Montreal's big disaster was only the Stadium.. It was finally repaid in 2006.. Montreal was also summer Olympics and not winter as Vancouver's.
Quebec's Big Owe stadium debt is over
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The 2010 Charade (Winter Olympics)
- Thread starter JLM
- Start date
Montreal's big disaster was only the Stadium.. It was finally repaid in 2006.. Montreal was also summer Olympics and not winter as Vancouver's.
Quebec's Big Owe stadium debt is over
I was never against OLympics per se, just this particular boondoggle. There is just too much wrong with it. Spending over $1 billion for Highway construction is just the tip of the iceberg. Someposters seem to want to ignore a 600% error in the estimate of security costs. Do that in real life and you're out of business.
CanadianLove; said:
If that's the case, what did the city pay in terms of interest increments? Did the city lose teachers and police or other city employees in order to fund the costs for those games?
Same for Barcelona - when monies are directed towards the games, what goes unfunded? how much interest accumulates? and what of cost overruns??
The Games are an investment. The cost of services are an expense. No person or entity handling finances should focus on doing only one and not the other.
''investment''
That's precisely what people here say about communities paying for baseball and football stadiums. While the controlled news media says this is the greatest thing possible, cost overruns eventually lead to other projects going unfunded. Usually these are services such as sanitation, teachers, and educational programs. In St Paul and in Minneapolis, the politicians hae gotten us brand new stadiums. While they look impressive, we have lost over 1,000 teachers and other civil service employees and the quality of life has been reduced. That's a cost that is never quantified and is one I do not care to endure for myself and the community.
That's precisely what people here say about communities paying for baseball and football stadiums. While the controlled news media says this is the greatest thing possible, cost overruns eventually lead to other projects going unfunded. Usually these are services such as sanitation, teachers, and educational programs. In St Paul and in Minneapolis, the politicians hae gotten us brand new stadiums. While they look impressive, we have lost over 1,000 teachers and other civil service employees and the quality of life has been reduced. That's a cost that is never quantified and is one I do not care to endure for myself and the community.
The Downtown East Side (DTES) is another story that I am sick of hearing about. I don’t know if anything can be done about it other than to simply bulldoze the whole neighborhood. Some people are responsible for their problems and there is nothing anybody else can do for them. The argument is similar to the Space Program Versus Poverty debate. We cannot put everything on hold until every single person in the world is well-fed. That will never happen. I don’t think the Olympics should have been turned down from coming to Vancouver; I am just tired of hearing about it ALL THE TIME.
On the positive side:
The Olympics definitely pressured politicians to upgrade the local infrastructure. The rapid rail line to the airport should have been done a long time ago. Same for the Sea-to-Sky Highway upgrades and the additional bridges over the Fraser River. Not only did the Olympics spur politicians to take action, money came too. And more will come. Most of these infrastructure improvements would have been done eventually, but they would probably have been paid fully by local people. With the Olympics, federal money came here, AND a huge injection of tourist dollars will come too, lessening the load on local people.
In addition, the Olympics will shine a big spotlight on the Vancouver area.
On the negative side:
I do not like how things are being managed. The Vancouver Olympics Organizing Committee (VANOC) has been quite heavy-handed, and bullying of people. Even to the point of copyrighting a whole slew of words and phrases relating to Vancouver, 2010, or the Olympics. Pretty ridiculous.
I do not agree with the heavy native presence in the Olympics. It might be quaint and appeal to tourists, but it is not a true reflection of BC or Canada. I was born and raised in BC, and the only time I come into contact with native activities is at tourist events. Even the logo sucks; I cannot buy into this. The temporary logo, with the waves and mountains, was much better. I wish Canada would stop promoting this image of us as being simple villagers, fishermen, lumberjacks, etc. Those mascots are pretty ridiculous too. We should be promoting more of our high-tech side.
Everything seems to be getting taken over by the Olympics. There is even a debate ongoing about whether local school boards should re-schedule spring break in 2010 to coincide with the Olympics. Reasons include giving older students an opportunity to volunteer during the games. But I think the more compelling reason is to reduce local traffic during the games. Supposedly, 600,000 school-related trips are made each weekday; by having schools closed during the Olympics, this traffic should be eliminated, leaving more room for Games-related traffic.
Also, I am pretty certain that the big spotlight that the Olympics will shine on Vancouver will reveal more bad than good. Even after all the infrastructure upgrades that have been made, the region is still about twenty years behind where it should be in terms of infrastructure. There are still too many bottlenecks, not enough roads and bridges, poor access to the ports, etc.
