Should Canada unhitch its American wagon?

[dancing-loon]

Should Canada unhitch its American wagon?

Asia's renaissance has produced two emerging powers: China and India. Along with Brazil and Mexico, these states challenge Canada's economic and foreign policy.
How can Canada balance its economic and political priorities in a way that supports Canadian interests, values, and assets?

Should Canada deepen its integration in North America, or should it refocus its priorities on other continents, especially on Asia?

Polls show that a striking number of us view our giant neighbour as an irresponsible, even dangerous, superpower. The war in Iraq, Guantanamo Bay, Hurricane Katrina, President George W. Bush — all these have served to alienate Canadians (and others around the world) from a country that used to be an admired friend and ally.

Meanwhile, the economic troubles south of the border — corporate corruption, the sub-prime mortgage crisis, the rising threat of recession — have made the United States look like an unreliable economic partner, too. So if the United States is in decline, both as a world leader and a trading partner, shouldn't Canada think about hedging its bets by drawing closer to other countries and regions?

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My answer: Let's not just think about it - do it!! Such a move might bring the Americans to their senses! That would be my main reason.

My second answer would be: Let's wait and see how they will behave under a new leadership. Also, if we break away they might get mad and let us feel it at every opportunity!!

So, my first answer was out of spite and disgust with them; my second one with fearful consideration. Unfortunately, they do scare me!

 

[einmensch]

The USA and the International Bankers are going to decide what Canada may and may not do.

 

[dancing-loon]

The USA and the International Bankers are going to decide what Canada may and may not do.

WHY? Can we not make up our own mind anymore??

 

[MikeyDB]

Dancing_Loon

Greetings!

Canadians are happy to continue to ride the elephant, even if that means sniffling and itching whenever the Yanks get a cold or rash.They're happy because at a fundamental level no Canadian embraces their "nationality" in a way anywhere near with the enthusiasm that Americans embrace theirs. It is after all the source of Canadian identity. Canadians embrace the myth of cultural and economic, political and philosophical independence from whom....from the United States! Canadians will smile and some may even frown at mention of the British Monarchy and our continuing ties with that nation but when it comes to self-identification....Canadians identify with America. This is a multi-faceted identification. Americans held a "revolution" to sever ties with England while Canadians in the typical apathetic "don't rock the boat" "dumb country cousin" fundamental identity of Canada embrace the American green-back. Canadians with slack-jawed admiration wallow in the shadow of a people who've stated and exercised the expression of their independence, something Canadians simply have no facility to engage.

Canadians are the ultimate putative-child of "state-think"....willing to run the narrow and winding but ultimately "safe" non-identity between historical ties and pangs of child-like dependence (morality and values frameworks) of the mommy state..."Britain" and the garrulous defiance of America. This is a very spiritual thing to Canadians. There is of course the "nut's and bolts" of skimming as much wealth and power off the seething corruption and amorality of our biggest trading partner. We hold ourselves available to supporting America when their infantile and wholly self-centered "foreign policies" generate antipathy and mistrust throughout the world....welcome their people when their center of commerce is destroyed by an "enemy" Americans are unable to accept as the creation of their own folly.... It's a somewhat disjointed and often confused relationship but ultimately something that powers the Canadian engine of commerce and "prosperity" so is hence something to be cooed and swooned over.... When America 'suggests' their putatuve child...Israel is entitled to carte-blanche... well of course in keeping with this fundamental sychophantic non-identity Canadians have cultivated for centuries...we moronically embrace it!

When Canadians go to the gas pumps they're happy to whine and commiserate with their American friends..."It's like all them Eeyrackees and that evil Chavezz feller drivin up the prices..." when in fact it is American corporations that are raping the people of America and registering the largest profits in the history of commerce.... while Canada produces more than enough gasoline for domestic purposes....

