US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party. Holy S

[Colpy]

RE: US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party. Ho

Interesting thread.

I'm a member of the CPC, in the interests of full disclosure. I was a member of the Canadian Alliance, and of the Reform Party.

I am amused by the characterization of the CPC as a "real" right wing party. Good Lord, they are hardly that! As I've pointed out before, ALL Canadian political parties are JAMMED into the centre.......nothing else cuts it in Canada. I mean, the two parties at opposite ends of the Canadian political spectrum, the CPC and the NDP, oft find common ground and hold many of the same basic beliefs..........

That said, I too would like to see a "joining" on the centre-left. I think it would be good for Canada for us to have a centre-left and a centre-right party.......the marriage of the NDP and Liberals into a Liberal Democratic Party might be a good thing......

My problem is the Bloc, which can hold as many as 65 seats. Quebecers are famous for voting strategically, and once they realize the Bloc can perpetually hold the balance of power and hold any Canadian gov't hostage for WHATEVER Quebec wants............the Bloc will get their 65 seats every election.

Bad news.

 

[BitWhys]

Re: RE: US Republican strateg

http://www.canada.com/vancouversun/news/story.html?id=40bc8a42-eb4c-488d-bcec-c576a99eb49d

OTTAWA -- Prime Minister Stephen Harper's popularity in B.C. has soared a whopping 21 points -- to 66 per cent -- according to the latest Ipsos Reid poll, indicating the controversy over his appointment of former Liberal David Emerson to his Conservative cabinet is dying.

March?

:roll:

 

[Simpleton]

Re: RE: US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party

Interesting thread.

I'm a member of the CPC, in the interests of full disclosure. I was a member of the Canadian Alliance, and of the Reform Party.

I am amused by the characterization of the CPC as a "real" right wing party. Good Lord, they are hardly that! As I've pointed out before, ALL Canadian political parties are JAMMED into the centre.......nothing else cuts it in Canada. I mean, the two parties at opposite ends of the Canadian political spectrum, the CPC and the NDP, oft find common ground and hold many of the same basic beliefs..........

That said, I too would like to see a "joining" on the centre-left. I think it would be good for Canada for us to have a centre-left and a centre-right party.......the marriage of the NDP and Liberals into a Liberal Democratic Party might be a good thing......

My problem is the Bloc, which can hold as many as 65 seats. Quebecers are famous for voting strategically, and once they realize the Bloc can perpetually hold the balance of power and hold any Canadian gov't hostage for WHATEVER Quebec wants............the Bloc will get their 65 seats every election.

Bad news.

Personally, I would be happy if the Bloc held every seat in Quebec. I rather like Gilles Duceppes. I also like the fact that the Bloc makes it damn near impossible for either of the strong national parties to form a majority government. After all, it is the simple minority government that forces Harper to make all of the right moves.

I really believe that Paul Martin made all of the right moves during his tenor as minority Prime Minister. The problem that Paul Martin had, was that he was fighting an uphill battle made impossibly tough by his predecessor. Yet, despite all of the corruption, we didn't see the Liberal exodus that we saw with the past Mulroney/Campbell conservative government.

In the last election, many people were expecting the Liberal party to be marginalized, and an invigorated Conservative party energized to sweep the nation. That just didn't happen however. The losses to the Liberal party in the last election were negligible -- yes, despite the corruption and the three flat tires of the Liberal party. So you have to wonder why? And in my opinion, there's still a lot of distrust of the Conservative party.

As for the polls showing Conservative popularity rising in B.C., I wouldn't put too much stock into that. We've seen how accurate polls have been in Canada over the last few years. :wink:

 

[FiveParadox]

Re: Conservative Cabinet

One thing which could be the undoing of The Right Honourable Stephen Harper, P.C., M.P., the Member for Calgary Southwest and the Prime Minister of Canada, is his stranglehold over his cabinet members. I would argue that history has shown that while this can work in the short-term, this has the extreme risk of causing later fractures within the party, and in some cases, forcing the resignation of the sitting prime minister.

In terms of a merger between the two, I am not so sure that the Liberal Party of Canada and the New Democratic Party of Canada are compatible with one another. In recent weeks, it has become clear (in my opinion) that The Honourable Jack Layton, P.C., M.P., the Member for Toronto—Danforth and the Leader of the New Democratic Party, is losing touch with reality. The two parties would also end up eating each other over issues such as democratic reform (New Democratic ideas for reform would make majority governments nearly impossible).

