Why They Hate Us...How Many Muslims Have US Killed In Last 30 Years?

Walter

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Al-Qaida Kills Eight Times More Muslims Than Non-Muslims

By Yassin Musharbash
Few would deny that Muslims too are victims of Islamist terror. But a new study by the Combating Terrorism Center in the US has shown that an overwhelming majority of al-Qaida victims are, in fact, co-religionists.
In the battle against unbelievers, can one also kill Muslims? Even the terror network al-Qaida is troubled by this question.
A leading al-Qaida ideologue for the terror network, Abu Yahya al-Libi, has developed his own theologically-based theory of collateral damage that allows militants to kill Muslims when it is unavoidable.
Even the Iraqi affiliates of Osama bin Laden's terror group, who are known to be particularly bloodthirsty, claim that they too consider this question. For instance, in a message claiming responsibility for an August attack in Baghdad, the group wished those Sunnis injured in the "operation" a speedy recovery and expressed their hope that those killed would be accepted by God as "martyrs."
But even as such apologetic communiqués from al-Qaida show the terror network stylizing itself as a defender of the true faith wrestling with religious concepts, they also make it look as though any dead Muslims are regretful but isolated cases. The facts, though, tell a different story.
Between 2004 and 2008, for example, al-Qaida claimed responsibility for 313 attacks, resulting in the deaths of 3,010 people. And even though these attacks include terrorist incidents in the West -- in Madrid in 2004 and in London in 2005 -- only 12 percent of those killed (371 deaths) were Westerners.
New Report Shows Many More Muslims Killed Than Non-Muslims
It is, of course, no surprise that al-Qaida kills more Muslims than non-Muslims -- particularly for people in the Islamic world. But a new report by the Combating Terrorism Center (CTC) at the United States' Military Academy at West Point in New York -- which has gathered together these and other relevant figures in one report ("Deadly Vanguards: A Study Of al-Qaida's Violence Against Muslims "), spells out the discrepancy in black and white.
The authors of the study admit that their report likely omits a number of Muslim victims. But that was the price of their rigorous methodology, used in an effort to avoid accusations of partisanship.
The researchers only counted the attacks for which al-Qaida claimed responsibility, thus preventing accusations that they were seeking to make al-Qaida look even worse than it is. Still, it is well known that al-Qaida does not claim responsibility for every attack perpetrated, meaning that many victims are likely left out of the report. Furthermore, the researchers only included attacks reported on by the Arab media and relied on the numbers they reported -- out of a conviction that the Arab media is more highly regarded in the Muslim world than the Western media. That, though, is not always the case.
Blurred Figures And Inexact Categories Are Problematic
The greatest potential for inaccuracy in the report, however, is the placing of victims into only one of two categories: Western or non-Western. The assumption being that Western would also mean non-Muslim and vice versa. The problems with such a system of categorization are myriad. Not all those living in the Muslim world are Muslim: In Iraq, al-Qaida has launched attacks against Kurds, Yazidi and Christians. Secondly, a lot of the Muslim victims are actually -- and deliberately -- Shiites. A Sunni group, al-Qaida considers the Shiites to be unbelievers.
Unfortunately news reports don't tend to differentiate between Sunni and Shiite Muslims, explains Scott Helfstein, one of the writers of the report. This is also the reason for the non-Western and Western categories. "It is easy for journalists to count nationality but they rarely, if ever, identify religion," Helfstein writes in reply to e-mailed questions from SPIEGEL ONLINE. The report's writers were well aware of the problem. "But we were not able to find a way around it," Helfstein notes.
Indeed, the report's authors confront the shortcomings of their methodology head on. In one passage, they remove attacks in Iraq and Afghanistan from their calculations altogether, resulting in the share of Westerners killed in al-Qaida attacks rising to a much more significant 39 percent. If one removes the Madrid and London attacks from the statistics, though, the share of murdered Westerners drops back down to 13 percent.
Perhaps more significantly, if one only examines attacks in 2007 and disregards those having been perpetrated in Iraq and Afghanistan, the share of non-Westerners killed by al-Qaida rises to 99 percent. In 2008, it was 96 percent.
Non-Westerners 38 Times More Likely To Be Killed
Put another way, between 2006 and 2008, non-Westerners were 38 times more likely to be killed by an al-Qaida attack than Westerners.
"Since al-Qaida has limited capability to strike against its Western enemies, the group maintains its relevance by attacking countries with Muslim majorities," the study concludes.
The conclusions reached by Helfstein and his co-authors are hardly world changing. They are valuable nonetheless, in that they provide a numerical foundation to the relationship between Muslim and non-Muslim al-Qaida victims.
Still, critics will no doubt point out that the study comes from the CTC, an organization that is part of an American military school. In recent years, the CTC has released a number of excellent studies on terrorism. But because it is actually supplying arguments, backed by scientific research, for the fight against terrorism to decision makers, politicians and military personnel in the US, it cannot be considered strictly neutral. That also applies to this case, especially since a number of American officials have recently begun stressing the point that al-Qaida is particularly violent toward Muslims and can now rely on solid data to back up their argument.
This perceived lack of neutrality doesn't change the fact that the fundamental findings of the report are correct and meaningful. The authors conclude that if they compare statistics for the years from 1995 to 2003 (excluding the Sept. 11, 2001 attacks in the US as a solitary event), they find that al-Qaida is becoming more violent and "increasingly indiscriminate" in its attacks.
Just how big a problem this discrepancy between Muslim and non-Muslim victims will become for al-Qaida remains to be seen. Even prior to the report's release, however, it had become a subject of intense debate within the Jihadist seen -- with more and more ideologues coming to the conclusion that al-Qaida's fight on behalf of the downtrodden Muslims isn't worth it.
 

