House Member
Posts: 2,853 
Location: California
Location: California
September 28th, 2006, 12:07 PM
Catholics have not always had the same views on abortion and there is nothing in the Bible that directly forbids abortion or says a fetus is the same as a person. Ensoulment was once believed to occur at 6weeks of pregnancy for a male and 3 months for a female. I am perfectly content leaving it to individuals to form their own opinions on abortion.
Quoting Proud American
Trust me, a fetus does not have fully functionning organs, including their brains. If they did, I wouldn't have a job (I work neonatal ICU). That's the main reason a fetus can't survive outside of the womb before about 24 weeks, and even then they require a lot of external support and are not guaranteed a good outcome. Really, I don't see how that matters anyways. An adult with organ failure doesn't stop being a person because their organs don't work.
FIrst of all, get your facts STRAIGHT..a FETUS has a beating heart, fully functioning organs, fingers, toes, and a brain, probably bigger than yours, so therefore, they are HUMANS, not "parasites"
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Catholics have not always had the same views on abortion and there is nothing in the Bible that directly forbids abortion or says a fetus is the same as a person. Ensoulment was once believed to occur at 6weeks of pregnancy for a male and 3 months for a female. I am perfectly content leaving it to individuals to form their own opinions on abortion.
Theism Exorcist
Posts: 368
Location: The Capitol
Location: The Capitol
September 28th, 2006, 12:13 PM
Quoting LittleRunningGag
Nice Going u pretty much typed everything i was gona saved me some time
Is it able to survive without the direct intervention of its mother's body? No. Parasite.
What compassion. Didn't your god teach you not to judge people?
They are the words that you believe your god said. They aren't the words of any god I know.
No, but you seem to have no problem wishing ill will upon those whom you deem to be less than adequate. Doesn't sound like you are following the teachings of your god very well.
And I am completely willing to deal with it. Are you willing to deal with the consequences if you chose the wrong god? There are, after all, thousands of them. Many who take a less favourable view of disbelief than the Abrahamic deity.
The woman is simply denying the embryo/fetus a place in her body. If you choose to see that as murder, that is your decision. I for one don't feel comfortable dictating what people can and can't do with their own bodies. Down that road lies forced sterilization (which you don't seem to have any problem with), the government choosing sexual partners, government informing people what is and isn't appropriate activities, etc. No thanks.
You'll have to forgive me if I don't agree. Do you have anything that isn't a simple appeal to emotions? Or perhaps some comments not chalk full of personal insults? You are an adult, right? You can have a mature discussion without behaving like a four year old?
What compassion. Didn't your god teach you not to judge people?
They are the words that you believe your god said. They aren't the words of any god I know.
No, but you seem to have no problem wishing ill will upon those whom you deem to be less than adequate. Doesn't sound like you are following the teachings of your god very well.
And I am completely willing to deal with it. Are you willing to deal with the consequences if you chose the wrong god? There are, after all, thousands of them. Many who take a less favourable view of disbelief than the Abrahamic deity.
The woman is simply denying the embryo/fetus a place in her body. If you choose to see that as murder, that is your decision. I for one don't feel comfortable dictating what people can and can't do with their own bodies. Down that road lies forced sterilization (which you don't seem to have any problem with), the government choosing sexual partners, government informing people what is and isn't appropriate activities, etc. No thanks.
You'll have to forgive me if I don't agree. Do you have anything that isn't a simple appeal to emotions? Or perhaps some comments not chalk full of personal insults? You are an adult, right? You can have a mature discussion without behaving like a four year old?
Electoral Member
Posts: 598
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Location: Calgary, Alberta
September 28th, 2006, 12:37 PM
And that's all most of us ask. There are too many people trying to dictate how they think everyone else should behave. Which would be okay if they didn't try and make laws about it. Stay out of my life and I'll stay out of yours.
Quoting tracy
Really, I don't see how that matters anyways. An adult with organ failure doesn't stop being a person because their organs don't work.
...
I am perfectly content leaving it to individuals to form their own opinions on abortion.
...
I am perfectly content leaving it to individuals to form their own opinions on abortion.
And that's all most of us ask. There are too many people trying to dictate how they think everyone else should behave. Which would be okay if they didn't try and make laws about it. Stay out of my life and I'll stay out of yours.
House Member
Posts: 2,853
Location: California
Location: California
September 28th, 2006, 01:25 PM
Quoting LittleRunningGag
I agree with that completely. I've always said if you're against abortion, don't have one. End of discussion as far as I'm concerned. I've participated in second and third trimestre terminations and still feel extremely protective of those families. None of them were doing it because they just decided they didn't want to be pregnant at 7 months gestation, so it upsets me when people judge women who have had abortions. You really don't know what you'd do in their situation and what is right for one family isn't necessarily the right thing for another.
And that's all most of us ask. There are too many people trying to dictate how they think everyone else should behave. Which would be okay if they didn't try and make laws about it. Stay out of my life and I'll stay out of yours.