 

[Colpy]

Re: Conservative Cabinet

One thing which could be the undoing of The Right Honourable Stephen Harper, P.C., M.P., the Member for Calgary Southwest and the Prime Minister of Canada, is his stranglehold over his cabinet members. I would argue that history has shown that while this can work in the short-term, this has the extreme risk of causing later fractures within the party, and in some cases, forcing the resignation of the sitting prime minister.

In terms of a merger between the two, I am not so sure that the Liberal Party of Canada and the New Democratic Party of Canada are compatible with one another. In recent weeks, it has become clear (in my opinion) that The Honourable Jack Layton, P.C., M.P., the Member for Toronto—Danforth and the Leader of the New Democratic Party, is losing touch with reality. The two parties would also end up eating each other over issues such as democratic reform (New Democratic ideas for reform would make majority governments nearly impossible).

imho, THE hONOURABLE jACK WAS never IN TOUCH WITH REALITY.........

 

[Simpleton]

Re: Conservative Cabinet

One thing which could be the undoing of The Right Honourable Stephen Harper, P.C., M.P., the Member for Calgary Southwest and the Prime Minister of Canada, is his stranglehold over his cabinet members. I would argue that history has shown that while this can work in the short-term, this has the extreme risk of causing later fractures within the party, and in some cases, forcing the resignation of the sitting prime minister.

In terms of a merger between the two, I am not so sure that the Liberal Party of Canada and the New Democratic Party of Canada are compatible with one another. In recent weeks, it has become clear (in my opinion) that The Honourable Jack Layton, P.C., M.P., the Member for Toronto—Danforth and the Leader of the New Democratic Party, is losing touch with reality. The two parties would also end up eating each other over issues such as democratic reform (New Democratic ideas for reform would make majority governments nearly impossible).

Until free votes are introduced into parliament, I never want to see another majority government in Canada again. I am dead set against the idea of the five year dictatorial reign.

The present political system in Canada, is tantamount to electing a king. And that just leaves a really bad taste in my mouth.

Giving a party a majority government in Canada is a lot like giving the U.S. president the power to abolish the house and senate. Could you imagine how much of a mess the U.S. would currently be in, if President Bush had that power? Remember what Adolf Hitler did, when he had that power?


Note: I am in no way comparing Canadian Prime Ministers or U.S. Presidents to Adolf Hitler. I'm just commenting on the absolute absurdity of giving one man full reign over an entire nation.

Any Megadeth fans here? I'm going to close this post with some lyrics:

You take a mortal man,
And put him in control,
Watch him become a God,
Watch people's heads roll.

Just like the pied piper lead rats through the streets,
We dance like marrionettes, swaying to the symphony...
Of Destruction!

 

[BitWhys]

Re: Conservative Cabinet

In recent weeks, it has become clear (in my opinion) that The Honourable Jack Layton, P.C., M.P., the Member for Toronto—Danforth and the Leader of the New Democratic Party, is losing touch with reality.

what makes you say that?

 

[gc]

Re: RE: US Republican strateg

OTTAWA -- Prime Minister Stephen Harper's popularity in B.C. has soared a whopping 21 points -- to 66 per cent -- according to the latest Ipsos Reid poll, indicating the controversy over his appointment of former Liberal David Emerson to his Conservative cabinet is dying.

When I first read this I was quite scared...then I looked at the date, March 25. A lot has happened since then and a lot will happen from now until the next election. I have talked to a lot of people in B.C. who are very unhappy with the softwood lumber deal. However, I haven't talked to everyone so I can't speak for the whole province.

My problem is the Bloc, which can hold as many as 65 seats. Quebecers are famous for voting strategically, and once they realize the Bloc can perpetually hold the balance of power and hold any Canadian gov't hostage for WHATEVER Quebec wants............the Bloc will get their 65 seats every election.

Bad news.