And taxes and bureaucracy are way too much. Honestly, if I were a businessman coming into Vancouver for the Olympics and I checked out the business environment around here, I would turn around and spread the word that Vancouver is not a good place to invest. Perhaps Vancouver is a nice place to visit, spend some tourist dollars, support some minimum-wage workers, but no place to set up a manufacturing plant or research facility. I think that is the message that will spread around the business world for many years following the Olympics.
Anyhow, that is my two cents.
Now I will go back into my cave, throw another log on the fire, and down a beer, because apparently that is what we Canadians do (duuuuuhhhh...).
On the positive side:
The Olympics definitely pressured politicians to upgrade the local infrastructure. The rapid rail line to the airport should have been done a long time ago. Same for the Sea-to-Sky Highway upgrades and the additional bridges over the Fraser River. Not only did the Olympics spur politicians to take action, money came too. And more will come. Most of these infrastructure improvements would have been done eventually, but they would probably have been paid fully by local people. With the Olympics, federal money came here, AND a huge injection of tourist dollars will come too, lessening the load on local people.
In addition, the Olympics will shine a big spotlight on the Vancouver area.
On the negative side:
I do not like how things are being managed. The Vancouver Olympics Organizing Committee (VANOC) has been quite heavy-handed, and bullying of people. Even to the point of copyrighting a whole slew of words and phrases relating to Vancouver, 2010, or the Olympics. Pretty ridiculous.
I do not agree with the heavy native presence in the Olympics. It might be quaint and appeal to tourists, but it is not a true reflection of BC or Canada. I was born and raised in BC, and the only time I come into contact with native activities is at tourist events. Even the logo sucks; I cannot buy into this. The temporary logo, with the waves and mountains, was much better. I wish Canada would stop promoting this image of us as being simple villagers, fishermen, lumberjacks, etc. Those mascots are pretty ridiculous too. We should be promoting more of our high-tech side.
Everything seems to be getting taken over by the Olympics. There is even a debate ongoing about whether local school boards should re-schedule spring break in 2010 to coincide with the Olympics. Reasons include giving older students an opportunity to volunteer during the games. But I think the more compelling reason is to reduce local traffic during the games. Supposedly, 600,000 school-related trips are made each weekday; by having schools closed during the Olympics, this traffic should be eliminated, leaving more room for Games-related traffic.
Also, I am pretty certain that the big spotlight that the Olympics will shine on Vancouver will reveal more bad than good. Even after all the infrastructure upgrades that have been made, the region is still about twenty years behind where it should be in terms of infrastructure. There are still too many bottlenecks, not enough roads and bridges, poor access to the ports, etc.
And taxes and bureaucracy are way too much. Honestly, if I were a businessman coming into Vancouver for the Olympics and I checked out the business environment around here, I would turn around and spread the word that Vancouver is not a good place to invest. Perhaps Vancouver is a nice place to visit, spend some tourist dollars, support some minimum-wage workers, but no place to set up a manufacturing plant or research facility. I think that is the message that will spread around the business world for many years following the Olympics.
Anyhow, that is my two cents.
Now I will go back into my cave, throw another log on the fire, and down a beer, because apparently that is what we Canadians do (duuuuuhhhh...).
We hosted the World's Fair in 1986 and it was a huge propellant for growth in the subsequent years. With the world's eyes on Vancouver, this time by television, and if the weather is at all decent, the world will be blown away by what they see. The infrastructure will be used for years. Tourism will expand. People will move here. No investment is without risk but this is worth it.
I often wonder if we hadn't had Expo '86 what the difference would be in the criminal gang activity in B.C.'s lower mainland today.
'gang activity'
As I wrote on a previous thread -- we wasted millions of dollars on a pro hockey arena when we already had TWO in the Twin Cities. Because of that, funding was taken away from our youth programs. Today, we no longer have high school hockey in my neighborhood. St Paul is no longer known as the Capitol of hockey as our youth programs are now virtually non existent (and the drop out rate increased as well). This is the price we pay when we spend money on pro sports and divert money from our youths.
As I wrote on a previous thread -- we wasted millions of dollars on a pro hockey arena when we already had TWO in the Twin Cities. Because of that, funding was taken away from our youth programs. Today, we no longer have high school hockey in my neighborhood. St Paul is no longer known as the Capitol of hockey as our youth programs are now virtually non existent (and the drop out rate increased as well). This is the price we pay when we spend money on pro sports and divert money from our youths.
I am not sure how you can equate Expo 86 to Gang related crimes ?
