after Joe the Plumber?" he yelled at a group of reporters, including my National Review colleague, Byron York. "Joe the Plumber has an idea. He has a future. He wants to be something else. Why is that wrong? Everything is possible in America. I made it. Joe the Plumber could make it even better than me. ... I was born in Colombia, but I was made in the U.S.A."

Who knows what it will do for McCain in the end, but the Joe the Plumber phenomenon is real. At the rally, supporters carried handmade signs reading "Phil the Brick Layer" and banners proclaiming "Rose the Teacher." Wurzelbacher symbolizes an optimistic, individualistic vision of America sorely lacking -- until recently -- in McCain's rhetoric.

Barack Obama, in contrast, has offered the most rhetorically eloquent defense of collectivism since Franklin D. Roosevelt. In his biographical video at the Democratic convention, he proclaimed that in America, "one person's struggle is all of our struggles." In his acceptance speech, he artfully replaced the idea of the American dream with the century-old progressive nostrum of "America's promise."

But the two visions are in opposition: the former individualistic, the latter collectivist. We each have our own idea of the American dream. Joe the Plumber's is to own a small plumbing company; yours might be something else entirely. In America, that's fine, because the pursuit of happiness is an individual, not a collective, right.

Obama's "America's promise," meanwhile, harkens back a century to the writings of such progressives as Herbert Croly (author of "The Promise of American Life"), who demonized individualism while sanctifying collective action overseen by the state. Obama also often articulates a vision of government inspired by the biblical injunction to be our brother's keeper. Few would dispute the moral message, but many disagree that such religious imperatives are best translated into tax or economic policy. (Where are the separation of church and state fetishists when you need them?) But individualists haven't had much of a voice in McCain, at least not until last week.

So we've listened to Joe Biden question the patriotism -- and, at times, piety -- of those who don't share Obama's economic vision. We've listened to Michelle Obama promise that her husband will make Americans "work" in his effort to fix our "broken souls." We've heard the candidate himself say that we should agree to higher taxes in the name of "neighborliness," and that he'd raise the capital gains tax -- even if it demonstrably lowered revenues -- "for the purposes of fairness." His "tax cut" for 95% of Americans is in large part a middle-class dole. He will cut checks to millions who pay no income tax at all and call it a tax cut.

In short, Obama's explanation to Joe the Plumber that we need to "spread the wealth around" is a sincere and significant expression of his worldview, with roots stretching back to his church and his days as a community organizer.

Millions of Americans don't share this vision. They don't see the economy as a pie, whereby your slice can only get bigger if someone else's gets smaller. They don't begrudge the wealthy their wealth; they only ask to be given the same opportunities. They look at countries such as France and, rather than envy their socialized medicine and short workweeks, they fear their joblessness and tax policies that punish entrepreneurialism. People like Tito Munoz look at America and see an open path to their own American dream.

It would be nice if the media at least tried to understand this point.

Instead, they attacked and belittled a citizen who asked a candidate a question. They think he's stupid or a liar for not understanding that a promised check from a President Obama is more valuable than some pipe dream about future success.

It's funny. When PBS' Gwen Ifill had a straightforward conflict of interest -- her forthcoming book hinges on an Obama presidency -- that should have prevented her from moderating the VP debate, she and her fellow journalists tittered at the critics. All that matters, Ifill and company insisted, are the answers, not the questioner.

That's apparently the standard for people like Gwen the Journalist. But if Joe the Plumber gets revealing but embarrassing answers out of the media's preferred candidate, suddenly the questioner matters more than the answer. And he must be punished.
 
Avro
No Party Affiliation
#8
Joe the plumber is an idiot.
 
scratch
#9
Quote: Originally Posted by AvroView Post

Joe the plumber is an idiot.

Avro,

With all due respect to you.

Did it ever occur to you that a `Joe the Plumber` might exist in Canada.

Wondering....

regs,
scratch

 
Walter
#10
Quote: Originally Posted by AvroView Post

Joe the plumber is an idiot.

He wants to run a business, hire people and not pay more taxes; wish we had more idiots like Joe.
 
Kreskin
#11
Quote: Originally Posted by WalterView Post

He wants to run a business, hire people and not pay more taxes; wish we had more idiots like Joe.

Most, almost all, small business people never report a net income of $250,000. If they do they need to hire new accountants.
 
scratch
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by WalterView Post

He wants to run a business, hire people and not pay more taxes; wish we had more idiots like Joe.

This is fictitious. Not Real.

