God is known to God

china

Time Out
Jul 30, 2006
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LGilbert

Gods exist but are non-existent. oh, that's profound.......... as much as any other theistic doubletalk.



To me ,God ,the creator , the Truth the Everlasting is an unknown. The unknown is not something to be experienced by the mind; only silence can be experienced, nothing but silence; observe yourself. If the mind experiences anything but silence, it is merely projecting its own desires and such a mind is not silent; so long as the mind is not silent, so long as thought in any form, conscious or unconscious, is in movement, there can be no silence. Silence is freedom from the past, from knowledge, from both conscious and unconscious memory; when the mind is completely silent, not in use, when there is the silence which is not a product of effort, then only can the timeless, the eternal come into being. That state is not a state of remembering – there is no entity that remembers, that experiences.God is not a thing of the mind, it does not come through self-projection, it comes only when there is virtue, which is freedom. Virtue is facing the fact of what is and the facing of the fact is a state of bliss. Only when the mind is blissful, quiet, without any movement of its own, without the projection of thought, conscious or unconscious – only then can the eternal come into being.
 

Diarygirl

Electoral Member
Oct 28, 2008
551
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Newfoundland
The world was created too perfect to not have a god, in my opionion. I believe He is our conscious and watching us, testing us, etc. He has His reasons and we may know after our spirit passes from this world.
What amazes me is the fact that we are so minute in comparison to the universe...yet we feel so big. It's uncomprehendable to some people therefore some do not believe.
I'm not a church believer, I am a God believer. I believe there is only one God and don't condemn others beliefs. Just my opinion and beliefs! I don't know all beliefs just my own and the closest that I have is compared to Buddism.
I'd like to speak more but am off to work! Have a good day people! Peace to you all!!!
 

Arabi

New Member
Mar 9, 2009
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The unknown can not be denied.
Silence is the motto of the investigators for learning the verity of what have been there in the past. said Jafar ( 6th leader of Islam).
But if the silence would mean inactivity, it means death & ignorance.
 

china

Time Out
Jul 30, 2006
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Diarygirl

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I am a God believer. I believe there is only one God and don't condemn others beliefs. Just my opinion and beliefs! I don't know all beliefs just my own and the closest that I have is compared to Buddism.
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[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Why believe in anything....? how can you compare your believe to something else....?[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The article below was written by a Buddhist to Buddhists.[/FONT]
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[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Medicine tell us that humans are mammals and are therefore related to many other animals which share our environment. Among the things that we share in common with animals are certain characteristic bodily functions. More specifically these functions are grouped into systems such as the circulatory system, the muscular system, the digestive system, and the nervous system. All animals need these systems in order to survive. Some animals depend more on one system than on the others for survival. Most animals make heavy use of the muscular system and the digestive system to move about and to assimilate food, but parasitic worms have little need for muscles to move or a digestive tract to process their nourishment. Perhaps more so than any other animal humans depend on a highly developed nervous system which has evolved into a higher capacity for memory with an enhanced ability for abstract thinking.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] So highly developed is the human ability for memory and abstract thinking that humans have given various names to the products {not products: just because tennis balls are delivered in cans and projected by racquets, does not enable us to conclude they are the products of either} of their nervous systems. Names such as concepts, theories, ideas, and beliefs have been applied to human thought processes. Over the ages the thoughts and beliefs of humans have grown more and more important to them, partly because thoughts were often heavily relied upon for survival, but also because the intense emphasis that was placed on thoughts and beliefs made them seem real to most all humans. As time went on many of the beliefs began to take on a reality and a life of their own, independent of the external reality that humans and other animals had hitherto known. Some of the beliefs became so real and so powerful to those whose nervous systems created them, that they became substitutes for reality. In the harsh struggle for survival suffering was frequently inevitable, and it could only be expected that humans would sooner or later learn to escape from the miseries of existence by living in a non-real world generated by their highly advanced nervous systems.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] The enhanced ability of humans to think their way out of problems thus led to a surprising new activity -- escape from the realm of reality into a world inhabited by beliefs. In all likelihood this activity came about merely as an accidental byproduct of a superior brain stem. Thus the human animal separated itself from other animals by using its nervous system for something that it had never been used before to any great degree by any other animal -- for the sustenance of beliefs that had no basis in reality. Up to this point the use of beliefs and thoughts as a human diversion away from the acute struggle for survival seems somewhat innocuous. But another unexpected surprise was in store for that advanced human nervous system. Humans began to idolize and worship their beliefs. They grew attached to the thoughts that they felt could cushion them from the fearful necessities of living. Their thoughts became crutches which they could always fall back on. Like cripples, many humans began to cling to their beliefs desperately. Beliefs were treated as possessions. Fearful that some outside group with different beliefs might deprive them of their mental possessions, many people were prepared to fight and die for the products of their own nervous systems. Animals had fought and died for food, for territory, and for mates, but never before had animals engaged in deadly battles to preserve one set of beliefs over another.