Canadians are essentially retarded with it comes to their self-identity and national-identity as well. We will continue to wag our tail and bounce around the big dog yapping at its tail...because that's easier than finding and standing-up-for ourselves with an identity that can be seen by the world as separate and different from the people of the United States. Our governments are changing our "image" on the world stage, we've demonstrated that we're still fledglings when it comes to corruption in our state authorities but we're trying.... We've modified the role of our military to harmonize with the American agenda of claiming right to decide and act for everyone else in the world whether they want or expect it....we reprise our role as second fiddle to the Yanks while pretending we're fumbling around looking for that one-time-myth-of-convenience...called peace-keepers...and there's little doubt that the fraud larceny and general corruption that Americans hail as "business as usual" in out-sourcing militarism while plundering the society they're ostensibly "protecting"...is rubbing-off on our puppet military.

Don't hold your breath DC....Canadians are when the going gets tough....simply pathetic.

 

[karrie]

Should Canada deepen its integration in North America, or should it refocus its priorities on other continents, especially on Asia?

Isn't this a bit of a false dichotomy? Assuming that we need to change in either direction, what exactly limits us to one or the other? We're not a single unit capable of focusing our attention on only one area (thank goodness). We have departments and managers who should be more than capable of bringing about change on a couple fronts if it's deemed necessary.

I'm not convinced it is necessary, but, if it were.

 

[Walter]

Don't hold your breath DC....Canadians are when the going gets tough....simply pathetic.

Speak for yourself.

 

[MikeyDB]

Walter

That's a laugh coming from you Walt! If you didn't have the anti-AGW ...lobby paid for by petroleum cartels to plaster all over these forums...well you'd really have nothing to say now would you!?

You don't have a clue what it's like or even what "speaking for yourself" actually means when it comes right down to it. You've left little doubt that you're a closet American who's found that popular self-deception of saying "Oh those nasty Americans.." out of one side of your mouth while embracing their politics, their energy and foreign policies with a fervor unmatched by any but those few Americans sill believing Saddam Hussein is Al Qeada and there are those stockpiles of WMD in Iraq!

I speak for myself Walter and that's extremely frightening for you isn't it!?

 

[MikeyDB]

Karrie

The day you go into Home Depot or Walmart ...pick a store it doesn't matter....and the number of Made in Canada Labels outnumbers the quantity of product produced by China and sweat-shop's run by America then perhaps you have something to argue.

 

[karrie]

Karrie

The day you go into Home Depot or Walmart ...pick a store it doesn't matter....and the number of Made in Canada Labels outnumbers the quantity of product produced by China and sweat-shop's run by America then perhaps you have something to argue.

considering I haven't argued anything, I find it odd that you'd try to tear it down. My only argument was that saying we have to pick either the US or Asia, is a false dichotomy. If change needed to happen, we could deepen both if we felt like it. We've got a lot of people and resources at hand if we choose to do something like that.

 

[MikeyDB]

Karrie

Canada used the Chinese to built the great Canadian Railway....we imprisoned Japanese and German citizens when that was the call made by Britain.....We sold-out our national resources and freedom to conduct business independently from the United States when the NAFTA "accord" was signed....we've followed the legacy of disenfranchising and victimizing natives and ethnic groups throughout this nation that we accepted as the "American way"...the underground railway notwithstanding...

We got sucked into the Afghan war and hide behind convenient "exchange programs that see our military involved in America's illegal war in Iraq! We signed away the Avro Arrow and although the allies during the second world war benefitted from the development of radar and a great many Canadian advancements...we all shed a tear when we watch Marion Wayne starring in "The Green Berets". No culture in Europe or anywhere else in the world for that matter has been the target of another's lust for greed and power as has Canada been at the hands of America. We have no choice Karrie, the horse is long gone and the barn is a pile of cooling ash....

 

[Zzarchov]

You know there is no mythical "Canada" that sits in a chair and decides our trade.

Its hundreds of thousands of managers and millions of consumers who make pro VS con arguements about keeping their families happy and healthy.

Thats it.