L Gilbert

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"How Many Muslims Have US Killed In Last 30 Years?"

I have another question or two. How many Muslims have the Muslims killed in the last 30 years?
How many Christians have the Christians killed in the last 30?
How many people have people killed in the last 30?
 

darkbeaver

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Jan 26, 2006
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"How Many Muslims Have US Killed In Last 30 Years?"

I have another question or two. How many Muslims have the Muslims killed in the last 30 years?
How many Christians have the Christians killed in the last 30?
How many people have people killed in the last 30?

Lester Yankee murdering warmongers and their Israeli masters cannot hide among the real people. How many people were killed by people in the last thirty years? It's a fact that most people are killed by bankers irregardless of their nation of origin. In second place would be the drug dealing corporations followed by our doctors. And the retards we select to teach do the rest. Al-Kada isn't even on the list of star murderers.
 

L Gilbert

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Lester Yankee murdering warmongers and their Israeli masters cannot hide among the real people.
No, I know that. Snivelling, cowardly, little weasels lobbing rockets out at people and planting IEDs everywhere and driving car bombs into marketplaces and things like that can hide amongst real people, though. But that's not what I asked, anyway.
How many people were killed by people in the last thirty years? It's a fact that most people are killed by bankers irregardless of their nation of origin. In second place would be the drug dealing corporations followed by our doctors. And the retards we select to teach do the rest. Al-Kada isn't even on the list of star murderers.
 

Walter

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Jan 28, 2007
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6 officers killed in Pakistan mosque attack

Taliban claims responsibility
By Asif Shahzad ASSOCIATED PRESS

RAWALPINDI, Pakistan | Militants stormed a mosque near Pakistan's army headquarters, killing at least 36 worshippers, including six military officers, during Friday prayers as they sprayed gunfire and threw grenades before blowing themselves up, officials said.
It was the latest in a wave of strikes by suspected Islamist insurgents that has killed more than 400 people in Pakistan since October.

Christians went throught this kind of crap in the Medieval period when the RC's and the Prod's had at it, that is why I call Islam a Medieval religion.
 

Avro

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6 officers killed in Pakistan mosque attack

Taliban claims responsibility
By Asif Shahzad ASSOCIATED PRESS

RAWALPINDI, Pakistan | Militants stormed a mosque near Pakistan's army headquarters, killing at least 36 worshippers, including six military officers, during Friday prayers as they sprayed gunfire and threw grenades before blowing themselves up, officials said.
It was the latest in a wave of strikes by suspected Islamist insurgents that has killed more than 400 people in Pakistan since October.

Christians went throught this kind of crap in the Medieval period when the RC's and the Prod's had at it, that is why I call Islam a Medieval religion.

All religion is medievil, nothing but trickery and fairy tales.

Time to grow up.....:roll:
 

darkbeaver

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Jan 26, 2006
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No, I know that. Snivelling, cowardly, little weasels lobbing rockets out at people and planting IEDs everywhere and driving car bombs into marketplaces and things like that can hide amongst real people, though. But that's not what I asked, anyway.

If I was running a war on terror the first thing I'd do is to hire reliable professional terrorists. It's a fact the most of the mosque bombings are the direct result of counter insurgency groups, the ever popular divide and conquer technique practiced by every serious empire is a proven efficient and effective method of warfare, those with the most war resources use it with great frequency without fail. It's only a matter of who can afford to equip and field the most sniveling cowards and murdering scumbags. Do the math. All western militaries without exception have used the technique and continue to use it. Six million is the only number that counts these days Les.
 