By this time the beliefs were given even more high-sounding names such as ideals, freedom, conscience, God, country, sacred path. Humans lacked the objectivity and insight to see that concepts such as "my ideal", "my freedom", "my God", "my path", and "my country" never appear walking down the streets in broad daylight, and that their reality was an illusory one that only existed within the brain stems of the humans who harbored the beliefs.
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[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] Most humans lacked the perspective to know and understand the dilemma that the human animal had inadvertently fallen victim to, but there were some. In human history mention is made of a few rare individuals who had the objectivity and the perspective with which to understand the human plight. Many of the words recorded from these prophets echoed again and again in one form or another: "Know thyself" was probably the most common advice offered by all prophets. And yet, this advice has been almost totally ignored, being drowned in one belief system after another throughout most cultures and religions of the world. Humans, being blinded by their possessiveness for their own thought creations, failed to pay attention to this most important dictum. Instead they took the words of their prophets and tried to interpret them as beliefs, almost literally. Rather than trying to look inward and trying to understand what they had created within their brain stems, they succumbed to the tyranny of their petty beliefs. They unwittingly followed paths which their nervous systems and its beliefs had laid to ensnare them.[/FONT]
 

Arabi

New Member
Mar 9, 2009
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Religion in our sense meaning how to live to get to the goal of creation planned by God.
Any manufacturer makes a manual for his products to guide his endusers to use the product in best way, and he is the qualified one because of he made designing & innovation.
How this minute & complicated universe could be left without any book for guidance by such sage & knowledgeable creator ?!
Qoran is the right handy Book for the human how to use this universe.
Have your ever gone through it ?!
 

talloola

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 14, 2006
19,576
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Vancouver Island
The unknown can not be denied.
Silence is the motto of the investigators for learning the verity of what have been there in the past. said Jafar ( 6th leader of Islam).
But if the silence would mean inactivity, it means death & ignorance.

You're right, the unknown can not be denied, but how we imagine what we don't
know is 'inside' all of us, and for me to imagine there is some 'god' out there
who is in charge of everything, is ludicrous.
It's not automatic as you think, it is what 'you' believe, not I, and not many others, each to his/her own.
 

Spade

Ace Poster
Nov 18, 2008
12,822
49
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Aether Island
Religion in our sense meaning how to live to get to the goal of creation planned by God.
Any manufacturer makes a manual for his products to guide his endusers to use the product in best way, and he is the qualified one because of he made designing & innovation.
How this minute & complicated universe could be left without any book for guidance by such sage & knowledgeable creator ?!
Qoran is the right handy Book for the human how to use this universe.
Have your ever gone through it ?!

Yes, holy books have turned out to be for-prophet do-it-yourself religious manuals.
 

Scott Free

House Member
May 9, 2007
3,893
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Religion in our sense meaning how to live to get to the goal of creation planned by God.

1 - You are assuming there is a god.

2 - Based on that assumption you claim god has a plan.

3 - Even further and more absurdly you claim we can go against gods plan if we don't know how to live life.

You will need to prove each premise.

Gut feelings, what some old tomb says, and that you have great conviction aren't proof.

Any manufacturer makes a manual for his products to guide his endusers to use the product in best way, and he is the qualified one because of he made designing & innovation.

It is absurd to assume the universe is a creation; it is even more absurd to say god waited until 610 CE to give us the "manual;" it is even more absurd to say your manual is the right one when clearly there are so many; and the most absurd thing is that you assume god is interested in whether you eat pork and what you do with your penis.

You sound like an egomaniac in that context.

How this minute & complicated universe could be left without any book for guidance by such sage & knowledgeable creator ?!

This is silly. First you must prove such a book exists before you can start making assertions about it.

Qoran is the right handy Book for the human how to use this universe.