Member
Posts: 69
Location: Baltimore,MD
Location: Baltimore,MD
September 28th, 2006, 02:09 PM
Well there it is in a nutshell....you're a godless person so anything goes with you and your kind....not surprising at all .....I just would love to be there on Judgement Day to see you say all of these wonderful things to the Creator and try to pathetically argue these same hairball ideas with HIm and tell Him that it is my "right" to have an "opinion" .....right??
Quoting LittleRunningGag
Is it able to survive without the direct intervention of its mother's body? No. Parasite.
What compassion. Didn't your god teach you not to judge people?
They are the words that you believe your god said. They aren't the words of any god I know.
No, but you seem to have no problem wishing ill will upon those whom you deem to be less than adequate. Doesn't sound like you are following the teachings of your god very well.
And I am completely willing to deal with it. Are you willing to deal with the consequences if you chose the wrong god? There are, after all, thousands of them. Many who take a less favourable view of disbelief than the Abrahamic deity.
The woman is simply denying the embryo/fetus a place in her body. If you choose to see that as murder, that is your decision. I for one don't feel comfortable dictating what people can and can't do with their own bodies. Down that road lies forced sterilization (which you don't seem to have any problem with), the government choosing sexual partners, government informing people what is and isn't appropriate activities, etc. No thanks.
You'll have to forgive me if I don't agree. Do you have anything that isn't a simple appeal to emotions? Or perhaps some comments not chalk full of personal insults? You are an adult, right? You can have a mature discussion without behaving like a four year old?
What compassion. Didn't your god teach you not to judge people?
They are the words that you believe your god said. They aren't the words of any god I know.
No, but you seem to have no problem wishing ill will upon those whom you deem to be less than adequate. Doesn't sound like you are following the teachings of your god very well.
And I am completely willing to deal with it. Are you willing to deal with the consequences if you chose the wrong god? There are, after all, thousands of them. Many who take a less favourable view of disbelief than the Abrahamic deity.
The woman is simply denying the embryo/fetus a place in her body. If you choose to see that as murder, that is your decision. I for one don't feel comfortable dictating what people can and can't do with their own bodies. Down that road lies forced sterilization (which you don't seem to have any problem with), the government choosing sexual partners, government informing people what is and isn't appropriate activities, etc. No thanks.
You'll have to forgive me if I don't agree. Do you have anything that isn't a simple appeal to emotions? Or perhaps some comments not chalk full of personal insults? You are an adult, right? You can have a mature discussion without behaving like a four year old?
Well there it is in a nutshell....you're a godless person so anything goes with you and your kind....not surprising at all
.....I just would love to be there on Judgement Day to see you say all of these wonderful things to the Creator and try to pathetically argue these same hairball ideas with HIm and tell Him that it is my "right" to have an "opinion" .....right?? Theism Exorcist
Posts: 368
Location: The Capitol
Location: The Capitol
September 28th, 2006, 02:39 PM
Quoting Proud American
Do u have a calendar date on that ?
I just would love to be there on Judgement Day to see you say all of these wonderful things to the Creator and try to pathetically argue these same hairball ideas with HIm and tell Him that it is my "right" to have an "opinion" .....right??
Electoral Member
Posts: 598
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Location: Calgary, Alberta
September 28th, 2006, 02:40 PM
Unfortunately its people like you that are causing that freedom to fall apart.
Quoting Proud American
No. Thats not it at all. The difference between me and you, aside from your mean spirited attitude, is that I don't think that I have any right to tell someone what they do with their body. You obviously feel that everyone should behave in a manner suited to your belief system. Lucky for you that you live in a country that grants you the freedom to feel that way.
Well there it is in a nutshell....you're a godless person so anything goes with you and your kind....not surprising at all
Unfortunately its people like you that are causing that freedom to fall apart.
Quote:
I, on the other hand, wish you goodwill. And hope that your god doesn't reject your love for her because of the petty way you treat people with views differing from your's.
I just would love to be there on Judgement Day to see you say all of these wonderful things to the Creator and try to pathetically argue these same hairball ideas with HIm and tell Him that it is my "right" to have an "opinion" .....right??
Electoral Member
Posts: 598
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Location: Calgary, Alberta
September 28th, 2006, 02:45 PM
* I don't think that there is anything inherently wrong with faith or belief in god(s), just organized religion.
Quoting tracy
This is the unfortunate side effect of the echo chamber that is organized religion.*
Maybe I don't understand Christianity well, but I thought it was kind of un-Christian to take pleasure in others' suffering regardless of how vehemently you disagree with their opinions.
* I don't think that there is anything inherently wrong with faith or belief in god(s), just organized religion.
House Member
Posts: 3,167
September 28th, 2006, 03:30 PM
I'll be the first to recognize the importance religion plays in the life of the west despite my own pitiful record in attendance and contribution. Without religion, an already crude and ruthless society would be moreso. I'm aware of the failings of faith. But I'm also aware they're miniscule compared to what would happen if faith weren't there. So it pays to give some respect to what church leaders think and do.