Risus

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It seems to me that Islam is the only religion which condones killing followers of other religions. There is something wrong with that.
 

SirJosephPorter

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It seems to me that Islam is the only religion which condones killing followers of other religions. There is something wrong with that.

So does Christianity, Risus. Are you familiar with the quote from Exodus, "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live?"
 

Goober

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So does Christianity, Risus. Are you familiar with the quote from Exodus, "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live?"
SJP

Again out of your league - Unfamiliar with the religion that many adhere to and it does state - and can be construed in differing meanings- that killing infidels - yup - you are one of them qualifies -
The Islam as I have stated for years is stuck in the 12th, 13th century - while we in the West, Christian - have schools of theology - In Islamic countries they do not have the same structure - many work their way up by family relations - Iraq - Sadr - The elite of Iraq looks down upon him because he does not have the ability or intelligence of his father - whose mantle he has usurped -

Wahabi - Saudi's export this by supporting Mosques in the West - check this fact out - a benefactor of a mosque will have his own interpretation of Islam as the dominant version to be taught

SJP - Quoting from Exodus is pure BS - Perhaps you should do some research on the Koran and what is says about Infidels - again you and your family qualify -

How Jesus will lead the armies in the battle at the end

Again - it is particularly nice to see that you are way out of your league on this discussion - Rare but you need this in order to grow.

Grasshopper - some advice - Educate yourself, then post.
 

JLM

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SJP

Again out of your league - Unfamiliar with the religion that many adhere to and it does state - and can be construed in differing meanings- that killing infidels - yup - you are one of them qualifies -
The Islam as I have stated for years is stuck in the 12th, 13th century - while we in the West, Christian - have schools of theology - In Islamic countries they do not have the same structure - many work their way up by family relations - Iraq - Sadr - The elite of Iraq looks down upon him because he does not have the ability or intelligence of his father - whose mantle he has usurped -

Wahabi - Saudi's export this by supporting Mosques in the West - check this fact out - a benefactor of a mosque will have his own interpretation of Islam as the dominant version to be tau

SJP - Quoting from Exodus is pure BS - Perhaps you should do some research on the Koran and what is says about Infidels - again you and your family qualify -

How Jesus will lead the armies in the battle at the end

Again - it is particularly nice to see that you are way out of your league on this discussion - Rare but you need this in order to grow.

Grasshopper - some advice - Educate yourself, then post.

I kind of wonder how really concerned they are about the death of Muslims at the alleged hands of Americans. Saddam himself is estimated to have killed between one and two million of them. I have no idea how many more his sons did in. If they were really concerned about it they wouldn't be pulling shenanigans like they did at W.T.C.
 

Goober

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I kind of wonder how really concerned they are about the death of Muslims at the alleged hands of Americans. Saddam himself is estimated to have killed between one and two million of them. I have no idea how many more his sons did in. If they were really concerned about it they wouldn't be pulling shenanigans like they did at W.T.C.

Saddam on average murdered 4000 Iraqi's at Abu Gharib - that does not include gassing of the Kurds - The rebellion of the Shia afer GBus1 Sated he would protect them - and all the rest - and lastly the Iraq-Iran War -

Arab Muslims are their own worst enemy and in many cases the West's as well.
 

SirJosephPorter

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SJP

Again out of your league - Unfamiliar with the religion that many adhere to and it does state - and can be construed in differing meanings- that killing infidels - yup - you are one of them qualifies -
The Islam as I have stated for years is stuck in the 12th, 13th century - while we in the West, Christian - have schools of theology - In Islamic countries they do not have the same structure - many work their way up by family relations - Iraq - Sadr - The elite of Iraq looks down upon him because he does not have the ability or intelligence of his father - whose mantle he has usurped -

Wahabi - Saudi's export this by supporting Mosques in the West - check this fact out - a benefactor of a mosque will have his own interpretation of Islam as the dominant version to be taught

SJP - Quoting from Exodus is pure BS - Perhaps you should do some research on the Koran and what is says about Infidels - again you and your family qualify -

How Jesus will lead the armies in the battle at the end

Again - it is particularly nice to see that you are way out of your league on this discussion - Rare but you need this in order to grow.

Grasshopper - some advice - Educate yourself, then post.

I am aware that Islam and Koran say plenty of nasty things about unbelievers and infidels, Goober. My point is that so does Christianity. The difference is that while most Christians simply ignore some of the more extreme teachings of the Bible (like ‘thou shalt not suffer a witch to live’), at least a significant minority of Muslims take everything Koran says literally, and insist upon acting on the literal interpretation of Koran (kill the infidels, stone women to death etc.).

