"Smart" Hydro meters


JLM
#1
There has been a little commotion lately about the pros and cons of the use of these meters. Do they make sense or not?
 
Cliffy
#2
Most people are focused on the health hazards claimed against these things, but to me is the greatest threat is to our personal security.Smart meters are wireless. They broadcast your personal data every hour on the hour. The opportunity for interference and interseption of that data could be astronomical. Hacker swill have a field day pulling all the info out of the ether.

Also, from what I hear, is almost instantly, your bills could possibly double or triple. Once in place, there is no recourse.
 
lone wolf
#3
Only difference I can see with the darned thing is now the Hydro guy doesn't have to get out of his pickup and walk to the meter to read it. My hydro went up - but I'm not sure if it's because of the meter or because some stupid government sold it off to the for-profit sector.
 
JLM
#4
Quote: Originally Posted by CliffyView Post

Most people are focused on the health hazards claimed against these things, but to me is the greatest threat is to our personal security.Smart meters are wireless. They broadcast your personal data every hour on the hour. The opportunity for interference and interseption of that data could be astronomical. Hacker swill have a field day pulling all the info out of the ether.

Also, from what I hear, is almost instantly, your bills could possibly double or triple. Once in place, there is no recourse.

I'm not just sure how my security would be threatened by someone finding out how much "juice" I'm using! I've generally found the charges for hydro to be fairly reasonable so don't expect any unreasonable increase in rates.
 
Cannuck
#5
Quote: Originally Posted by CliffyView Post

Most people are focused on the health hazards claimed against these things, but to me is the greatest threat is to our personal security.Smart meters are wireless. They broadcast your personal data every hour on the hour. The opportunity for interference and interseption of that data could be astronomical. Hacker swill have a field day pulling all the info out of the ether.

Also, from what I hear, is almost instantly, your bills could possibly double or triple. Once in place, there is no recourse.

BOOO!!!

I'm not sure what the big deal is. We've been using smart meters (water utilities) for some time now. Nobody has ever asked me to share my information. I am willing to sell it cheap so keep yours ears open. I may even be willing to pay a finders fee.
 
Mowich
#6
Quote: Originally Posted by JLMView Post

There has been a little commotion lately about the pros and cons of the use of these meters. Do they make sense or not?

I don't know whether they make sense or not, JLM but we are going to be stuck with them regardless of what we think or say. I do have to laugh when I hear BC Hydro saying that power outages will be handled more efficiently - that may be true if one lives close to a town or city but during a major outage we here in the hinterland will still be waiting until closer centers are taken care of before they even think about re-connecting those of us in outlying areas. During an average year, we experience at least 5 power outages lasting anywhere from several hours to an entire day, that is not going to change simply because we have so-called smart meters. It is not like Hydro is going to put on more staff to expedite re-connection.

I have no issue with privacy matters or health issues but I do wonder why anyone would want to hack into my meter to see how much power I am using - what's the benefit?
 
Cannuck
#7
Quote: Originally Posted by MowichView Post

I have no issue with privacy matters or health issues but I do wonder why anyone would want to hack into my meter to see how much power I am using - what's the benefit?

There is no benefit. We use the information internally to detect anomalies and for planning. I assume the power companies do the same sort of thing.
 
JLM
+1
#8
Quote: Originally Posted by MowichView Post

I have no issue with privacy matters or health issues but I do wonder why anyone would want to hack into my meter to see how much power I am using - what's the benefit?

My sentiments exactly. I suspect people who fear this are probably paranoid or are part of the same group that believes in "conspiracy theories".
 
Spade
#9
WE on Aether Island celebrate the new technology. Our motto is "One fewer worker, one more on the dole."
 
DaSleeper
+1
#10
Imagine this scenario....actualy happened to a neighbour a couple of years ago....He's on pre authorized payment.
He goes to make a purchase with his debit card in town and a 50$ amount is rejected (not enough funds) but he knows he should have $1100 in his account.....checking with the bank, he finds out that his hydro bill payment left only 20 odd bucks in his account....computer mistake with the decimal point...or the person who feeds the computer???
A call to the utility company and his money is promptly replaced in his account but he was quite put out of his way......What if he had been out of town???
That's what could happen with these meters, and there would be the extra step of having someone go and physically read the meter before you're refunded.
Which is why the only bills I have on pre authorized are those that have average billing, from the last year's consumption.
 
