World Cup Thread

Blackleaf

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Oct 9, 2004
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Re: RE: World Cup Thread

I think not said:
Toro said:
Ain't gonna happen.

France 1 Brazil 0

If France wins Blackleaf will go into cardiac arrest.

EDIT: I hear someone collapsed in Britain 8O :lol:

Yeah, because the way they started this tournament it looked as though they were gonna be knocked out at the Group Stage like they were in 2002.

Who would have thought before this World Cup that France and Italy would be in the Final but Brazil, Argentina and England would only reach the Quarter Finals?
 

Blackleaf

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World Cup final

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kicking and screaming

Amy Lawrence
Sunday July 9, 2006
The Observer



They call it Tardelli's scream. It is the most beautiful image in the history of Italian football, the enduring reference point. Marco Tardelli screamed for 60 million compatriots after he scored the defining goal in the 1982 World Cup final. And it was not just any old scream. It was so Italian, as if it had been formed by the docks of Naples and polished at La Scala.

Last week, Fabio Grosso and Alessandro Del Piero revived the spirit of Tardelli's scream as their goals transformed the spectacle of Italy's semi-final against Germany into a rampaging triumph. Such moments of extreme emotion do not come along that often, even during a successful career. 'I was stupefied. In 20 years I never felt like that after a goal,' said Del Piero. Grosso struggled to believe that it was real. 'I didn't sleep that night. Well, how do you after something like that?'

Does Zinedine Zidane, so inscrutable with his emotions during his extraordinary World Cup journey, share the sentiment? Has his electric charge kept him up at night? What must he be thinking this morning as he wakes up to prepare for a football match for the last time?

France, too, have their icon. But while Zidane takes so many of the plaudits, he is not alone as an emotive image of French success. There is Lilian Thuram, too - the player who most vocally resists the anti-Bleus sentiment propagated by Jean-Marie Le Pen. A fabulous defender and an intelligent, soulful man, his two goals to tip the topsy-turvy semi-final against Croatia in 1998 arrived like a miracle - he has never scored for France before or since. 'What I loved most was Thuram's face when he scored his second goal,' recalls Marcel Desailly. 'It is the type of thing that makes me love my job, it is what gives me my passion for football.

'It's the World Cup, he's just got his team into the final, he turns around and takes a few steps towards his team-mates, looks out into the crowd and realises what has just happened to him. He lost consciousness. It's not like he passed out, but he was unconscious with his eyes open. He just didn't know where he was.'

Today Thuram will pull on the blue shirt of his country for the last time. While the cameras will track every nuance of Zidane's grand farewell, do not forget that France are also bidding adieu to other heroes. Thuram, with 120 caps, is what the French call their 'recordman'. The World Cup final, the occasion so stirring it inspires Tardelli screams and the thought of which put Thuram in a daze, is an extraordinary curtain call.

The way that both teams have, in four weeks, established new momentum, new character, makes them worthy finalists. Worthier than Germany and Portugal, the losing semi-finalists who were not sophisticated enough to go farther. Worthier than Brazil, who failed to live up to the adverts. Worthier than Argentina, who peaked too soon. Worthier, certainly, than England, whose physical and strategic preparation fell alarmingly short of the standards set by the last men standing.

Although France and Italy always had the capability, before the tournament began there was little inkling that Zidane would seduce the football world all over again, that France would stop being so frustrating, that old heads and new legs would find harmony. There was little enthusiasm for an Italy squad caught up in a scandal so rotten that most of the players have no idea where they will be playing next season. For 90 minutes in the Olympiastadion, now is all that matters. Not before or after.

The difference tonight, according to Italy's cunning coach Marcello Lippi, will be desire. 'We will see who has the most hunger,' he said. 'They have won a World Cup and a European Championship, while this generation of Italian players have only got close to that. We know what is on the table. We have the fork in our hands.'

The Italians are quietly hoping that, as well as being hungrier, they are fresher. They have fewer golden oldies and have rotated much more frequently during the competition. The Azzurri have used 21 of their squad of 23 - only the two reserve goalkeepers are yet to play - and it is not as if they have had the luxury of calling in reserves to give key players a breather. Every substitution has been necessary. And every substitute has delivered.