I agree with you to some extent. If all we have is minority governments, the bloc will likely hold the balance of power. The bloc will then have the power to get rid of any government that is not 'quebec friendly'. I can see this happening already with the CPC's promise to address the fiscal imbalance in order to secure the support of the bloc in the house of commons on matters of confidence. Then again, are they really going to live up to this promise? Didn't flaherty say if you want to fix the fiscal imbalance, raise provincial taxes? On the other hand I could be wrong, I mean how many elections can the bloc trigger before people get annoyed? In terms of social issues, I generally agree with Duceppe and I don't mind them holding seats (i.e. SSM, Iraq...the only place where I disagree is probably Afghanistan). If there is an undoing of Stephen Harper anytime soon, I imagine it will likely be due to the fiscal imbalance situation. In other words if he tries to cater to quebec how will the rest of the country feel? And if he doesn't he'll loose some of the seats he has and that will make it difficult for a majority unless he can make major gains elsewhere (ontario?).

In terms of a merger between the two, I am not so sure that the Liberal Party of Canada and the New Democratic Party of Canada are compatible with one another. In recent weeks, it has become clear (in my opinion) that The Honourable Jack Layton, P.C., M.P., the Member for Toronto—Danforth and the Leader of the New Democratic Party, is losing touch with reality. The two parties would also end up eating each other over issues such as democratic reform (New Democratic ideas for reform would make majority governments nearly impossible).

In terms of a merger, I pretty much agree with FiveParadox. I can not see Jack Layton wanting to merge with the liberals. That depends partly on their leader, someone like brison or ignatieff, I think hell will freeze over first. Someone like bob rae, maybe, but the CPC might get a majority for just that reason.

Until free votes are introduced into parliament, I never want to see another majority government in Canada again. I am dead set against the idea of the five year dictatorial reign.

As long as the Prime Minister chooses his or her cabinet, and as long as the caucus doesn't have the ability to boot him or her out, I can't see real free votes happening anytime soon. Won't the idea 'gee if I vote against the leader of the party, I might not get a cabinet position' be in the back of everyone's mind?

 

[Simpleton]

Re: RE: US Republican strateg

Until free votes are introduced into parliament, I never want to see another majority government in Canada again. I am dead set against the idea of the five year dictatorial reign.

As long as the Prime Minister chooses his or her cabinet, and as long as the caucus doesn't have the ability to boot him or her out, I can't see real free votes happening anytime soon. Won't the idea 'gee if I vote against the leader of the party, I might not get a cabinet position' be in the back of everyone's mind?

If you've ever watched Parliament in action, you'd quickly reach the conclusion that the majority of parliamentarians could not care less about getting a cabinet position.

Of course, you could cure that situation by making cabinet appointments a committee endeavour. Release the P.M. from the responsibility of selecting cabinet members and create a committee to select the cabinet. But who would decide the committee members? Aye, there's the rub. :wink:

We're Canadian, we like committee's. :lol:

Or, if we ever get an elected senate, they could choose the cabinet ministers. Just a thought...

 

[Freethinker]

Re: RE: US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party

I'm a member of the CPC, in the interests of full disclosure. I was a member of the Canadian Alliance, and of the Reform Party.

I am amused by the characterization of the CPC as a "real" right wing party. Good Lord, they are hardly that! As I've pointed out before, ALL Canadian political parties are JAMMED into the centre.......nothing else cuts it in Canada.

Being a Alliance/Reform member you version of the center might be a bit different than mine. I'll run through a few litmus tests off the top of my head.


1: Practice wedge politics on "moral" issues? Check: only party to fight gay marriage, trying to turn it into a wedge issue to divide the country.

2: Tax cuts aimed at the wealthy? Check: GST cuts and capital gains cuts aimed primarily at the wealthy.

3: Buisness ahead of Environment? Check: Fights Kyoto protocol.

4: Bringing religion into politics? Check: Fighting gay marriage, ending speeches by invoking god.

5: More militaristic, jingoistic? Check: On the Lebanon conflict, Harper out Bushes, Bush. (Measured Response), extends stay in Afghanistan well before current assignment was up.

6: War on harmless drugs? Check: Wants Marijuana criminalized.

7: Quash Social programs? Check: Bye bye daycare...

Seems pretty damn right wing to me, and this is his position with a minority government.

 

[athabaska]

Re: US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party. Ho

It's amusing how all the liberals were just kissing Al Gore's ass.

'He's wonderful. Can we be Gore groupes?'...oooooo.