I think the Hong Kong to China transfer and immigrations and cash transfer with people influx would have had a greater impact then Expo 86.
Also the increase in immigration increase in the 1990 would also have brought more gang possibilities then anything else.
Especially if they are to be along ethenic, drug related / organized crime or biker style.
Yep, I'm not sure either, it's just that Expo 86 was touted as an event to show off British Columbia to the world and since Expo 86 there has been a marked increase in foreign gang activity and we also know there has been a lot of immigration to B.C. from Asia since 1986. I don't believe the influx around 1900 produced all that many gangs.
Not only are the winter Olympics an 'oddity' compared to the summer Olympics, you have the added burden of holding it during a potential depression, not to mention the ceremonial aspect of the Chinese games still fresh in people's minds. From the pictures I have seen, I think I would love to live there. Maybe you're only hope is how the area is showcased as far as recouping costs. Then again, if I lived there, I would probably not want all the attention and development it may bring. I would move to Canada for the relative nearby peace and quiet, not a mini version of what I have here.
U.S. Olympic Committee plans to reduce staff and budget
By A.J. Perez, USA TODAY
WASHINGTON — Citing a foundering economy that has some sponsors slow to re-up, the U.S. Olympic Committee will reduce its workforce by up to 15% and institute other cost-cutting measures
U.S. Olympic Committee plans to reduce staff and budget - USATODAY.com
U.S. Olympic Committee plans to reduce staff and budget
By A.J. Perez, USA TODAY
WASHINGTON — Citing a foundering economy that has some sponsors slow to re-up, the U.S. Olympic Committee will reduce its workforce by up to 15% and institute other cost-cutting measures
U.S. Olympic Committee plans to reduce staff and budget - USATODAY.com
I saw on the news at noon that the women ski jumpers have been denied permission to compete. I wonder whose idea that was in the first place. I never did hear what the reason was for it. Obviously I'm missing something important, but these Olympics have been undergoing plans for 6 years and 7 months before the big charade,it's decided they can't compete. I'm wondering if they have the right idiot planning this thing and what is the rationale behind this decision? Most of it's been screwed up from the get go so I suppose there's no use quitting now.
Jeeeez. If they allowed women to jump off those things, they'd have to allow men to fall off the balance beams and try to twirl those ribbon things around. hehe Seriously, the Olympic committee's "reasoning" behind not allowing them to jump is that the "quality" of entertainment and competition wouldn't be as good as the men's jumping.
I think it was a bloody idiotic thing for the NDP to get us into, and I think that the Liberals are making a further mess of it, but I really hope BC doesn't get flushed into the proverbial bottomless pit of red ink. (Um, more than we are already I mean). I hope BC does come out of it ahead of the game.
(I know, reality will kick me in the behind for such an idea, but I can hope, can't I?)
I think it was a bloody idiotic thing for the NDP to get us into, and I think that the Liberals are making a further mess of it, but I really hope BC doesn't get flushed into the proverbial bottomless pit of red ink. (Um, more than we are already I mean). I hope BC does come out of it ahead of the game.
(I know, reality will kick me in the behind for such an idea, but I can hope, can't I?)
I didn't realize the N.D.P. were the perpetrators of this nonsense, thought it was Big Gord. I think any gov't. that wades into something like this should have the money in a separate account in the bank up front.
Sorry Cliffy but it was the Dippers that started us on the Olympic bid process. Campbell just made it work. I think the concept of hosting the games is a good one but the cost is out of hand. The OOC is largely responsible for this. We will find that the games are good for the economy though it would have been better if construction was just starting now while the economy is down and jobs are scarce. OTH our construction industry would have probably been in recession three years earlier without the games induced construction. Even the island will benefit from the games as several countries will be using Mt. Washington fro practices.
the last number of Olympic venues have realized tremendous benefits in both the long and short term... There is a reason why the competition is so fierce among the different cities in being awarded the event.
"Sorry Cliffy but it was the Dippers that started us on the Olympic bid process. Campbell just made it work."- We'll know by this time next year if "Campbell made it work". Guess the N.D.P. had a method to their madness- they knew they were going down big time by the year 1999, so they probably set this up for their successors and then they could just sit back and watch.
Those ten blocks of drug dealers and addicts are already breaking the law by living in condemned buildings. The concept of working for a living is completely foreign to these people. Separate any and all children that would be in danger, remove everybody from the hovels and bulldoze the dumps into the ground. Put these people to work...Invent jobs if we have to but get them to work. The experience will be good for them and it would likely be cheaper than the crimes they commit.
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