Lippi has managed his squad exceptionally. Italy's defensive power is well documented (and how resiliently they responded to injuries), but where he was particularly shrewd was in selecting six attackers for the squad. Lippi knows that he does not have a modern-day Paolo Rossi, so he gave himself options. All six have scored.

It has been such a tremendous team effort, the Italians are still looking for a pin-up hero - a Rossi or Roberto Baggio. Gianluigi Buffon is closing in on a tournament record of minutes without conceding a goal. Fabio Cannavaro has been immense leading the defence and will win his hundredth cap. Gennaro Gattuso is loved for his indefatigable battling. Andrea Pirlo is a serious rival to Zidane in the playmaker stakes. But even if Italy triumph, this will not necessarily be remembered as Buffon's World Cup, or Cannavaro's, or Gattuso's, or Pirlo's. It will be Lippi's World Cup.

He has had to improvise constantly. He has employed five formations and six starting line-ups. Unflappable. Not all Italians supported his appointment two years ago, but there is now unity. Now they wait, anxiously, to see if he can end his run of losing finals. Lippi fell at the last in four out of five European finals with Juventus.

Not surprising, then, to hear fighting talk as his team arrived in Berlin. 'I absolutely refuse this attitude of "however it goes it will be a great occasion" and all the rest,' Lippi rapped. 'How many times in your life do you get to win the World Cup? We will be furious if we lose.'

Lippi may have had his furies in the past, but he is also the man who has won almost everything - five Italian league titles and one Champions League top an imposing CV. Raymond Domenech, however, has won nothing.

Does the France coach envy the way Lippi has absolute control over his players? Despite the glowing references of Willy Sagnol, there remains ambivalence about Domenech's command.

Is he leading the players or are the players leading him? Although he has been credited with bonding a divided squad, it was interesting to observe how the senior players reacted to the problems caused by Luis Figo and Cristiano Ronaldo as their semi-final got under way. Zidane, Thuram and Patrick Vieira talked to each other and redirected the team, to find a solution. Not once did they look to Domenech for advice on tactical adjustments.

Arsene Wenger, who has watched all his country's displays in Germany, salutes the experienced men. 'This team now, they have gone with three different coaches to three major finals. Domenech has done a good job, but I believe this group of players is exceptional.'

Those who know him well argue that Domenech is very smart and perhaps his cleverest move has been to let this team do the job on the pitch, while taking care of the talking and organisation off it.

It has taken him a while to feel at ease in this job. As a player he was a renowned hard man - on his debut for Strasbourg he claimed to have broken an opponent's leg even though one of his team-mates had been the offender, because he thought it would give him an instant reputation.

As a coach, he worked for the French federation with junior teams for more than a decade but turned up for interview when the senior-team position became vacant in 2002 wearing a T-shirt. By 2004, suitably advised by his mentor, Aime Jacquet, he had smartened up his act and arrived in collar and tie.

During the early stages of this World Cup it seemed that Domenech was having a Lemerre - the pressure visibly gnawing away at his composure and bonhomie as it had with Roger Lemerre in 2002. What is clear is that Domenech was disliked by the senior players, the press and the public until midway through this campaign. After France set out with uninspiring draws against Switzerland and South Korea, a quarter of a million fans replied to a poll in the newspaper L'Equipe on the subject of whether France would reach the final - 88 per cent answered 'Non'.

After the resurrection of the team against Spain, there was such a dramatic swing, 90 per cent changed to 'Oui'. It is amazing what winning matches can do.

And that is why France and Italy arrive in Berlin as such compelling stories. Both flirted with catastrophe but found the strength to pursue happiness. Now the France players think Domenech has balls. They respect him. The fact is, France have not lost a competitive match under him.

This has the air of immovable object versus immovable object. Italy have yet to concede a goal scored by a foreign body (only Cristian Zaccardo's slice passed Buffon against the United States). France are only marginally more yielding.

Do Italy's attacking options give them the edge? 'Italy have more variation going forward than any team we have played, even more than Brazil,' says Wenger. 'During the game they have a lot of weapons. They can change the game.' One surprise weapon could be the return of Daniele De Rossi after serving a four-match suspension for a viciously jabbed elbow. He may play a part because he is particularly strong in the air. It has not gone unnoticed that France won their past two knockout games with a set piece.