Myself? If I was in a position of power and I was confident God did not exist and that religion was a sham, I would be the worst tyrant possible. Why not? I'd realize that life belongs to those bold enough to take it. That you have one lifetime and a few decades in it to leave your mark. I'd depopulate the globe lickety-split. That's what it needs. That's what it would get. And I'd do it ruthlessly and without the bomb.
I always get a kick out of those who insist religion isn't important. That we could create a great society without it. I guess they don't figure on people like me. There are a lot of us out there. Religion despite its faults keeps more folks safe than any other measure on the planet.
The burden of respect and civility. Of being human. Keeps you alive for another day.
I'll be the first to recognize the importance religion plays in the life of the west despite my own pitiful record in attendance and contribution. Without religion, an already crude and ruthless society would be moreso. I'm aware of the failings of faith. But I'm also aware they're miniscule compared to what would happen if faith weren't there. So it pays to give some respect to what church leaders think and do.
Myself? If I was in a position of power and I was confident God did not exist and that religion was a sham, I would be the worst tyrant possible. Why not? I'd realize that life belongs to those bold enough to take it. That you have one lifetime and a few decades in it to leave your mark. I'd depopulate the globe lickety-split. That's what it needs. That's what it would get. And I'd do it ruthlessly and without the bomb.
I always get a kick out of those who insist religion isn't important. That we could create a great society without it. I guess they don't figure on people like me. There are a lot of us out there. Religion despite its faults keeps more folks safe than any other measure on the planet.
The burden of respect and civility. Of being human. Keeps you alive for another day.
House Member
Posts: 2,853
Location: California
Location: California
September 28th, 2006, 04:18 PM
Quoting tamarin
Interesting... Of course, there are people who murder because of religion too, so I don't know if that's the best measure of the value of religion.
I'll be the first to recognize the importance religion plays in the life of the west despite my own pitiful record in attendance and contribution. Without religion, an already crude and ruthless society would be moreso. I'm aware of the failings of faith. But I'm also aware they're miniscule compared to what would happen if faith weren't there. So it pays to give some respect to what church leaders think and do.
Myself? If I was in a position of power and I was confident God did not exist and that religion was a sham, I would be the worst tyrant possible. Why not? I'd realize that life belongs to those bold enough to take it. That you have one lifetime and a few decades in it to leave your mark. I'd depopulate the globe lickety-split. That's what it needs. That's what it would get. And I'd do it ruthlessly and without the bomb.
I always get a kick out of those who insist religion isn't important. That we could create a great society without it. I guess they don't figure on people like me. There are a lot of us out there. Religion despite its faults keeps more folks safe than any other measure on the planet.
The burden of respect and civility. Of being human. Keeps you alive for another day.
Myself? If I was in a position of power and I was confident God did not exist and that religion was a sham, I would be the worst tyrant possible. Why not? I'd realize that life belongs to those bold enough to take it. That you have one lifetime and a few decades in it to leave your mark. I'd depopulate the globe lickety-split. That's what it needs. That's what it would get. And I'd do it ruthlessly and without the bomb.
I always get a kick out of those who insist religion isn't important. That we could create a great society without it. I guess they don't figure on people like me. There are a lot of us out there. Religion despite its faults keeps more folks safe than any other measure on the planet.
The burden of respect and civility. Of being human. Keeps you alive for another day.
Electoral Member
Posts: 598
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Location: Calgary, Alberta
September 28th, 2006, 06:29 PM
Tamarin,
Your justification for religion is that if it weren't there people would have nothing to fear and would be complete pricks to everyone around them? Is that why you don't steal? Because you'd go to jail? Oh, did you forget about that part? The justice system, that secular entity that stops people like yourself from taking advantage of peoples' otherwise good nature.
I think that you forget, there are plenty of evil religious people that do all kinds of evil things. Has Goodwin's Law been modified to include references to 9/11 yet?
Tamarin,
Your justification for religion is that if it weren't there people would have nothing to fear and would be complete pricks to everyone around them? Is that why you don't steal? Because you'd go to jail? Oh, did you forget about that part? The justice system, that secular entity that stops people like yourself from taking advantage of peoples' otherwise good nature.
I think that you forget, there are plenty of evil religious people that do all kinds of evil things. Has Goodwin's Law been modified to include references to 9/11 yet?
Newbie
Posts: 17
September 28th, 2006, 10:47 PM
I am scared. I am so scared. lol.
This reminds me of a Japanese cult whose members committed mass suicide.
Quoting Minority Observer84
Do u have a calendar date on that ?
I am scared. I am so scared. lol.
This reminds me of a Japanese cult whose members committed mass suicide.
Electoral Member
Posts: 598
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Location: Calgary, Alberta
September 30th, 2006, 11:13 PM
Quoting feronia
That depends on the religion. There is a vast difference between religions. Hell, not even all religions believe in a deity.
Exactly what is the religionists’ thought about a woman that has an abortion after a rape?