.....what are you thinking Walter?

scratch
 
karrie
No Party Affiliation
#13
So. Michelle Bachmann starts spewing comments about investigating Barack Obama, and CONGRESS itself, to route out 'anti-americans', and now Joe the Plumber is taking on the 'collectivist' nature of the democratic party. It looks to me like soon the Republicans will be trying to declare another cold war and step the US back a few decades, spreading paranoia and idiocy throughout its populace. How disingenious.
 
scratch
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by karrieView Post

So. Michelle Bachmann starts spewing comments about investigating Barack Obama, and CONGRESS itself, to route out 'anti-americans', and now Joe the Plumber is taking on the 'collectivist' nature of the democratic party. It looks to me like soon the Republicans will be trying to declare another cold war and step the US back a few decades, spreading paranoia and idiocy throughout its populace. How disingenious.

From JFK's election win to today, these tactics have been part and parcel of not only the Republicans but Democrats as well.

IMO, sad but that is how things are done south of the border.

scratch
 
lone wolf
Free Thinker
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by scratchView Post

From JFK's election win to today, these tactics have been part and parcel of not only the Republicans but Democrats as well.

IMO, sad but that is how things are done south of the border.

scratch

Bunting, bullshyte and brass bands....
 
scratch
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by lone wolfView Post

Bunting, bullshyte and brass bands....

To each his own.

regs,
scratch
 
Avro
No Party Affiliation
#17
Quote: Originally Posted by WalterView Post

He wants to run a business, hire people and not pay more taxes; wish we had more idiots like Joe.

He runs an illegal business.

He can't pay 3% more above 250,000, give me a break.

Someone has to pay for illegal wars and massive debt.

I run a business in Canada and pay my taxes fair and square and I just bought a 500,000 dollar cottage and own a 350,000 house free and clear....you won't ever here me complain about paying taxes so my fellow Canadians can get health care without going bankrupt and receive an excellent education.

I know you understand business real well being a public servant and all.

You're a joke Walt along with your criminal buddy Joe.
 
Praxius
Free Thinker
#18
Quote: Originally Posted by WalterView Post

Jonah Goldberg:
The media vs. Joe the Plumber

Joe the Plumber asked a sensible question. Why is he being attacked and belittled?Jonah Goldberg
October 21, 2008
At a John McCain rally in Virginia on Saturday, Tito Munoz had come to face the enemy: the news media, which had declared war on Joe Wurzelbacher.

"Why the hell are you going after Joe the Plumber?" he yelled at a group of reporters, including my National Review colleague, Byron York. "Joe the Plumber has an idea. He has a future. He wants to be something else. Why is that wrong? Everything is possible in America. I made it. Joe the Plumber could make it even better than me. ... I was born in Colombia, but I was made in the U.S.A."

Who knows what it will do for McCain in the end, but the Joe the Plumber phenomenon is real. At the rally, supporters carried handmade signs reading "Phil the Brick Layer" and banners proclaiming "Rose the Teacher." Wurzelbacher symbolizes an optimistic, individualistic vision of America sorely lacking -- until recently -- in McCain's rhetoric.

Barack Obama, in contrast, has offered the most rhetorically eloquent defense of collectivism since Franklin D. Roosevelt. In his biographical video at the Democratic convention, he proclaimed that in America, "one person's struggle is all of our struggles." In his acceptance speech, he artfully replaced the idea of the American dream with the century-old progressive nostrum of "America's promise."

But the two visions are in opposition: the former individualistic, the latter collectivist. We each have our own idea of the American dream. Joe the Plumber's is to own a small plumbing company; yours might be something else entirely. In America, that's fine, because the pursuit of happiness is an individual, not a collective, right.

Obama's "America's promise," meanwhile, harkens back a century to the writings of such progressives as Herbert Croly (author of "The Promise of American Life"), who demonized individualism while sanctifying collective action overseen by the state. Obama also often articulates a vision of government inspired by the biblical injunction to be our brother's keeper. Few would dispute the moral message, but many disagree that such religious imperatives are best translated into tax or economic policy. (Where are the separation of church and state fetishists when you need them?) But individualists haven't had much of a voice in McCain, at least not until last week.

So we've listened to Joe Biden question the patriotism -- and, at times, piety -- of those who don't share Obama's economic vision. We've listened to Michelle Obama promise that her husband will make Americans "work" in his effort to fix our "broken souls." We've heard the candidate himself say that we should agree to higher taxes in the name of "neighborliness," and that he'd raise the capital gains tax -- even if it demonstrably lowered revenues -- "for the purposes of fairness." His "tax cut" for 95% of Americans is in large part a middle-class dole. He will cut checks to millions who pay no income tax at all and call it a tax cut.