 

[proudpegger]

Re: US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party. Ho

It's amusing how all the liberals were just kissing Al Gore's ass.
He's wonderful. Can we be Gore groupes?'...oooooo.

How is this observation of yours relavent to the thread?

 

[Colpy]

Re: RE: US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party

I'm a member of the CPC, in the interests of full disclosure. I was a member of the Canadian Alliance, and of the Reform Party.

I am amused by the characterization of the CPC as a "real" right wing party. Good Lord, they are hardly that! As I've pointed out before, ALL Canadian political parties are JAMMED into the centre.......nothing else cuts it in Canada.

Being a Alliance/Reform member you version of the center might be a bit different than mine. I'll run through a few litmus tests off the top of my head.


1: Practice wedge politics on "moral" issues? Check: only party to fight gay marriage, trying to turn it into a wedge issue to divide the country.

2: Tax cuts aimed at the wealthy? Check: GST cuts and capital gains cuts aimed primarily at the wealthy.

3: Buisness ahead of Environment? Check: Fights Kyoto protocol.

4: Bringing religion into politics? Check: Fighting gay marriage, ending speeches by invoking god.

5: More militaristic, jingoistic? Check: On the Lebanon conflict, Harper out Bushes, Bush. (Measured Response), extends stay in Afghanistan well before current assignment was up.

6: War on harmless drugs? Check: Wants Marijuana criminalized.

7: Quash Social programs? Check: Bye bye daycare...

Seems pretty damn right wing to me, and this is his position with a minority government.

One at a time:

1. Gay Marriage. A vote promised, which will be delivered in the fall. A vote set up to fail, so that the status quo of SSM will stand. Why do you suppose the vote is on the question "Do you wish to re-open the debate on SSM?" The answer is simple. NO pro-SSM Member will vote to re-open the debate. MANY supporters of traditional marriage will vote NOT to re-open the debate (were I a MP, I would fall into the latter camp). Harper has set it up this way, he wants the issue to die, and he doesn't care if SSM is here to stay. Brilliant political move.

2.Yeah, well, I agree to a certain extent........I'm glad the GST is cut, but I'd rather it stayed and was spent on lowering the debt.

3. Explain to me, please, how giving China cash saves the environment. Kyoto was feel-good BS for the masses. Idiotic in concept, impossible to implement........

4. On Gay Marriage, see above. As for God Bless Canada, I like it...........and it is hardly the establishment of a state church.

5. It's nice to be RIGHT for a change, isn't it? And to actually HAVE a vote on deployment..........If Harper stays in for a term or two, we may actually have a REAL military, and regain some respect in the world.

6. I agree. Marijuana should not be decriminalized, it should be LEGAL! What can I say? Perfection exists only in the mind of God.

7. No, you mean bye-bye welfare program for the professional upper middle class, hello REAL help for the needy.

The poor don't work 9 to 5, daycares are only open 9 to 5, therefore they are disproportionally used by affluent professionals that DO work 9 to 5. Poor people work shift work, and have one parent stay home, or pay friends or relative a small amount to watch their kids......they actually benefit from Harper's plan.

I am literally sickened by the stupidity of the latte-sipping ivory tower arseholes that are all in favour of the old Liberal/NDP plan. They are just soliciting for the advantage of their own Gucci-wearing, SUV-sitting, arrogant, elitist arses and TO HELL with those who need help, while pretending to be "socially responsible"

RETCH!

 

[BitWhys]

RE: US Republican strateg

yeah

sounds pretty right wing to me too.

 

[Freethinker]

Re: RE: US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party

Colpy, This is not a question wether you agree/disagree that these are good/bad thing. These are obvious markers. They are very much a right wing party. How are they not? Where is the big difference with the GOP in the USA. You are right wing, so of course you agree with a most of them. My response to a couple.

#1, did I ever say Harper was anything but smart and strategic. When he brings SSM back this time, he knows there is little chance to win, but he can score political points by seeming reasonable while he has a minority. I was more speaking about his behavior the first time came up, when he ran divisive ads about destroying the traditional value of marriage BS. Once he gets his majority he will be back at SSM again, this time for the Win.