But my point is that at its root, both Islam and Christianity are nasty religions. The practical difference between the two is due to the fact that Christians do not take the Bible literally (even the religious right, Fundamentalists do not take the Bible literally), while the extreme form of Islam does.

And what is wrong with quoting Exodus? Are you saying that Exodus is not part of the Bible?
 

Goober

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I am aware that Islam and Koran say plenty of nasty things about unbelievers and infidels, Goober. My point is that so does Christianity. The difference is that while most Christians simply ignore some of the more extreme teachings of the Bible (like ‘thou shalt not suffer a witch to live’), at least a significant minority of Muslims take everything Koran says literally, and insist upon acting on the literal interpretation of Koran (kill the infidels, stone women to death etc.).

But my point is that at its root, both Islam and Christianity are nasty religions. The practical difference between the two is due to the fact that Christians do not take the Bible literally (even the religious right, Fundamentalists do not take the Bible literally), while the extreme form of Islam does.

And what is wrong with quoting Exodus? Are you saying that Exodus is not part of the Bible?
SJP
You state at their root they are the same -

I differ- then you state that Christians do not take the Bible literally while many Muslims do - So how are they the same today -

Christianity went thru a reformation and many Wars - Islam has been stuck at around 1200 AD. So how are they the same.

Our Democracies are founded upon many of the principles of Judeo -Christian teachings - Not Islam - So how are they the same -

We have fundamentalist Christians that do kill now and again - Rare but it occurs - Muslims do it on a regular basis. So how are we the same.

We believe in equality of all. Muslims do not. So how are we the same.

I could go on but choose not to. In my post I am referring to the Fanatics and the hardliners -

I do have many friends whose religion is Muslim and they are as disgusted as I - Perhaps you should read some of Tarek Fatah's writings for a clearer insight to the religion.

PS - Do not give me BS about Exodus and it being part of the bible - That was not the intent of your post -
 

SirJosephPorter

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SJP
You state at their root they are the same -

I differ- then you state that Christians do not take the Bible literally while many Muslims do - So how are they the same today -

Christianity went thru a reformation and many Wars - Islam has been stuck at around 1200 AD. So how are they the same.

Our Democracies are founded upon many of the principles of Judeo -Christian teachings - Not Islam - So how are they the same -

We have fundamentalist Christians that do kill now and again - Rare but it occurs - Muslims do it on a regular basis. So how are we the same.

We believe in equality of all. Muslims do not. So how are we the same.

I could go on but choose not to. In my post I am referring to the Fanatics and the hardliners -

I do have many friends whose religion is Muslim and they are as disgusted as I - Perhaps you should read some of Tarek Fatah's writings for a clearer insight to the religion.

PS - Do not give me BS about Exodus and it being part of the bible - That was not the intent of your post -

Again, read my post properly. What I said is that at its root, both Christianity and Islam are nasty religions. Otherwise I am in agreement with pretty much everything you say. Christianity was ‘humanized’ by the Reformation. What Muslims need is a Reformation.

But again, at its root, both the religions are nasty. As to democracy being founded on Judeo-Christian principle’s perhaps that may have been true in the old days. However, these days concepts such as pluralism, equal rights, multiculturalism, minority rights etc. and not considered Christian, but are considered secular. So whatever the roots on which democracies were founded on several hundred years ago is irrelevant today.

And again, what is your problem with quoting from Exodus. Are you saying that Exodus is not part of the bible?
 

Colpy

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Again, read my post properly. What I said is that at its root, both Christianity and Islam are nasty religions. Otherwise I am in agreement with pretty much everything you say. Christianity was ‘humanized’ by the Reformation. What Muslims need is a Reformation.

But again, at its root, both the religions are nasty. As to democracy being founded on Judeo-Christian principle’s perhaps that may have been true in the old days. However, these days concepts such as pluralism, equal rights, multiculturalism, minority rights etc. and not considered Christian, but are considered secular. So whatever the roots on which democracies were founded on several hundred years ago is irrelevant today.

And again, what is your problem with quoting from Exodus. Are you saying that Exodus is not part of the bible?

Okay....standard disclaimer....I am not a theologian.....nor am I a churchgoer, but if pressed, I would claim Christianity as my religion.My understanding is that the old law, the srict law of the Old Testament, was revoked by the arrival of the Messiah.....as demonstrated by Christ's defense of the adulteress about to be stoned....."Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone"THAT separates Christianity from Islam, Christ from Mohammed......Christianity is a religion of choice....choose your path as you will, and be judged in this world only by the laws of this world......judgement of your spiritual value is left to the next.While Islam means "submission" and demands earthly punishment for purely theological sin......