In short, Obama's explanation to Joe the Plumber that we need to "spread the wealth around" is a sincere and significant expression of his worldview, with roots stretching back to his church and his days as a community organizer.

Millions of Americans don't share this vision. They don't see the economy as a pie, whereby your slice can only get bigger if someone else's gets smaller. They don't begrudge the wealthy their wealth; they only ask to be given the same opportunities. They look at countries such as France and, rather than envy their socialized medicine and short workweeks, they fear their joblessness and tax policies that punish entrepreneurialism. People like Tito Munoz look at America and see an open path to their own American dream.

It would be nice if the media at least tried to understand this point.

Instead, they attacked and belittled a citizen who asked a candidate a question. They think he's stupid or a liar for not understanding that a promised check from a President Obama is more valuable than some pipe dream about future success.

It's funny. When PBS' Gwen Ifill had a straightforward conflict of interest -- her forthcoming book hinges on an Obama presidency -- that should have prevented her from moderating the VP debate, she and her fellow journalists tittered at the critics. All that matters, Ifill and company insisted, are the answers, not the questioner.

That's apparently the standard for people like Gwen the Journalist. But if Joe the Plumber gets revealing but embarrassing answers out of the media's preferred candidate, suddenly the questioner matters more than the answer. And he must be punished.

Oh give me a break... boo hoo.... someone isn't promoting the selfish, arrogant, "Me First" attitude many seem to like. How well has this method worked so far?

It hasn't.

When your focus is just on yourself and your own place in society, screw everybody else and their needs, that spells a corrupt and soon to be more ignorant society. You certainly don't get the "One Voice" attitude of a United Country, you then have a very wide angle of division between people who all want different things that will help get themselves ahead of others. And when you have millions of people wanting a million different things differently from everybody else to suit their own wants, then nothing gets done.

A pack of wolves will survive and live a lot better then a lone wolf out for their own survival.

Millions of Americans don't see the economy as a pie?

Well then they're retarded, because there is only so much money to go around, and no matter how many opportunities are given to you to get more for yourself, it does have to come from somewhere else.

You want a war in Iraq? Well then the money for that war has to come from education, health care, and other services to the public..... and those things need to suffer in order to meet the demand of the other.

Greed spells Stupidity apparently, and I couldn't give a crap over Joe the Plumber's poor rep in the media now..... that's the media for you..... if you want to be famous and make it on TV, then expect people to have opinions about you and why you are on tv in the first place.

Deal with it.

You know what I really love about this report?

The fact that the try and complain about religious views of Obama being brought into politics, when the Republicans from Day one have been going on about cutting sex ed in schools, replacing it with abstinence..... teaching creationism in schools, and trying to change the laws on abortions..... all due to their religious morals.

So the fact that this idiot in the report has completely avoided focus on those points.... the fact that this idiot in the report has based his report completely on a bias against Obama and the Democrats, clearly demostrates the bias in all media based on who's giving the report..... therefore his report as being biased to one side, cancels out everything he's been bitching about in the first place in regards to being biased.

 
scratch
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by AvroView Post

He runs an illegal business.

He can't pay 3% more above 250,000, give me a break.

Someone has to pay for illegal wars and massive debt.

I run a business in Canada and pay my taxes fair and square and I just bought a 500,000 dollar cottage and own a 350,000 house free and clear....you won't ever here me complain about paying taxes so my fellow Canadians can get health care without going bankrupt and receive an excellent education.

I know you understand business real well being a public servant and all.

You're a joke Walt along with your criminal buddy Joe.



I've been nursing a coffee and it occurred to me that my last landlord was a plumber.

He name is Joe George, a Lebanese-Canadian and lives in Essex County, ON.

I rented from him for over nine years and in that time he acquired 2.5 million dollars in property as well as building a $500,000 home.

He had three employees, who were well paid, as far as I could say by talking to them and seeing the vehicles that they drove.

In the nine years that I was a tenant my rent was $450/month initially and the last rent I paid was $500/month all included.

So it is possible for some-one to make that kind of money and/or was very shrewd in his business dealings.

Essex County is a very closed county and if he had shady dealings it would have been known to everyone.

Shall we now compare our Joes.