Italy will find it difficult to suppress the impulse of revenge, considering how France have made them suffer in recent meetings. The European Championship final in 2000 remains one of their most abject memories. Del Piero should have killed off a game in which Italy excelled before France had time to recover. Not to be.

The goal Italy did score that day, incidentally, was made by a well-crafted cross from Gianluca Pessotto. Today Pessotto is recovering in hospital after a fall from a top floor of Juventus's offices. His plight, added to the Serie A investigation, has put the Azzurri under tremendous strain.

For Italy, this final offers redemption from the sadness, the fear and loathing, back home. A sport riddled with corruption means the players have been tarred with the brush that has swept so many crooked administrators from positions of power. This is the only way for calcio to save face and save faith. It is their last chance, against Zidane's last dance.

The fans' verdict

Mafia stereotypes whip up Italian passion - but Zizou won't roll over

Luca Frazzi: Italy fan

We fully deserve to be in this final, especially after the way we performed against Germany. We arrived after a press campaign full of ridiculous stereotypes and slurs about pizza and the Mafia. The team were angry and that showed in the passion of the semi. I thought both teams looked very tired in the other semi, especially France, so we'll see today how it'll affect them. I think we're the favourites now, but only just. The only thing I'm really worried about is the enthusiasm, the overconfidence. Here in Italy the press campaign is too strong and too triumphant. Too many people believe we're already world champions. Too many, too many...

Mathieu Bournazel: France fan

Our last game of the tournament will certainly be the hardest. We're going to have to be much stronger in midfield than we were against Portugal to stand a chance. The Italians still haven't got over the Euro 2000 final and all the talk is of revenge: they seem very sure of success. As were Spain and Brazil. Zidane will not hear of it, this is his grand finale. The team have been living by a motto this World Cup, 'On vit ensemble, on meurt ensemble' (living together, dying together). They will be sweating blood to win this match. It's the least they'll have to do bring back the cup.
 

Blackleaf

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"Sporting Odds" make Italy 7/10 favourites to win the world's biggest sporting competition, with France on offer at 21/20.
 

Kreskin

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Feb 23, 2006
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If hockey can have 2 refs and 2 linesman working on a postage stamp called ice, why can't they have about 4 refs in soccer. Then they could clearly see the swan dives and make the right calls.
 

I think not

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Re: RE: World Cup Thread

Blackleaf said:
I think not said:
Toro said:
Ain't gonna happen.

France 1 Brazil 0

If France wins Blackleaf will go into cardiac arrest.

EDIT: I hear someone collapsed in Britain 8O :lol:

Yeah, because the way they started this tournament it looked as though they were gonna be knocked out at the Group Stage like they were in 2002.

Who would have thought before this World Cup that France and Italy would be in the Final but Brazil, Argentina and England would only reach the Quarter Finals?

I call it devine intervention, sometimes people need their egos deflated. :D
 

Daz_Hockey

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Nov 21, 2005
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The Azzuri deserved that, they played well, took their penalties sublimely......


but why oh why would any one in their final game, at a world cup final, decide premedativly to do something which was obviously a strait red-card offense....what an idiot, what a career ruined.

Well done Italy......

I refuse to speak the name of the idiot :p
 

Blackleaf

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Sacre bleu. Ohh la la.


Italy celebrate after Materazzi (centre) scores directly from a corner to make it 1-1.


He was later headbutted by Zinedine Zidane in the chest. Zidane's international career ends in disgrace. This morning, he was France's hero. Now he's the villain.


Then the Italians go on to lift the World Cup and are now the most successful European nation in international football.
 

Kreskin

Doctor of Thinkology
Feb 23, 2006
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Zidane's incident had no effect on the result, other than an Italian player got to hit the turf without "simulating" a fall.
 

Toro

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May 24, 2005
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Congratulations to Italy.

I thought France was the better team. I can't remember a single chance Italy had during the run of play. Of course, they looked like they were going to score on every dead ball situation.