 

[karrie]

Karrie

Canada used the Chinese to built the great Canadian Railway....we imprisoned Japanese and German citizens when that was the call made by Britain.....We sold-out our national resources and freedom to conduct business independently from the United States when the NAFTA "accord" was signed....we've followed the legacy of disenfranchising and victimizing natives and ethnic groups throughout this nation that we accepted as the "American way"...the underground railway notwithstanding...

We got sucked into the Afghan war and hide behind convenient "exchange programs that see our military involved in America's illegal war in Iraq! We signed away the Avro Arrow and although the allies during the second world war benefitted from the development of radar and a great many Canadian advancements...we all shed a tear when we watch Marion Wayne starring in "The Green Berets". No culture in Europe or anywhere else in the world for that matter has been the target of another's lust for greed and power as has Canada been at the hands of America. We have no choice Karrie, the horse is long gone and the barn is a pile of cooling ash....

Ah, so you agree with me.

 

[Walter]

You've left little doubt that you're a closet American who's found that popular self-deception of saying "Oh those nasty Americans.." out of one side of your mouth while embracing their politics, their energy and foreign policies with a fervor unmatched by any but those few Americans sill believing Saddam Hussein is Al Qeada and there are those stockpiles of WMD in Iraq!

I said all that? Cool. In your previous post you said Canadians are pathetic and that's why I said, "Speak for yourself.' If you want to consider yourself pathetic go ahead, just don't call all Canadians that.

 

[MikeyDB]

Karrie

Certainly!

Canadians can't make choices...thinking would interfere with their training program...

I just laugh at nonsense like Zzarchov's post...yeah sure my friend...there wasn't a meeting in Quebec and there wasn't a meeting in Seattle and of course Canadians really really really give a **** about things like sweat-shops in third world nations....

 

[MikeyDB]

Walter

Ok let me get specific if you take offense at generalizations...

Anyone who buys the propaganda about AGW as mythology is pathetic. Anyone who believes there's a "difference" of any kind between a "Conservative" and a "Liberal" is pathetic. Anyone who voluntarily chooses to embrace lies deception and falsehoods as "truth" is pathetic.

 

[Walter]

Walter

Ok let me get specific if you take offense at generalizations...

Anyone who buys the propaganda about AGW as mythology is pathetic. Anyone who believes there's a "difference" of any kind between a "Conservative" and a "Liberal" is pathetic. Anyone who voluntarily chooses to embrace lies deception and falsehoods as "truth" is pathetic.

Much better.

 

[jimmoyer]

You know there is no mythical "Canada" that sits in a chair and decides our trade.

Its hundreds of thousands of managers and millions of consumers who make pro VS con arguements about keeping their families happy and healthy.

Thats it.
-------------------------------------------------------Zzarchov--------------------------------------------

Bears repeating.

 

[Zzarchov]

Edit: Not worth beating my head against a brick wall.

The sky is purple and up is down MikeyDB, you win the Internets. Congratulations.

 

[MikeyDB]

Jimmoyer

What percentage of "Canadian" corporations are subsidiaries of American conglomerates? What is the NAFTA agreement all about....cultivating a trade environment that profits corporations and business or securing natural national resources against pilliage and artificially inflating prices so "stockholders" can bank on unemployment that's produced by shipping jobs off-shore?

What control does the consumer have here or in the United States Jim? ZERO!

When the credo of consumption without consideration became the benchmark of "progress"...see Henry Ford or Standard Oil or the Rockerfellers or any globalization discussions were taking place...what representation was invited from any-body other than the wealthy corporations and mega-cartels of American business?

Stop living the fantasy Jim...you know as well as I do that Canadians gave up on trying to be anything else than junior Americans long long ago....

 

[EagleSmack]

Tell me something Loon... Do you want the United States to be an enemy of Canada? Is that the goal? Would that make some Canadians feel good about themselves? Do you feel so irrelevant that you just want to cut trade and trade exclusivly with China? Would you feel better being owned by China as China pretty much owns us economically. They will be happy to exploit you if you will let them. So why don't you crawl across the Pacific (metaphorically speaking) and offer China your leash. They will gladly take it with a smile and make you another dependant.