#7 Naturally you don't like government programs to help people being right wing. $100/month doesn't provide daycare for anyone. It is just a farce. The poor don't work 9 to 5?? WTF? I was working poor, I worked 9-5, most people work 9-5. What kind of rationalizing nonesense is this. What do you think low paying jobs are. Service jobs like retail sales. When are stores open??

Poor/lower middle class will benefit because they would actually have daycare. It is farcical for you to suggest that with under $5 per workday they can get any kind of care at all. Absolute farce.

 

[gc]

Re: RE: US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party

The poor don't work 9 to 5, daycares are only open 9 to 5, therefore they are disproportionally used by affluent professionals that DO work 9 to 5. Poor people work shift work, and have one parent stay home, or pay friends or relative a small amount to watch their kids......they actually benefit from Harper's plan.

Now just to play devil's advocate for a minute here...while not all poor work 9 to 5, many do. On the other hand, a rich family can get by with one income, allowing the other parent to stay home and watch the kids. So these rich people will get $1200 to make them richer. A poor family often can't get by on one income, so both parents work hence the need for daycare. Not to mention single parent households. Now I'm not saying I agree with the liberals plan 100% but it does seem to help out poor familes more than rich families. There is also the argument that many daycares are full, and so extra money doesn't help if there is a waiting list. Since I don't have kids I can't guarantee that is the truth, but that is what I've heard.

 

[FiveParadox]

Re: Harper and Same-sex Marriage

I am convinced that The Right Honourable Stephen Harper, P.C., M.P., the Member for Calgary Southwest and the Prime Minister of Canada, is setting up his motion in Autumn to be defeated. However, I am also relatively certain that if the Conservative Party of Canada comes back to the Fortieth Parliament of Canada with a majority of seats, he will repeal the Civil Marriage Act, and scream bloody murder if the Senate of Canada even dares to debate the legislation.

If the Supreme Court of Canada, or any other courts in Canada, strike down a ban on same-sex marriage [again], Harper will scream bloody murder over the "liberal" courts and their "liberal" ideas. (Let's face it—the courts aren't liberal, the precedents have simply been set and established.)

As for the issue of child care, I don't see how anyone can argue that less than one hundred dollars per month is enough to contribute significantly to child care (I stress less than one hundred dollars per month, since the Government is determined to tax the credit, and since The Honourable James Flaherty, P.C., M.P., the Member for Whitby—Oshawa and the Minister of Finance, has told the Provinces of Canada that such credits and tax breaks are a perfect opportunity for the Provinces to bump up their own revenue.

 

[Kreskin]

RE: US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party. Ho

I wish the $100 monthly relief had started 4 years ago. I've been paying anywhere from $500-700. What I got was the Liberals sitting around talking about it. $4800 would've helped a lot, taxable or not.

 

[proudpegger]

Re: RE: US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party

I wish the $100 monthly relief had started 4 years ago. I've been paying anywhere from $500-700. What I got was the Liberals sitting around talking about it. $4800 would've helped a lot, taxable or not.

Are you kidding me?
Besides the fact a chunk of it is taxable, the CPC is also clawing back a the "young child allowance".
Add that to the fact that it's been reported many childcare centers are raising fees in unison with the CPC allowance and I don't know what kind of "relief" you're expecting.

But we digress off-topic. If you want to start a childcare topic I'll be happy to provide all links on the above, as well as a recent poll that shows 76% of Canadians support a national childcare strategy (not an allowance) like the 2004 agreement that was cancelled.

 

[Kreskin]

Re: RE: US Republican strategist coaching Conservative Party

I wish the $100 monthly relief had started 4 years ago. I've been paying anywhere from $500-700. What I got was the Liberals sitting around talking about it. $4800 would've helped a lot, taxable or not.

Are you kidding me?
Besides the fact a chunk of it is taxable, the CPC is also clawing back a the "young child allowance".
Add that to the fact that it's been reported many childcare centers are raising fees in unison with the CPC allowance and I don't know what kind of "relief" you're expecting.

But we digress off-topic. If you want to start a childcare topic I'll be happy to provide all links on the above, as well as a recent poll that shows 76% of Canadians support a national childcare strategy (not an allowance) like the 2004 agreement that was cancelled.

Provide all the links you want, I use the services and can tell you my daycare has not increased it's fees and I frankly couldn't care less what a poll has to say. What is epidemic in this country is people not wanting to accept money because they have to pay tax on it.