Wasn't a bad game though.
 

glossprincess

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Feb 5, 2006
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Congrats to Italy. Shame for France though, they played a better game.

I just hope France is mature enough not to blame Zidane for their loss. Hes an idiot and its a very very sad way to end his career but hes not solely to blame for the Italians winning.
 

Blackleaf

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Re: RE: World Cup Thread

Toro said:
Congratulations to Italy.

I can't remember a single chance Italy had during the run of play. .

What about the goal?

France's only goal came from a penalty - and awarding that penalty was a dubious decision.

And what about nearly every corner that Italy had in the first half? The Italians were by far the better team in the first half, and looked as though they would score from every single corner that they took. Just 25 minutes or so after the Italians scored from a corner, they headed another ball from the corner straight onto the post.
 

Blackleaf

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The Times July 10, 2006


King Zizou lifts them all up - only to knock them down
By Charles Bremner in Paris

After an awful year Zinédine Zidane had given France back some pride. That was until last night


HUNDREDS of thousands of supporters gathered in sorrow on the Champs Elysées last night as France tried to make the best of a World Cup final that restored Gallic morale but ended in defeat and the disgrace of Zinédine Zidane, the national hero.

President Chirac led the attempt to put the best gloss on a failure that was symbolised by Zidane’s expulsion 20 minutes into extra time after he head-butted an Italian player.

The red card for the captain and symbol of France’s moral revival created a sense of disbelief. “I don’t know what happened, but I would like to express admiration for the man who brought honour to sport and honour to France,” said M Chirac, who was in Berlin to watch the agonising defeat of his national team in a penalty shootout.

The President and French commentators were unanimous in forgiving Zidane, 34, the error that stained his last moments before retirement from professional football.

However, the tall, soft- spoken son of Algerian immigrants, did not turn up with the rest of the team to receive the runners-up award.

“Zizou, on t’aime”, said the message projected on the Arc du Triomphe, at the head of the Champs Elysées. It alternated with another message: “Merci les Bleus, vous restez nos heros”. (Thank you, the blues. You are still our heroes.)

Supporters in Paris were convinced that the Italians had inflicted some unspeakable insult against Zidane for him to have reacted with such violence.

Amid the disappointment, there was a strong feeling that, despite the defeat, Zidane and his men had pulled France out of its cycle of gloom over the past few years. Raymond Domenech, the French coach, insisted: “We didn’t lose. Penalty shots are the same thing as a draw.”

The sense of denial was shared among commentators and supporters who insisted that the state of grace brought about by the unexpected arrival in the World Cup final would endure the defeat. “A month ago, no one would have believed that we could get to the final and it was largely thanks to Zizou,” said the commentator on TF1. After a horrible year that included race riots and the loss of the 2012 Olympics to London, the arrival of les Bleus in the final has dragged the country from gloom to euphoria.

The belief that France can get something right has also been fuelled by the victory of Amélie Mauresmo at Wimbledon on Saturday and by Bruno Peyron, who on Thursday shaved nine hours off the four days and 17 hour record for sailing across the Atlantic.

Praise for Zidane had verged on idolatry with commentators calling him “Le Dieu”. Le Monde, the most sober newspaper in France, said: “We shall miss his elegance, his brilliant footwork and the subtlety of this footballing man.”

Zidane, who was born and raised in the poor housing estates of Marseilles, is an icon of Gallic achievement.

But, amid the exaltation of a second French World Cup final in eight years, he has also served to remind France of its failure to bring into the mainstream the children of immigrants from its former colonies.

Unlike in 1998, when the World Cup victory of France’s multi-ethnic team was celebrated as proof that the Republic had embraced its Arab and black citizens as equals, the euphoria of 2006 has tweaked a guilty conscience.

Four years after the fête of 1998, Jean-Marie Le Pen, of the National Front, came second to Jacques Chirac in the presidential elections, and last autumn hundreds of thousands of non-white French rampaged on the estates where the immigrants have been parked since the 1960s. Zidane and half the team last night came from those estates, where the Tricolour flies alongside the Algerian flag.

Zizou always refuses to talk politics, but other members of the team, notably Lilian Thuram, have used their celebrity as a platform for condemning discrimination and the failure of integration.