I will assume you mean the Quran?

I can infer you haven't read many books if you think this.

Have your ever gone through it ?!

Yes - it's crap, garbage, and only fit for the fire.
 
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Dexter Sinister

Unspecified Specialist
Oct 1, 2004
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The world was created too perfect to not have a god, in my opionion.
Look a little more closely. Nature is brutally indifferent and inefficient, it's only our technology that shelters us from it. And it doesn't always work. Stroll through a childrens' cancer ward some time. As Robert Carroll puts it: "...for all its beauty and grandeur, the universe is also full of, well, to be delicate, let us say that the universe is also full of nasties. I suppose I should be more specific, but I think the reader knows the kind of thing I mean: babies born without brains, good people suffering monstrous tortures such as neurofibromatosis, evil people basking in the sun and enjoying power, reputation, etc. Volcanoes erupting, earthquakes rattling the planet, hurricanes and tornadoes blindly wiping out thousands of lives a day. Is it unfair to call these things the nasties, what is blithely referred to by theists as non-moral evil or physical evil? To say, as many defenders of Design do, that these nasties only seem nasty to us but we are ignorant of God's plan and vision and cannot know how good these nasties really are, is self-refuting. If we can't know what's good and what's not, we can't know whether the design, if any, is good or bad."
 

Arabi

New Member
Mar 9, 2009
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It is very regretful to see some people looking logic & learned but suddenly burst into insultation just because they can not bear others' opinions.

But same quran says : Give good news to My adorers, Those who listen to the word, then follow the best of it; those are they whom Allah has guided, and those it is who are the men of understanding. (Zumar verse 17-18)
 

china

Time Out
Jul 30, 2006
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[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] China ,[/FONT]
In human history mention is made of a few rare individuals who had the objectivity and the perspective with which to understand the human plight. Many of the words recorded from these prophets echoed again and again in one form or another: "Know thyself" was probably the most common advice offered by all prophets. And yet, this advice has been almost totally ignored, being drowned in one belief system after another .[/quote

Know yourself ...


....and it is still, today , totally ignored and drowned in one believe after another .
 

Dexter Sinister

Unspecified Specialist
Oct 1, 2004
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It is very regretful to see some people looking logic & learned but suddenly burst into insultation just because they can not bear others' opinions.
That's not the reason. It's because they can make a strong case that those opinions are one or more of the following: wrong, divisive, foolish, dangerous. And of course there are some who are so certain they're absolutely right that they perceive any disagreement with their religious opinions as an insult.

But same quran says : Give good news to My adorers, Those who listen to the word, then follow the best of it;
The best of it? Clearly then, parts of "the word" must be less good than others. How are we to identify them? Neither the Quran nor the Bible offer any guidance on that, and there's at least one poster here who'd say of the Quran that all of it is the best of it and there can be nothing better. The Quran makes that claim about itself, which he's offered as proof that it must be true. Seems to be a contradiction here.
 

Arabi

New Member
Mar 9, 2009
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And of course this word was given by prophet of Islam as: The one who succeded to know himself, then surly has known his God.
 

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
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And of course this word was given by prophet of Islam as: The one who succeded to know himself, then surly has known his God.

But do you know yourself. It is vain and self righteous to believe that your beliefs are superior to those of another, that those beliefs are self fulfilling and self aggrandizing. I believe that is considered one of the seven deadly sins.
 

Arabi

New Member
Mar 9, 2009
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The pure nature of the all people are the same and pure, and the righteaouness is adopted by all peoples' natures. Theft is hated by all the people, even the thief himself, because when himself becomes a theft victim, he becomes angry.

Quran says : Say: Every one acts according to his manner; but your Lord best knows who is best guided in the path.

Yes I have studied in some believes, and decided to follow the best.
 

Tyr

Council Member
Nov 27, 2008
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The pure nature of the all people are the same and pure, and the righteaouness is adopted by all peoples' natures. Theft is hated by all the people, even the thief himself, because when himself becomes a theft victim, he becomes angry.

Quran says : Say: Every one acts according to his manner; but your Lord best knows who is best guided in the path.

Yes I have studied in some believes, and decided to follow the best.

Yes I have studied in some believes, and decided to follow the best

At the very least you found the most dogmatic.

Islam, Christianity, Hindu, etc... are all just man made "tales" to allow people to see the world through their own prism and hence, just a huge crutch for those that cannot see reality