TenPenny
+2
#11
never use preauthorized billing; you're giving someone permission to take whatever money from you that they claim you owe.
 
JLM
#12
Quote: Originally Posted by TenPennyView Post

never use preauthorized billing; you're giving someone permission to take whatever money from you that they claim you owe.

NEVER??????????????? I've used it for years with utility bills, never a problem and probably a saving of tens of $ overe the years- no stamps, no bank charges. One thing you NEVER want to do if when subscribing to a free trial period on the net is to give the bastards your c.c. information.
 
DaSleeper
+1
#13
I'm out of town for months at a time in the summer....Who's gonna pay the regular bills?
For those that I prefer to pay myself...I get e-billing...those I can pay at any bank or net banking.
When I started preauthorized payments 12 years ago not too many had e billing and open wi Fi's were not as prevalent as nowadays....Now every McDonald has free wi fi.
 
JLM
#14
Quote: Originally Posted by DaSleeperView Post

I'm out of town for months at a time in the summer....Who's gonna pay the regular bills?
For those that I prefer to pay myself...I get e-billing...those I can pay at any bank or net banking.
When I started preauthorized payments 12 years ago not too many had e billing and open wi Fi's were not as prevalent as nowadays....Now every McDonald has free wi fi.

Yep, several of mine get paid by ebill too, works fine. One example is City Hall for taxes and quarterly utility bill. Another is some charities.
 
DaSleeper
#15
Quote: Originally Posted by JLMView Post

Yep, several of mine get paid by ebill too, works fine. One example is City Hall for taxes and quarterly utility bill. Another is some charities.

I pay city hall monthly...hurts less that way...vehicle, house insurance too
 
JLM
+1
#16
Quote: Originally Posted by DaSleeperView Post

I pay city hall monthly...hurts less that way...vehicle, house insurance too

If you can get a credit card like I've got that rebates you 1% at the end of the year & you are good with money and pay it in full every month, I've found that to be a good system. You don't even have to wait until you get the bill, you can just make the charge and pay on your account 5 minutes later, you still get the credit. That's an $8 saving on my car insurance alone.
 
L Gilbert
#17
8 cent diode frazzes. Bill for $18,264 shows up in mailbox.
Same issue I have with these goofy vehicles that park themselves. 8 cent diode frazzes. Car reverses, accelerates onto sidewalk, mows down 4 pedestrians, and parks itself inside lasies' wear shop.
 
Dexter Sinister
#18
The knock I've seen against these smart meters--and I haven't been able to verify it--is that they're really surveillance devices, in that not only do they report power consumption, they can identify when particular appliances are in use by the load characteristics, track patterns of activity and movement throughout the house by things like lighting usage, and build up a database of the pattern of your life, like when somebody's home and when the house is empty and what hours you keep. As I say, I don't know whether that's true or not, but if it is, these things are far smarter than they need to be for their claimed purpose, and it's a pretty serious invasion of privacy.
 
L Gilbert
#19
Quote: Originally Posted by Dexter SinisterView Post

The knock I've seen against these smart meters--and I haven't been able to verify it--is that they're really surveillance devices, in that not only do they report power consumption, they can identify when particular appliances are in use by the load characteristics, track patterns of activity and movement throughout the house by things like lighting usage, and build up a database of the pattern of your life, like when somebody's home and when the house is empty and what hours you keep. As I say, I don't know whether that's true or not, but if it is, these things are far smarter than they need to be for their claimed purpose, and it's a pretty serious invasion of privacy.

OK so then the 8 cent diode goes and the meter sends the info to Big Brother but gets the address wrong and stormtroopers go to house across the street and massacre everyone in sight because they have proof from the meter that the people were not actually people but some of David Icke's lizards.