When M Le Pen repeated this year his attacks on a team he deems to be insufficiently French, Thuram, who grew up in the French island of Guadeloupe, said: “Long live France — not the one he wants, but the real one. Le Pen is not aware that there are black, blond and brown French people.” Residents of the ghettos say that nothing changed after the 1998 cheering about racial harmony.

Nevertheless, the scent of victory has applied a healthy jolt to a country that has been wallowing in gloom. Some pundits believe that the achievement of reaching the final could kick the country out of its losing mentality and help to restart the sputtering economy.


timesonline.co.uk
 

Blackleaf

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Fans fill Roman arena to salute modern gladiators

· Roar in Circus Maximus unheard since classical era
· Paris ponders reason for headbutt folly by hero

John Hooper in Rome and Angelique Chrisafis in Paris
Monday July 10, 2006
The Guardian



Italian fans celebrate in front of the coliseum in Rome. Photograph: Filippo Monteforte/AFP/Getty



Under a full moon in a sky brushed with wispy clouds, three huge Fabio Grossos ran to the spot, kicked, scored and set off a roar in the Circus Maximus the like of which may not have been heard since classical times. Within minutes, the ancient arena was thick with smoke and ablaze with flares in the red, green and white of the tricolore. Some in the crowd were already flooding out towards the Piazza Venezia to carry on the celebrations in front of the monument to unification.

Delirious fans drove up and down the Lungotevere, the road on either side of the Tiber, honking their horns as passengers hung out of the windows flourishing Italian flags. The Via del Corso, which runs through the centre of the city, was packed with chanting fans, some on foot, others weaving perilously through the crowd on scooters.

"I'm so excited I'm giving up my university exams. I'm not going in tomorrow," said Leonardo Tersigni from Sora, south of Rome, as thousands poured into the centre. "Italy deserved this win. The Germans had a good team but it was too young. The French had a good team but it was too old. The Italians got it just right." A young woman passing by who did not want to give her name said: "The best thing about this was, not just that we won, but that we won against the French."

In the days when the oldest and biggest of Rome's ancient arenas was used for chariot racing, it could supposedly hold 300,000 people. The police estimated that at least half as many packed in last night night to watch the World Cup final under the ruins on the Palatine hill. The crowd included a man on a giant tricycle with a teddy bear strapped to the front, a Franciscan friar accompanied by two nuns, and tens upon tens of thousands of mainly young supporters from the working-class suburbs of Rome.

Grosso's kick sent thousands of plastic water bottles soaring into the air. Just minutes earlier, though, many were hurled towards the screens as the crowd was shown a replay of the other moment of real drama of the event - Zinedine Zidane's headbutt on the chest of Marco Materazzi.

There has not been much to celebrate in Italy of late. The country emerged divided from an acrimonious general election in April. Italian football is reeling from a match-fixing scandal involving four top clubs. The economy is almost at a standstill and the new centre-left government is telling Italians the only way to move forward is by accepting painful sacrifices. Last night's victory could ease the pain.

The mood in Paris was dejection coupled with a sense that the ageing team had done as much as could be expected. Even president Jacques Chirac, said the team had made the country proud. He reserved his fondest words for Zidane, "a man who incarnated the most beautiful values of sport and the biggest human qualities you can imagine and was an honour to French sport and simply an honour to France."

At Le Monarch bar behind the Champs-Elysées there was a stunned silence after the final Italian penalty hit the back of the net. Then questions turned to why France's national hero had headbutted his opponent and been sent off. "There has got to be an explanation, it could have been a racist taunt," said Patrick, who had come from the suburbs. "I'm sad for the team and for what the media will do to them. But on the estates in the suburbs, everyone is behind them."

Thousands of police remained on the streets of Paris and other cities last night to prevent a repeat of the chaos after France's semi-final success last week in which six people died. More than 130 cars were burnt.

guardian.co.uk
 

lo2

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Toro said:
lo2 said:
You lot obviously do not really know what Football is about (though many of you think)

lo2

I've played, coached, refereed, administered and attended 2 world cups.

If you're going to condescend, go away.

OK then please show it by writing something that makes sense.

OK?