The Proudest Hour of the Prolife Movement.
- Thread starter SirJosephPorter
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WOW!! Good post, Joey. (As in lucid and well-written)
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/02/us/02tiller.html?hp
Um, the idea of Christians who kill people calling themselves Christians seems to be oxymoronic to me, but then the basis of their faith doesn't make sense either. And he was killed in church on top of it all. George Tiller, Abortion, and Compassion - One City: A Buddhist Blog for Everyone
To borrow the old saying... standing in a garage all day doesn't make me a car.
Actions speak louder than words. The world is full of people with delusions who can call themselves a lot of things that don't truly fit.
Virtually everyone in the pro-life movement i know would condemn this action as completely counterproductive to its cause. Producing sympathy for a something that deserves none.
Still in reflection i could only wonder about the location of this killing. In a church. My immediate thought was what church would have a member in good standing of someone who performed abortions, which any authentic Christian Church condemns as murder. Not only that but he performed the grisly acts of late term and partial birth abortions, crushing skulls and dismembering viable and sentient infants.
I can only assume that the Reformation Lutheran Church is one of these New Age, morally relativistic, radical individualitic cults where you just do your own thing, and make your own peace with God. Even if that involves mass murder, and the torture deaths of fully developed fetuses.
I won't spend much time mourning Dr. Tiller, he'll have enough to answer for, if his faith was not just for appearances.. as incomprehensible and lacking in integrity as those appearances might be. But i do lament the the actions of the killer, who has done great damage to the cause he purports to support.
Still in reflection i could only wonder about the location of this killing. In a church. My immediate thought was what church would have a member in good standing of someone who performed abortions, which any authentic Christian Church condemns as murder. Not only that but he performed the grisly acts of late term and partial birth abortions, crushing skulls and dismembering viable and sentient infants.
I can only assume that the Reformation Lutheran Church is one of these New Age, morally relativistic, radical individualitic cults where you just do your own thing, and make your own peace with God. Even if that involves mass murder, and the torture deaths of fully developed fetuses.
I won't spend much time mourning Dr. Tiller, he'll have enough to answer for, if his faith was not just for appearances.. as incomprehensible and lacking in integrity as those appearances might be. But i do lament the the actions of the killer, who has done great damage to the cause he purports to support.
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Late term abortion in the US is done almost exclusively when mom and babe are about to die. It is done to save the mother, rather than lose both. I am pro-life. As such, I support the salvaging of a mother's life, even at the cost of a baby's, as a necessary evil. I suspect Dr.Tiller shared that view, and likely had no hard time reconciling it with his religion, as even the Catholic Church here will not condemn an abortion performed to save the life of the mother. Two deaths instead of one just makes no sense.
It does more than that, it paints an image of prolifers as being irrational and murderous.
I guess you missed this part here as you flapped your cakehole before brain kicked in:
"During the speech, he appealed to each side to respect one another’s basic decency and to work together to reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies."
"Some described Dr. Tiller as one of about only three doctors in the country who had, under certain circumstances, provided abortions to women in their third trimester of pregnancy, and said his death would mean that women, particularly in the central United States, would have few if any options in such cases." - http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/01/us/01tiller.html
The guy performed the abortions on women who were in danger of dying or giving birth to tragically disfigured and disabled babies.
That's actually incorrect about the Catholic Church first, which condemns all abortions and considers life to be God given, conceived as a beneficiary of full human dignity and rights, and sacred from conception. It has elevated to sainthood women, such St. Gianna Barretta Molla, who gave birth to infants, in her case in the early 1960s, even at the risk and cost of their own lives.
And also there is almost no common law or legislation that protects late term infants in the U.S. from abortion regardless of the motives of the mother. Whenever these laws are made they are immediately overturned in higher courts or by legislative agency by the pro-abortion movement. The entire legal domain of rights and regulation for the unborn, from abortions, to fertility treatments, to embryonic stem cell research in an outlaw state, beyond the rule of justice.
In modern medicine the baby can usually be saved, even from terminally ill mother. The instances of a birth causing the death of a mother is so small now, that it is almost non existent. It remains and myth and vehicle though for the pro-abortion movement.