*sucks in lungs full of air*
 
SLM
#20
Is it time for tin foil yet? lol
 
taxslave
+1
#21
Quote: Originally Posted by Dexter SinisterView Post

The knock I've seen against these smart meters--and I haven't been able to verify it--is that they're really surveillance devices, in that not only do they report power consumption, they can identify when particular appliances are in use by the load characteristics, track patterns of activity and movement throughout the house by things like lighting usage, and build up a database of the pattern of your life, like when somebody's home and when the house is empty and what hours you keep. As I say, I don't know whether that's true or not, but if it is, these things are far smarter than they need to be for their claimed purpose, and it's a pretty serious invasion of privacy.

Some of that might possibly be true in some houses. I have lots of power tools including welder and some of our house uses solar just to keep a load on the batteries. In any event there is much more personal data to be mined from facebook and twitter or even hacking cell phones than what electric meters will reveal. Hell if you use a wireless router in your house not only are you exposed to more and closer radio waves than a smart meter you are also much more susceptible to hackers.
 
JLM
#22
Quote: Originally Posted by taxslaveView Post

Some of that might possibly be true in some houses. I have lots of power tools including welder and some of our house uses solar just to keep a load on the batteries. In any event there is much more personal data to be mined from facebook and twitter or even hacking cell phones than what electric meters will reveal. Hell if you use a wireless router in your house not only are you exposed to more and closer radio waves than a smart meter you are also much more susceptible to hackers.

Yeah, I'm a little confused as to why anyone would care whether I'm running the T.V., the radio or the mix master. I think there is a lot of hysteria about this.
 
L Gilbert
+3
#23  Top Rated Post
Quote: Originally Posted by SLMView Post

Is it time for tin foil yet? lol

There's a new model out. Aluminum foil. Where you been? lol
 
SLM
#24
Quote: Originally Posted by L GilbertView Post

There's a new model out. Aluminum foil. Where you been? lol

Well I've been all busy with not worrying about Big Brother, lol.

Can't keep up with all the latest you know.
 
eh1eh
#25
Quote: Originally Posted by JLMView Post

I'm not just sure how my security would be threatened by someone finding out how much "juice" I'm using! I've generally found the charges for hydro to be fairly reasonable so don't expect any unreasonable increase in rates.


Your bill will go up. We use more than half our power off peak times and ours went up about 25%.
The information sent from the meter includes when you use certain appliances which now include chips that contain their model number like when you plug a device into your comp it knows what it is.
Conceivably someone could use the information to determine when the house in empty. There are the general privacy concerns too. Do you want your personal habits tracked by bureaucrats and have that info sitting on servers somewhere? This could be called a parinoid view but the more info out there about you the less privacy you will have, it all adds up.
 
taxslave
#26
Quote: Originally Posted by L GilbertView Post

There's a new model out. Aluminum foil. Where you been? lol

DO you know how much aluminum costs these days?
 
Tonington
#27
Quote: Originally Posted by taxslaveView Post

DO you know how much aluminum costs these days?

A helluva lot less than tin on a per pound basis. Aluminum is far more abundant on Earth than tin.
 
JLM
#28
Quote: Originally Posted by ToningtonView Post

A helluva lot less than tin on a per pound basis. Aluminum is far more abundant on Earth than tin.

Yep, in fact I was taught of all the metals, aluminum is the most abundant in the earth's crust! Like 8%.
 
L Gilbert
#29
Quote: Originally Posted by taxslaveView Post

DO you know how much aluminum costs these days?

Approximately $2,150/tonne. Tin is approximately 10X that.

Quote: Originally Posted by JLMView Post

Yep, in fact I was taught of all the metals, aluminum is the most abundant in the earth's crust! Like 8%.

Sorry, but iron is.
 
JLM
#30
Quote: Originally Posted by L GilbertView Post

Sorry, but iron is.

Ummmmmmmmmmmh- I was told 5% but then that was back in the day!

Quote: Originally Posted by L GilbertView Post

Approximately $2,150/tonne. Tin is approximately 10X that.

Sorry, but iron is.

I checked it out, looks like you're right and I'm wrong, f**kin' school teacher didn't know what he was talkin' about!
 
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