With all due respect.
Sincerely,
scratch.

btw.......he was a die hard Liberal.


 
Praxius
Free Thinker
#20
Quote: Originally Posted by scratchView Post

Avro,

With all due respect to you.

Did it ever occur to you that a `Joe the Plumber` might exist in Canada.

Wondering....

regs,
scratch

Anybody who calls themselves by their first name followed by "The {Insert Ocupation Here}" on a regular basis is a tool.

Hi, I'm Conan the Barbarian!
 
Avro
No Party Affiliation
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by scratchView Post

Avro,

With all due respect to you.

Did it ever occur to you that a `Joe the Plumber` might exist in Canada.

Wondering....

regs,
scratch

Have you ever heard Joe speak?

Trust me, he's an idiot.

Here's some thoughts on Joe the douche bag.
 
Praxius
Free Thinker
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by WalterView Post

He wants to run a business, hire people and not pay more taxes; wish we had more idiots like Joe.

Well you can't always get what you want, esspecially in economic times like these.... that's why he's an idiot.
 
talloola
No Party Affiliation
#23
I want to see Obama 'get' his chance, and not assume what he will do before then.
People who are against him, seem to decide what he is going to do, without giving him
a chance, Joe the plumber will never make more than 250,000, so that is a dead
comment, and a ridiculous direction for McCain, but unfortunately many will be sucked in, as usual, and, helping those who are less well off by reducing their income tax, is fair,
and the statement that they don't pay any to begin with, is false, everyone working,
making under 250,000 pay income tax, people who don't work, getting some sort of
government assistance, probably have to pay income tax on that anyway, these people
are not 'the point' of the statement of reducing income tax.
 
Lester
No Party Affiliation
#24
250grand for a plumber?? i'm in the wrong racket
 
Praxius
Free Thinker
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by LesterView Post

250grand for a plumber?? i'm in the wrong racket

Yeah, he must be installing gold plated pipes laced with crack.
 
TenPenny
#26
Let's say you're a plumber. Own your own company. You bill out your time at $75/hr. Overtime is 1.5 times that. Any supplies you sell, you mark up, say 50 percent.

Work 30 hrs/week, plus 10 hours of overtime, do $250,000 worth of material costs (not too difficult if you do lots of new consturction), take 4 wks off, and you're grossing about 287,000.

Most plumbers are small businessmen, they are contractors, they can make big gross, they may even have employees.
 
darkbeaver
Republican
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by karrieView Post

So. Michelle Bachmann starts spewing comments about investigating Barack Obama, and CONGRESS itself, to route out 'anti-americans', and now Joe the Plumber is taking on the 'collectivist' nature of the democratic party. It looks to me like soon the Republicans will be trying to declare another cold war and step the US back a few decades, spreading paranoia and idiocy throughout its populace. How disingenious.

Impossible to spread it any thicker than it already is Karrie.
 
Kreskin
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by TenPennyView Post

Let's say you're a plumber. Own your own company. You bill out your time at $75/hr. Overtime is 1.5 times that. Any supplies you sell, you mark up, say 50 percent.

Work 30 hrs/week, plus 10 hours of overtime, do $250,000 worth of material costs (not too difficult if you do lots of new consturction), take 4 wks off, and you're grossing about 287,000.

Most plumbers are small businessmen, they are contractors, they can make big gross, they may even have employees.

Now write down all of the costs, like employee salaries, vehicle(s) lease, CCA's and it's well below.
 
Avro
No Party Affiliation
#29
My wife's uncle's are plumbers and they are multi millionaires, they are currently building the new hospital in North Bay 2 others and they have over 300 employees.

Anybody who thinks small can't see the potential of any business.

The burden of Canadian taxes hasn't made them poor nor did it prevent them from growing their business and making lots of dough, same goes for me but I don't constantly whine about taxes in this country like some piece of crap who blames government and taxes for their failures.
 
Kreskin
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by AvroView Post

My wife's uncle's are plumbers and they are multi millionaires, they are currently building the new hospital in North Bay 2 others and they have over 300 employees.

Anybody who thinks small can't see the potential of any business.

The burden of Canadian taxes hasn't made them poor nor did it prevent them from growing their business and making lots of dough, same goes for me but I don't constantly whine about taxes in this country like some piece of crap who blames government and taxes for their failures.

I'll put money on it that neither report more than 250k net on their tax returns unless they have sold property triggering capital gains. Wealth buys wealth and cashflow, not necessarily more taxable income.
 

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