So one had to subscribe to your particular flavour of Christianity for it be considered legit and not a "show"? Your way or the highway?
The sad thing is that this isn't the first time that Christian terrorists have killed abortion providers or attempted to nor will it be the last I imagine. The suspect should be sent to Gitmo.
He was doing God's work so I imagine he'll get his virgins or whatnot... oh, wait... that's the other terrorist religion.
Okay, I will admit to being working in terms which can be taken relatively.
In North America, having an abortion performed to save your life, will not see you excommunicated from the church. It is not condemned in any manner stronger than a general 'let's try not to let that happen again shall we', and some prayers said for your lost child. 'Paper condemnation', and what actually takes place in the churches, are two different things.
I won't spend too much time evaluating your posts. Your opinions are just that, opinions. You're not the one true source of facts on Christianity, so all of your blather is simply the opinion of one random individual, with no more credibility than me.
Enjoy your tea.
That's a load of bs. The law as it is currently applied makes little differentiation between any stage of pregnancy, not that this matters anyway. And the test of late term abortions now is that of 'serious' health implications, which means just about anything from post partum depression to physical discomfort. These 'tragically' disfigured infants can mean anything from Down's Syndrome, to a cleft pallette.. in practice now fewer than 10% of Down's Syndrome children are bought to term. It all comes down to a matter of convenience, which Dr. Tiller supported completely.
Prolifers have been after Dr. Tiller for a long time now. He is not just an abortion performing doctor, he performed late term abortions. When a woman had a life threatening condition, or a condition which would do her serious, long lasting harm as a result of pregnancy, Dr. Tiller would perform an abortion.
He was one of only three doctors performing such procedures, so he was a big prize for prolife movement; they have been out to get him for a long time now. A woman shot Dr. Tiller twice about 15 years ago. Dr. Tiller survived. She is still in prison working out her sentence.
Then last year, some district attorney in Kansas brought Dr. Tiller up on a trumped up charge, he charged him with 18 counts of felony. Jury acquitted Dr. Tiller on each and every one of those counts.
So finally someone in prolife movement decided to apply ‘The Final Solution’ to Dr. Tiller. As I said they must be celebrating in the prolife movement today, they hooked a big fish, perhaps the biggest in USA.
While most prolife organizations have condemned the murder, that is to be expected. It would be political suicide not to. However, internally at least some of them are probably celebrating what they regard as a great victory for the prolife movement. They were able to eliminate a prominent abortion supporter, a staunch abortion provider.
I really wonder underneath those masks of sanctimonious display of grief and indignation, how many Champaign corks are really popping.
He was one of only three doctors performing such procedures, so he was a big prize for prolife movement; they have been out to get him for a long time now. A woman shot Dr. Tiller twice about 15 years ago. Dr. Tiller survived. She is still in prison working out her sentence.
Then last year, some district attorney in Kansas brought Dr. Tiller up on a trumped up charge, he charged him with 18 counts of felony. Jury acquitted Dr. Tiller on each and every one of those counts.
So finally someone in prolife movement decided to apply ‘The Final Solution’ to Dr. Tiller. As I said they must be celebrating in the prolife movement today, they hooked a big fish, perhaps the biggest in USA.
While most prolife organizations have condemned the murder, that is to be expected. It would be political suicide not to. However, internally at least some of them are probably celebrating what they regard as a great victory for the prolife movement. They were able to eliminate a prominent abortion supporter, a staunch abortion provider.
I really wonder underneath those masks of sanctimonious display of grief and indignation, how many Champaign corks are really popping.
SJP,
Don't get your panties all in a knot over this, maybe this is all about really, really, really late term abortion of Tiller?
Just a thought.
Hey coldstream- my wife had to have 2 consecutive abortions (early term) cos the pregnancy was going to KILL her. I don't care about anyones "faith" or "beliefs" but if ANYONE had stepped in and tried to stop the docs from saving her by ending the obviously failed pregnancy, well let's just say she would not have been the only one to die either time (tho I guess if she'd died the first time the second wouldn't have happened and there'd be a tiny, deformed fetus on life supposrt somewheres along with a pile of dead fundies and one dead mabudon)